Adrenals, Thyroid, And Sex Hormones In MCAS

Marcelle Pick, NP

Thank you for having me. I love doing this. This is my favorite thing to do.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

And so we’re talking about, a lot of people be like, “Hey, why are you talking to a women’s health expert when we’re talking about mast cell activation syndrome?” And so also part of this is like a little bit of it’s like, it’s not just like women’s hormones. It’s kind of like the hormones that we collectively have together, so maybe you could tell us a little bit about where you came from and how you got really interested in hormones in general, then we can dive into how this plays a role in everyday life and mast cell activation.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Sure, so I grew up in Australia, actually in the Outback and I know it’s not amazing and you know didn’t know how to flush a toilet till I was 11 and you know, all that kind of good stuff. We didn’t have any cars and I had a very different life, but from a very, very young age, I was very, very aware that I wanted to do healthcare, and I came to America knowing that I had a mission, have no idea where it came from, have no idea at all, but it’s been deep within my soul to make a difference, not only for women’s health, but in healthcare in general. And I’ve always been motivated as we were when we started in 1985. It was the only, the first all women’s clinic in the United States, so we had to get all kinds of legal counsel and all kinds of stuff cause we had different degrees. 

Our goal was to teach women how to be their own midwives about their healthcare, and to this day, it is something that people really want, especially women want, to know, I wanna learn about me and I wanna understand, is it me or my hormones, which is actually the name of one of my books because so many women would come in saying, “I just feel so off and I don’t know what’s wrong with me. Can you help?” And I then started to do a deep dive into hormones and started becoming involved with the Institute of Functional Medicine and became a faculty member, wanting to learn as much as I could about how I could help women feel amazing, look amazing, feel amazing, have energy and not have that up and down either when they were having periods or when they were in perimenopause and menopause. So it’s been an inspiration for me to see women change and have their lives come back.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

It’s so wild to me cause it’s like, this is kind of the story I expect to hear, cause I went to medical school in Biddeford, Maine and so Women To Women is like the big thing it’s just like right up the road, and it’s like, you know, you go to Maine, and you’re like nothing’s going on, and you guys are like at the forefront of, not only women’s healthcare, but functional medicine, you know, so I’m almost in awe and I mean, I know we talk all the time, but it’s like, it’s so great to hear. What’s the scoop with hormones? I mean, cause it’s like, everybody’s a hormone expert. We all have hormones, but really when you’re teaching people to kind of be the midwives of their own healthcare and stuff, what are they looking for, and what’s the role of things like stress, and other things in our lives and our hormones?

Marcelle Pick, NP

Well, you know, one of the things that I say to people all the time is that, if we’re looking at hormonal imbalance, which many people do experience, the thing we have to address first is the adrenals and stress. You know, adrenals trump thyroid, and adrenals trump hormones, so if you have an adrenal system that’s out of whack, no matter how much you try to play with the hormones, if you don’t get that balanced first, then you’re in trouble, and a little bit of kind of biochemistry. Our cholesterol levels, you know, are what they are, but they make estrogen, progesterone, testosterone, and DHEA. If we have too much stress, it will get bypassed and it will go to cortisol, cause we can’t live without cortisol. We can live without our hormones. As much as people might wanna go, “I can’t, I can’t, I can’t,” yes you can, and so it’s imperative for us to know what our adrenal function is, and you know, these days, Tom, our world is so stressful.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Oh my God.

Marcelle Pick, NP

You know, what’s going on with food supplies and we can’t get enough people, and the pandemic, and it’s just, people are so overwhelmed, so I’m seeing it more now in my practice than ever before is that adrenal dysfunction, and I oftentimes don’t know what I’m gonna see because I will do a test and it’s like, “Oh, that’s a surprise. I thought she was gonna be really low and she’s really high,” and then we can use lifestyle management to make a difference, but here’s the thing that’s so interesting, and that is that anytime we have that foundation of disruption, it absolutely can activate mast cell issues, and I think sometimes we don’t think of that, but stress absolutely can really kind of coerce the system to be more and more out of balance, and the thing that we we see the most is when we have a hormone dysregulation, progesterone levels go down and we need that orchestra. 

