Dr. Heather Sandison, ND – Peptides and Neurohacking

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Summary

Dr. Heather Sandison, founder of Marama: A World Without Dementia and board member of Neurohacker Collective joins the peptide summit to talk about imbalances that can affect the brain. She discusses how toxins, nutrients, stress, and infections affect the brain and how peptides can support our neuro health as we age. Anyone who wants to keep their brain in tip top condition would not want to miss this discussion!

Brain, Mind, Peptides
Transcript
Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Hi, this is Dr. Kent Holtorf with another episode of the peptide summit today, we are fortunate to have dr. Heather Sanderson, uh, with us, and she’s going to be talking about integrating peptides for optimal brain optimization, um, or for comprehensive brain optimization that got a double optimization there, but, uh, very excited to speak with her. She’s well known, uh, Sierra at many conferences and she trains doctors and speaks about, um, all our unique topics. And we’ll get in. I’m sure we’re gonna learn a lot about how to fix some of the toughest patients, especially the neurodegenerative and cognitive problems that are so prevalent and so poorly treated today. Um, she’s the founder and the medical director of North County, natural medicine and founder of, um, uh, Borama, which is a residential, um, uh, facility, uh, which I imagine takes up a lot of time and is a, uh, tough to run specializes in again, neurocognitive medicine and neuro hacking. I love that term. 

She has brain to specifically address imbalances that affect the brain, including autism, add ADHD, depression, anxiety, and all simers. She has trained with some of the top top names in the country and around the world, uh, Dale, um, uh, Benderson uh, dr. Neil, Nathan, dr. Bill Walsh, uh, and Richie Shoemaker. Um, uh, it was a little tough to work with, uh, in addition to regular attending and speaking, uh, integrated medicine conferences, uh, uh, across the country and throughout the year hitting philosophy philosophy centers around taking deep dives into treating the cause of the imbalance of the body, including toxic burden, nutrient balance, stress management, uh, structural integration and infection resolutions are really looks at the whole body, uh, which I think is key with so many illnesses. 

Now she believes the power of the body heal itself. Um, dr. Sanderson’s passion, uh, to guidance, support patients as a co-create strong foundations for optimal health through sustainable lifestyle changes and the best medical interventions to support balance of the body. Uh, yeah, I think the patient has to be an active participant or that just doesn’t work. Uh, she’s dedicated to learning all there is to know about the brain health and considers her amazing, uh, patients at NC and M a and residents at, um, the Orana, uh, residential center, some of our very best teachers. Very interesting sounds very humble. And, uh, you can learn a lot if you listen to your patients. Uh, she’s been awarded a research grant, which are very tough to get study the effects of individual interventions and patients struggling with cognitive decline, um, at our center, uh, she’s earned her naturopathic doctorate at the steer in Seattle, and she currently serves on the medical advisory board of neuro hacker collected a collective and as a regular host of the collective insights podcast. 

So dr. Heather, thank you so much for being on I’m looking forward to hearing all the things you’re doing for some of these toughest patients with, uh, you know, neuro cognitive degeneration and all the other cognitive dysfunction, which seems like so many people are diagnosed with nowadays. Um, and so many people have a problem and we ask you, what do you think is the cause of the rise of all these problems that I don’t think we had 20, 30 years ago?

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Yeah. Thanks so much for having me, first of all, um, I, you know, it’s such a fascinating conversation, right? Is a lot of people suggest that in the case of autism or Alzheimer’s that maybe it’s that we have improved diagnoses, right. That we see more doctors, we have more doctors that there’s more people in the world. So of course there’s going to be more patients. However, I would disagree with that. I don’t think that fully explains the rise in incidents. So the number of patients per say 100, um, in the population that are being diagnosed with diseases, these longterm chronic neurodegenerative diseases. And I, I believe that toxicity plays a huge role. Now, I actually, you listed as you read my bio who has time for all that, but you listed the five things that basically I believe contribute that can be causal, really not just contribute, but can be actually causal when it comes to complex chronic disease and that’s toxicity, which has definitely exponentially risen over the course of the last generation or so that the last 80 years.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

So certainly hitting our baby boomers very hard. The other thing is nutrient balance, right? Remember the eighties, when we were told that fats were bad, well, our brains need fats. They use fats actually most efficiently for fuel. So things like ketones we’ve found that one of the best diets for a neurodegenerative brain is a ketogenic diet because the brain so efficiently uses ketones for fuel. Um, and you get rid of the detriment of high levels of both insulin and blood sugar in the brain. So toxins, nutrient balance, structural integrity, right? You’ve got to have the way a chiropractor would think about it. You’ve got to have blood flowing to your brain. You’ve got to have the toxins able to get out through the venous system, through the lymphatic. We’ve learned more and more over the last few years about how that, that lymphatic system in the brain is so integral and how a lot of that happens at night.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