We need that orchestra, and if we don’t have that balance, progesterone, for example, in someone that’s having periods may cause PMS. They might cause night sweats. They might cause mood swings, horrible sense of kind of disorientation to their body. Then as they get to the perimenopausal time, they’re feeling like somebody’s taken over my body. “I don’t have a sense of stability. I’m gaining weight, and I’m really feeling awful, and then I’ve got a rash that I didn’t have before, or I’m reacting to foods that I never did before. What’s going on?” And then we see that really significantly in menopause, and estrogen’s a piece to that puzzle cause higher estrogen levels can activate more of that mast cell problem. Progesterone can kind of calm it down, but a lot of times the things that I said is progesterone levels go down first, and you don’t have that nice orchestra then that that’s balance.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

And so then you’re also, I mean, what have you seen, and does the ratio matter? Like let’s say your absolute numbers are okay, whatever that means, but lower progesterone, higher estrogen, but in the normal range. I mean, does that even play the role?

Marcelle Pick, NP

Oh my God, absolutely, and we call that estrogen dominance, and I really don’t like that word cause it isn’t that the estrogen’s really dominated. It’s just out of proportion to progesterone, and the thing that I think a lot of people that are hormone experts are not looking at, we have to look at the whole orchestra, which is estrogen levels, progesterone levels, DHEA levels. I mean, what you’ll see oftentimes when you see the most mast cell activation is when the adrenal have just plummeted out and then it’s not working anymore. DHEA levels are very low, and their hormones may be up and down. Estrogen might be high. Progesterone’s low and DHEA is low, and oftentimes those are the people that have very low testosterone levels, so they’re losing muscle. They’re not having the stamina and the energy and DHEA.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Vitality, virility.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Huge, huge, huge. My get up and go is get up and gone, and that’s one of the things that a lot of people will say is like, “Absolutely, you don’t feel like yourself at all.” So when I see people in my office, I’m gonna be looking at all those pieces to the equation because it is something that’s ginormous as well as the gut microbiome. I mean, it’s all connected. The matrix is all these pieces to the puzzle and we have to figure out what started first so we can help people.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

So how do we go about that, cause I mean, I know you’re saying the adrenals are such a key player here, but then you’re like, “Oh, but there’s the gut and there’s this and there’s that.” I mean, is it like we should all be starting at adrenals or is it like that’s just sort of like a common variable, but maybe it is gut predominant in somebody else or?

Marcelle Pick, NP

You know, it’s interesting cause I think it oftentimes is a combination of both those things. When you have adrenal issues, you almost always have gut issues too because of the relationship between the gut microbiome and cortisol. So I oftentimes will do an adrenal profile. I might do a quiz on somebody, but one of the things about adrenals for me is I’ve been wrong more often than I’ve been right, and I can pretty much, without even perhaps doing a stool test, I can get a sense about what’s going on, but the adrenals is much harder for me because sometimes it’s up and down at places and I’m gonna intervene in a different way. But if I’m really wanting to work somebody up, I’ll do a stool test and I’ll do an adrenal profile and then I’ll kind of calm that system down and then perhaps do the hormone panel because the hormone’s gonna be really irregular at the point with the stress.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Yeah, so you’re making sure that the adrenals are dialed before you’re kind of diving down the sex hormone route. Are you doing salivary hormone testing or?

Marcelle Pick, NP

The only one I’ll ever do. The problem because, if I have a suspicion for Addison or Cushings, of course I’ll do blood work, but most of the time, as you know, it’s seldom that, it’s more often, I wanna know what their cortisol level’s throughout the day. Normally it should be high in the morning and low at night, but do they have the up and down? Do they have the flat line, or do they have the up all day long? And that’s a difference in terms of what I’m gonna intervene with and the recommendations.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Cool.

Marcelle Pick, NP

And as a culture, I think we say, “Well, just decrease your stress.” Well, that’s ridiculous, and a lot of times we have historical stress that comes from our own childhood. That contributes to the way we respond in the world, and I’m a crazy person when it comes to, if we don’t deal with our stories, our stories will deal with us. And we have to be mindful of kind of looking at that piece and then working on the other parts of how can I have a life in which I feel a little bit more balanced.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

So, this comes up so much in chronic illness and it sounds like, and I mean, I know we both kind of think this way, but to me it’s almost like, this story is this stuff that allows you to live your life now and to live optimally, or if you don’t address certain parts of it, that’s where we go down this other path. So I mean, what’s the mechanism of engagement that you’re using cause it’s like, everybody’s got a story and everybody’s got positive and negative stress in their lives.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Totally. So I think the first part is understanding that there is a relationship and that if you are, you know, I grew up with a father, both my parents were Holocaust survivors, and my father was a psychologist, and he was somebody that kept a lot of emotion inside, but he always looked rageful. Never said anything, and I became a perfectionist and good girl. So later in my life, that’s gonna play out in such a behavior. It’s impossible to be perfect all the time. And it’s impossible to expect yourself of that. So that in and of itself can increase cortisol levels. So I think the first step for people is to understand that we’re human and that we have things that we respond to, but that response later in life may not be serving you anymore and maybe contributing to more cortisol, more inflammation, more problems in perimenopause or menopause and more mass cell activation, if that happens to be the rootin, which is manifesting itself.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Yeah. You know, it’s interesting cause Beth and I talk. I’ve heard so many people talk about mass cells and I was like, it was so cool to get to work with Beth and to be able to do this with you obviously too, because she talks about like the mass cells as being like sentinels, right? And so they’re on guard. The problem is they’re always on guard. And when I hear you talking about cortisol and the pattern, and maybe we can dive in this a little more, it’s not so much that cortisol’s good or bad it’s that it needs to be utilized properly at the right times. And so.

Marcelle Pick, NP

We can’t live without cortisol. You know, we are meant to have some stress in our lives. The problem is that if we use the example of, you know, zebras don’t get ulcers, the notion is, is zebras out in the field. It gets chased by, you know, a lion or tiger, whatever. And it goes back to feeding in that same field. Well we, oh my God, it almost got me and what am I gonna do? I think I had the right colors on or the right things. I didn’t need the right food. What’s the pro… I mean all day. And that’s what causes that increased cortisol production. And ultimately if there’s too much of that and you’re not sleeping properly, you perhaps are not eating properly as well. And then we’ve got this, you know, issue about hormonal dysfunction. Perhaps we’ve got a little bit of PMs and it gets much worse because of that constant need for cortisol. And ultimately what goes up must come down. So we’ve got too much, too much, too much, too much, then there’s not enough reserve to carry on. But yeah, we have to have a little stress we’d be in, our lives would be terribly boring if we didn’t have a little, the problem is right now, it’s over drive. And for women, we are not great at self-care. So we’re taking care of our partners, our children, our job, our family, our parents, our girlfriend, you know, our, all of that. And it’s like, oh, vitamins, I forgot to take ’em today. Oh, water. Oh, oh, oh, just a minute. The first time, you know?

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Right.

Marcelle Pick, NP

That’s the place that they also have to change because we really are wonderful multitaskers. We’re not so good at doing, wait, wait, wait just a minute. I gotta take,

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Put me first.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Hands down.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

I think that in my experience with chronic illness, and I’m also speaking from a guy’s perspective, but I will say that lack of being willing to, being able to, or willing to receive for oneself and putting oneself first is a big thing. And I spent years saying I put myself first. What really meant was I did a whole bunch of things that looked like I was focusing on me, but I was really just diverting from actually giving myself what I really needed. And it wasn’t until, you know, you can physically get so much better, but you can’t, your body can’t really totally regulate until you focus, you know, on really receiving it yourself so that you can then give it to other people. Like I can’t be present for you today if a hundred percent, if I can’t first be present for myself.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Well, I say that to patients all the time. If you have a watering can and you watering your plants may look gorgeous, it’s wonderful. And it’s like so exciting at some point that can needs to be refilled. And we have to do that for ourselves. Cause we can only give what we have available. And if we don’t, we get resentful and it gets difficult. And then cortisol goes up and we’ve got inflammation, we’ve got mast cell activation. So yeah, all of that is, is really a piece to the puzzle.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

So, and the other thing you started with a while, you know, at the beginning is you’re talking about cholesterol and to me cholesterol’s got like a bad wrap and what do we need to know about cholesterol for, to feed into this hole? Cause I see this cascade of hormones you’re talking about the cortisol and the progesterone and all these other things, but what do we need to know? Because, so we can set the record straight on how this plays a role in health. And then in mast cells.