If we’re not flushing the system, then those toxins can build up. And certainly cause that degeneration at the cellular level. So that structural integrity of, of the head and neck particularly, um, also, you know, if you’ve been hit over the head with a baseball bat, clearly traumatic brain injuries can cause neurodegeneration. We see that. And then, um, stress, we all know that there’s very clear literature that when we’re under stress, we don’t remember as much. It’s harder to make this neuro actions and then infections. There’s a very, um, I actually don’t even know if someone has connected this as a cause, but certainly correlated. 

We see in an autopsy reports, the brains of people with these degenerative diseases, whether they’re Lewy body or Alzheimer’s, or Parkinson’s, there are viruses and bacteria in these, these tangles in the neurofibrillary tangles, or in these plaques in what you can see histologically under a microscope, you can find some of these bugs in there. And so it suggests that there’s a contributing factor when it comes to infections and dental infections in particular can be a trigger there. So I, that the reason there’s a higher incidence is because all of these things are more off balance. We’re more stressed. We don’t eat as well. We don’t exercise. So our structure is off. We spend all day sitting at computers or sitting in the car commuting, and then, um, there’s more toxins in the environment. So that is what I would say is driving the rise in incidents.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

I think I completely agree. And what do you think of McDonald’s work, where he found basically all of you head of Harvard brain bank and biopsy all the Alzheimer’s patients and found line, you know, and all of them. And, you know, I’m just thinking that everything’s infectious, but I also think, let’s say, you know, we call it Lyme disease, which, you know, which I think is a lot of things. But I think if someone just says Lyme, they’re going to be fine. It’s all these other things, you know, and I had it myself and emotional stress, special divorce just killed me. And when I lecture, I show how stress over things that lowers in eternity. No, it modulates, it lowers the good part, but causes all this inflammation. And, um, and I had it since I was born and I have the worst memory of anyone.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

I can remember a medical stuff, but that’s about it. But then, uh, and just all y’all growing up at one people was bigger and all this stuff, but then just two weeks ago, I broke my nose and Kachin for only the time. And, um, yeah, all the, all the toxins, like I’m scared of taking Alzheimer’s test because I don’t know if I pass, you know? Um, so, so do you, um, uh, what, what, where do you start, let’s say ATDs or you also do like add patients. Uh, let’s just start with, they’re like add ADHD, someone else, Mental kind of the things that come up as, as children are growing. Um, so when I, what I do is it really a comprehensive approach? I, I like to play in this area of, cause I know that a lot of people will say, well, why don’t you just add more magnesium or why not put them on, on this or try that. 

And instead of doing this sort of role efficiency and Adderall deficiency rate, and instead of doing this sort of, let’s pick from the tree and choose these things that are most interesting this week, I really like to get the data and, um, and patients need to be on board. I’m a data person. It’s, it’s part of who I am as a provider. And so I really encourage patients like let’s, let’s fill in the model, let’s figure out how many toxins you have. Are they there? And kids unfortunately can be exposed to toxins it’s in umbilical cord blood, right. So they can get it from mom, particularly firstborn, right? Mom is downloading a lot of her toxins through breast milk or through that cord blood. And so, um, it’s not like kids come out totally a blank slate when it comes to toxic burden. 

So we do look and kids, um, we’re of course we’re careful about how we pull that out so that we don’t cause more cellular damage than we’re trying to, to prevent or re restore. Um, but I, I do, I just go straight to the model, right? All of these things are potentially causal let’s measure them. Let’s figure out which are the ones contributing to the imbalance in your system, and then let’s fix it. Let’s let’s create balance there so that every cell, every mitochondria, every piece that in your body can function more efficiently and better and create more balance. And this should resolve itself. I believe with all of my been my, my religion, my truth with a capital T is that the body is divinely designed to heal itself. And what we need to do is get the gunk out of the way that’s, that’s screwing that up and we need to add good nutrients and, and we need to add meditation and you know, this, these stress management strategies, cause we can’t eliminate eliminate that completely. And also some stress is good for us. It’s about balance that really, I start, we have, I use an hour and a half to two hours for initial consults because I treat complex medicine. Usually there’s quite a bit of history to take. And then we are going to plug people into this model and I don’t want to leave any of it out because it can all be controlled.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

So you’re probably researching like me. It’s just like, I everyone’s like got a problem. You just like, keep breathing more. I want to find that. Yeah. Like basically the, the golden, you know, trick here. Yeah. You know? Um, and so like, well let me ask you, what is your Hashi like for, uh, the testing, like for measuring toxins, heavy metals and what are the treatments?