Marcelle Pick, NP

It was sad because it’s gotten such a bad rep. You know, if you have it over 200, oh my God, you’re gonna be, you know, getting bad of a heart attack tomorrow. Well, we also know if we look at the research that the initial studies that were done were actually somewhat flawed and it’s showed actually that inflammation was the name of the game, much more so than high cholesterol. And cholesterol is our mother hormone. It feeds estrogen, progesterone, testosterone, and DHA. A even as we’re older. Now do we have as much hor in terms of the hormonal, you know, regulation? No, of course not. It’s lower. And it’s perhaps meant to be that way, unless you go on hormone replacement therapy, but it’s gotten a really bad rap. And I think a lot of people are on, you know, medications for many different reasons. And one of them might be that they find when they’re on the stat medication that they hormones are, are they feel just very different. They don’t feel women in particular will say to me, I just don’t feel sensual anymore. I don’t know what happened. It’s just like, I’m not the same as I used to be. So it’s finding balance cause we can change it with, nutrients and dietary changes. Most of the time.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

It’s so interesting to me because, we give people medicines to, achieve a number that has nothing to do with how we feel, but it makes other people feel better. It’s like kind of like the typical modern medicine is, give responsibility away and also give away like your actual health. And it’s like, because like, I see a lot of men in particular who you put ’em on the statin, the next thing you know, they have erectile dysfunction and they have no libido.

Marcelle Pick, NP

What surprise. Right? Exactly. And I think the part that’s most empowering for me when I do these kinds of summits is helping people understand that we truly, truly have the capability to be healthy, vital sexual sensual into our nineties. But we let things sabotage us, you know, from the world around us, to the stress, to the inability, to take, take care of ourselves, to not understanding how to have a, an orchestra of hormones that are working and the food that we eat, the thoughts that we think, because a lot of times now people’s thinking is just so off, you know, I’m getting older. Oh my gosh. It’s like, wow, where did you get that from? Because we have so much now in the world of artificial intelligence, that’s helping us see, oh no, we can, we can change that. We can really re correct that. And it’s actually a very interesting time to be alive at the same time that it’s also very stressful.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Right. I think for anyone who gets to meet you in person, you’re like, it’s amazing. Like I have, like, I could make maybe some fictitious guess on how old you may be. And you may have even told me one day, but it’s like, you are like the most vitally alive person I think I’ve ever hung out with. Right. It’s like, so like everyone is your, what Marcelle saying is like, she lives this way. She’s a role model in this. And you know, you said something which I think is like really important is like, it’s not, you know, it’s about remaining active and vital seeing the possibilities in your life. You mentioned something that I thought was super cool because I think it plays a role in a lot of stress management, but also other roles in our lives. But you talk about sexuality and even like being sexual and I’m assuming sexually active well beyond what, you know, some other people may say like what’s going on there and like, what’s, what’s good about keeping it going and what’s bad about not keeping it going or.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Well, I think you have to decide for yourself what you’re looking for. I mean, we’re sensual sexual beings. I mean, we, if you look at animal, the animal world, they just, you know, that that’s part of their, their world. And I think from my perspective, what I’ve seen in my practice is a lot of women just shut it off for many different reasons. And I think it’s unfortunate because I think if you really are vital in who you are and taking care of yourself and the ways that we’ve already talked about that you can be in a wonderful sexual relationship into your eighties. I mean, I had patients that, you know, is it okay? I’m like, are you kidding me? Of course it’s OK. What are you gotta break? I mean, I had an 80 year old come in and say, can I, can I do it every day? I’m like, yeah, go for it. I think as a culture, it’s kind of like, well, you know, you’re getting older and you know, if you have the same partner, it’s like maybe spice it up a little bit. I mean, it, it depends on what you’re looking for and what you’re wanting, cuz there’s no right or wrong, but it is possible to be in the position in which you say, oh yeah.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

It’s so interesting because like it is possible. And there’s certainly maybe some different things that may happen, like after menopause, you know? And certainly as a guy, I’m probably, you know, there’s probably some, it may be a slightly easier, but at the same time, I notice men too. It’s like.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Absolutely. And you know, it’s sad, but I think what happens is that we kind of have bought the, you know, we drank Kool-Aid I did many people did, which is, you know, you’re getting older and just kind of what happens and you know, you’ve got knee replacement or you’ve got this, you’ve got that. It’s like, okay, so you get your knee replaced and then you move on and then.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Cool. Wasn’t that the point of getting the knee replacement? So you could keep going.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Exactly. I think as a culture, we don’t talk about that. And you know, the book by Tony Robbins life force, that’s the whole concept of the book is, are you kidding? This is he’s 62. This is just the beginning for me. You know, I’ve got a lot more life in me.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Yeah. So, I mean like what’s the deal with like this middle aged thing, right? Like I think it’s this like 45 to 65. I mean, if you think about it 65, if that’s the middle, that means you’re gonna live to 130. So 62 is not really.

Marcelle Pick, NP

No. And you know, the real reality for many of my contemporaries, I’m a ballroom dancer. So I dance a lot is that we’re very, very active. And what used to be probably 60, you know, back in the day is really what we’re seeing. 60 year olds look like they’re 40 and they behave like they’re 40. So we’ve got so much life ahead of us, but also a lot of it’s mindset, you know? And, and you know, we talk about that. You and I together, which is as you think, so goes your life. If you’re continually saying, I don’t know how much longer I’ve got, you know, I’ve got more, more years behind me than I have ahead of me. And it’s like, that’s probably not the best attitude. And we also know about gratitude and what a difference that makes with mindset. But here’s the part that’s so interesting is that also changes our biochemistry. And we know enough now that as our thoughts change, our cortisol changes, the mast cell activation goes down and it’s more quiescent. Those are very, very powerful things. Am I saying every day? Just think I’m gonna get better. I’m gonna get better. No, it takes, it’s a little bit more complicated than that, but it is a reality.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

It is interesting cause it is, you know, it is this reality that, you know, we look at like what we think about, we bring about as sort of a catch phrase. And what I think is so interesting is, and the way you address these things is I look at it. So many of my people want like these little, like they love the gadgets and the meters and the, this and the, that, and the science, but heart rate variability is something that we look at so much. If it’s high, we’re resilient to stress, we can handle it. We tend to be happier, healthier, better immune function. And if it’s low, we’re aging or we’re depleted, and this is in that low heart rate, variability people, we also see increased mast cell activation because, they can’t turn it off. It’s not, not that it shouldn’t be, so what’s going on like this, this whole thing, bringing it together. It’s like, it’s like not, we need some, but we don’t need it on all the time. I mean, you know, what are you seeing between sort of the mindset and the cortisol response and the gut health and the mast cells.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Yeah, I mean, you know, everybody has a little bit different area that it’s more of a problem. You know, I might see somebody with huge. I mean, I see a lot of people with parasites and a lot of worms, you know, when I do stool testing, it’s amazing to me. And once we get that corrected, we talk about nutrition and we talk about feeding ourselves, but feeding ourselves makes food and emotions. And also having joy in your life. If you’re not happy with what you’re doing, then go figure it out, go find something else out to do that you really love. And you know, is it meditation for you? You know, is it, is it something that you, you know, are missing in your life and being willing to go inside and kind of ask them questions because we really can change our mindset to be happy every day. And then that also helps cortisol, which helps the balance of the hormones as well. So it’s all connected. 

And I think the part that makes me so sad is that the way medicine is gone now is you go in for an appointment, you get a diagnosis, you get a treatment, it’s usually medication and you’re not being the whole person isn’t, we’re not listening to them. Years ago, I had somebody with insomnia and I had enough kind of understanding to go deep inside and say, so when did this start? You know, when did this start? She was only 24. And she, it started when she was 14 and that’s when her father came into her room. And it, so it’s, it’s just asking the questions. Well, I wouldn’t wanna sleep either. Thank you very much. I mean, it would scare the heck out of me. No wonder couldn’t sleep, but it’s asking the deeper questions cuz we all have those pieces, but we can heal them. That’s the part that’s so great is we don’t have to wallow in for me, it’s more, you know, how is life doing this for me instead of to me. And that’s a whole different perspective without blaming yourself, getting into a place saying, okay, how it changes.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Yeah. It’s like so much of it. Like when I, when I hear that story of that young girl, like she has a, a perfect protective mechanism that was perfect and protective in the moment or maybe not perfect, but it, it was there for a reason at the moment. But now maybe 10 years later, or 20 years later, we don’t need the same protective mechanism.

Marcelle Pick, NP

And we can heal from that. I mean, there’s so many people doing this work online also for trauma work. There’s a woman whose name is Amy There’s debt go, you know, she’s got a program online as well. And then we also know Annie hopper in Canada. So we don’t have to stay with those places anymore. We’ve got so many different options, emotional freedom technique, tapping meditation, you know, there’s so many options that we have that really allows people to heal and we never have to stay in that place. We just don’t no matter what the trauma, no matter what the problem we can get out, no matter how much stress you have, we can still understand it in a different way and get happy.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Right. It’s like, and there’s so many, it’s great that you mention some of those folks cause like Amy and then Ashok Gupta and some other folks, are part of this summit. And part of the reason guys is like, it’s not just everything about address the gut address. The mast cells, part of the mast cell thing is they’re supposed to work and they’re supposed to be on at certain times. But what’s interesting is to like Marcelle’s talking about is turning it off or regulating it. It’s really mast cell dysregulation is one of our big issues. And we also have emotional dysregulation. It’s not that the emotion is bad, but it maybe it’s the duration or the story that you assign to it. So there’s a lot of options, which is great. And Marcelle, one of the things I really wanna point out is it kind of like you bring up the question of like, what brings you joy? And the thing that I, when you’re talking about dancers, I know so many people they’re like 78 and they’re like, yeah, I go to dancing three times a week and I do all that. And I’m like, I got 20 year olds who can’t do this. But it, I mean, is it really that they just it’s, it’s not just a physical activity. It’s like, seems like it’s a joy of it.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Oh what, but it’s, it’s everything. And there’ve been so many studies done on dancers. It’s about connection. You know, I say it’s a four minute conversation with this person, you know? And then yeah. And then I also cannot be thinking about anything, cause if I think about anything else, I have to be totally focused cause I’ll trip, I’ll trip my partner and you’re listening to the music. So you’re listening to the rhythm of that and the beat of that. So it’s multiple things. I mean in November they always have something called Stardust and I will be literally dancing from Thursday night till Sunday morning. And you know, I might sleep three or four hours a night and that’s that’s and this usually about five or 600 people there. And you know, this is the, and they have cruises and they have all kinds of things now with doing ballroom Latin, as well as, you know, east and west coast swing. So and tango. So, you know, that’s my gig. Other people have theirs, but I think Tom, it’s finding that place for yourself. To your heart, you know, and that is sometimes takes a little time. And any of the stuff we have from our childhood, we can heal all of it. I don’t care how bad it is. We can heal it if we pay attention and start to ask the questions to ourselves so that we can get better on the other side. I mean, that’s the whole, the whole purpose about em.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

I love that so much. I mean, it’s so well said. And you know, it’s interesting. I like when I think of, friends of mine ask me like why I do the certain sports. I do like the Telemark skiing and the mountain biking and stuff. And I say, well, one it’s my exercise, but it’s also like my joy. Right? And so one of the things I find though, is as you’re describing dancing, this I’m feeling the same thing. Like I hear what I hear in your voice and I kind of get energetically. It’s the same thing is for me in my own spots, my biking and my skiing is I’m getting in the moment, I’m paying full attention to what’s happening in my life and I’m going with the flow and I’m, I’m dancing. So like for me, like it’s like dancing with the trail or the snow, and I love the feedback of the planet. And so I would just encourage everyone to really take to heart. What you just said Marcelle is find that joy and the thing that speaks to your heart and then dance with it, right? Whether you’re truly dancing or doing other dance, it’s dance, interact with it and love it.

Marcelle Pick, NP

And I think we’ve lost a lot of that because of the confusion around the pandemic recently and all the stress going on in the world. We can still find moments of joy and excitement in the here and now in this moment right now. And I think we’ve all lost that and also make sure that you’re outside putting, planting your feet on the soil. I live in Maine. So, you know, it’s easy for me and I have 11 acres of land. So I’m there all the time, but it’s finding a place to kind of connect with nature still, even if you’re in a park, you know, and you’re outside kind of looking at the trees and they’re starting to turn or they’re beautiful or, or whatever, but it’s also remembering that connection as well and good fresh air and water filters on your, you know, I mean, it can go on and on, but those are all things that can make a difference because that also does affect the hormones and for women, the skincare products that they use, because that also can contribute to high cortisol levels. The average newborn has 247 chemicals and it’s cord blood. So my goodness, so…

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Newborn great.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Hundred and 50 or more chemicals in, in breast milk. I mean we’re knowing that we’ve got some issues, so, alright fine. So we take care of some of those things and do some detox for ourselves or, you know, detox our emotions because that’s the other part to the puzzle too.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Well. And what I, what I hear like the whole thread too, is like, you have a choice. It’s almost like the knee replacement person. And actually what, because it’s like, I’m getting a knee replacement so I can do more or I’m getting a knee replacement, which means I’m old as crap. And I’m about to go in a pine box, right? It’s like, you can choose how to look at it when you were saying Maine and you and I have these conversations all the time about mindset. And like, we live our joy as much as we can, but the thing that’s so interesting is when you said, Hey, I’m in Maine, my old school brain automatically was thinking, oh, you’re gonna tell me how it’s cold and harder in the winter. And that never came outta your mouth.

Marcelle Pick, NP

That’s cause I go to Florida for dancing for a couple, they’ve got great dancing down there so I can dance my little heart out. But you know, again, that’s also part what I’m trying to changed because okay. I don’t like January February and March, so I’ve got a condo down there. I don’t own it, but I’m renting it and then I can dance. And all the other times it’s amazing here for me. And it’s finding out what makes you happy. That’s the key to this in addition to eating the right foods and looking at what some of the issues might be. And if there is mast cell activation, that’s an issue for you is, is addressing what some of those underpinnings of it might be. The gut microbiome, the neurotransmitter imbalance, the foods that you’re eating, the people that you’re living with, the people you have in your lives, you know, is it time to kind of do a detox of them too? You know, it’s really looking at those things to see, you know, what brings you joy and who surrounds you when you’re feeling most joyful. Cause all of those pieces are tied together.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

It’s so interesting cause it is who, where’s the joy who’s surrounding you. And the one thing you said with the dancing that I think I really like to just like also put a big stamp on is the connection in the community. Because the other word that I would add from my personal experience to when I feel connected with others and I’m in a community is I feel safer. And so much of what we’ve talked about is our cortisol levels can be regulated well, our mass cells can be regulated well, really only when we feel safe, heart rate variability does not improve if you’re not safe. And a lot of us talk about poly vagal safety. I mean…

Marcelle Pick, NP

Absolutely. I mean, if you don’t feel safe, then that’s gonna create so many problems, including huge amounts of anxiety and a number of other things. So I think it’s, it’s, it’s crucial for us, whatever that means for you, cause it’s gonna mean something different for you as it is for me and also surrounding yourself with people that make you happy. Instead if you go in a situation it’s like, Ugh, I don’t know. That’s not so good.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

I love it. So as we kind of wrap all these things and bring ’em together for folks, I mean, are there any sort of things that like you see really jump out as like big players in, in the hormone field or in the mast cells that we haven’t touched on or things that people need to know about?

Marcelle Pick, NP

I think my biggest thing to say to people is that never go down the bunny hole in which you are never gonna get better. And I think a lot of people feel that way when they’re reacting to every food that they can imagine or the environment or whatever. It’s working with someone that’s gonna help you get to the other side, cause it’s always possible, always possible, but you need to understand what the triggers are and it might be food, it might be emotions. It might be combination of all those things, which is usually what I find.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Yeah.

Marcelle Pick, NP

It’s never one thing. It’s usually everything together. And unfortunately adrenals are a huge, huge player in the hormonal cascade that goes awry.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Yep. Totally agree. So after hearing all this stuff, I’m sure there’s a, I mean totally inspiring and I’m sure people are gonna wanna know, you know, where to find you and learn more about what you do and potentially even reach out and get some help. So where can people find you?

Marcelle Pick, NP

Sure. I have a website, marcellepick.com. I’ve got over a thousand. I’ll probably about 1400 articles. Cause I read an article already to every week and also I have a very aggressive weight loss program that is through the womenstransformationcenter.com you know, people 99% of the time lose 20 pounds in six weeks. And then we have a whole program that goes with that. That is very effective. And you know, 70% of my people keep the weight off. So it’s, it’s very, I’ve spent a lot of time putting it together and much of it it’s online. So…

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Wow. You know that’s, those are some insane numbers. And I know you well enough to know that those are not bullshit numbers. Those are legit people are, but it like, this is the walk, the walk and work with people who and someone who gets it. And my assumption is that the weight loss program is not just cookie cutter because everybody’s got these little pieces, we go down a path, but we put in that individual piece. That’s so good. What was the website for that one again?

Marcelle Pick, NP

That’s called womenstransformationcenter.com and they can actually make a appointment for consult with me, for people that are really seriously interested.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Cool.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Cause it’s so effective. Yeah.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Awesome. Well, Marcelle Pick, thanks so much for joining us. This is such a pleasure.

Marcelle Pick, NP

Absolutely. It was always fun to do this with you.

Tom Moorcroft, DO

Yay. So everybody, thanks for joining us for this episode of The Reversing Mast Activation and Histamine Intolerance summit. And we’re just like really so thankful for you to join us today. And we’re looking forward to seeing you in our next episode.