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

I follow Neil Nathan, um, pretty closely when it comes to mycotoxin illness, mold and mycotoxin water damaged buildings. Um, and I, you know, we see great results with that. Um, and it is a new science, so we’re constantly learning more. I really appreciate the support of my, my peers, my colleagues, where we’re, we’re always, you know, we’re all collecting data, we’re all getting information, we’re all collecting experience. And we share that regularly with dr. Nathan really spearheading that. So that makes me, um, that makes me feel much more confident in the process, especially because it can be challenging. It can take a long time, but I see people get better. So the testing that I’m doing there now is through real time, we do recommend some sort of provocation. So either a hot shower and sweating the night before, and then collecting a first morning void of urine. It’s a urinary marketecture mycotoxin test. 

So either heat or glutosiome to provoke that, um, we do feel like we get, we get results that more match with the patient’s experience since potential exposure is when we do that there, I know there is argument in the field about whether or not you should do that, but I, I do support that. And then for heavy metals right now, I’ve shifted to using Chris shades work, um, almost exclusively, um, the, the Quicksilver works. So I do his hands down. The mercury test in through Quicksilver is the best I believe out there. And then sometimes I’ll use some doctor’s data, provoked urine testing, particularly if there’s lead, showing up. I think using some EDTA as a provocation agent can be helpful. Um, and then for the chemical toxins, I use great Plains. They have a good toxin panel. It includes glyphosate. And typically with that, you know, some people have one or two of those elevated, but I’m looking for patterns like, is everything elevated or is there one thing that maybe is pointing in the direction of, I had a patient, for instance, there’s always good stories around this, but I had a patient who, you know, she amazing woman. 

She grew a lot of her own food, definitely bought everything. Organic was very conscious of like clean cleaning products, not having toxins in her home. I did everything. Right. Right. Yeah. And then we ran this testing and all of her organophosphates, the glyphosate was one of the higher ones I’d ever seen. Um, and it turns out she did her hobby was Japanese flower, raging Imana. And so she was doing this, like this incredible human. She was doing this to donate the flower arrangements, to like low income families who had family members in the hospital. She just is an incredible human being. But we didn’t, I would never have thought to ask her, like, is icky, Bonna your hobby. She was up to her elbows like two days a week and the worst pesticides herbicides, like the stuff that they won’t even spray on food that people would consume. Right. If they leave the worst ones to flowers. So she was getting a ton of work. Yeah. We never would have known if we hadn’t run this test so that great Plains test has tipped me off Sitting in my bathroom. Yeah. It doesn’t always, you know, we don’t always get a slam dunk like that. Like, okay, you’ve got to, you’ve got to wear gloves or, or change hobbies, but we, um, we often do run into things where we can mitigate that exposure or change the exposure and bring that down. Generally.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

The main thing, is there any key lading type thing, or try to just increase detox

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Terms of glyphosate. Some people do talk about there being specific things like glycine, um, that can help to pull that out a little quicker. Certainly glutathione. I, my approach is very naturopathic one when it comes to toxicity, I really like to open up the among trees or that’s a fancy word we use for the organs of elimination. So get people breathing, we forget that the lungs are an organ of detox. Get people sweating. A lot of us have spent a lot of our lives, you know, in 73 degree air conditioned rooms and cars. And we don’t, we haven’t been sweating regularly. And so we’ve sort of lost that reflex plus they’re putting on deodorants and things like that. So getting people, breathing, getting them, sweating, drinking, more water, making sure there’s regular daily bowel movements. 

I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had a patient say, Oh yeah, I have a regular bowel movement. I’m like, okay, well how often daily? Oh no, just like once a week, but that’s and they consider that normal. That’s not normal. It’s not, you’re going to build up toxicity. Unfortunately we live in a world where there are high, there is a relatively high toxic burden on the planet right now. And so we need to make sure that we have these Oregon’s open. So what did we say? I think kidneys, liver, lymph, bowels, and lungs. We need to open all of that. And I think of it as like the river mouth. So we want to have that river mouth open before we start adding things like glutathione or other fascial Coleen is another one that we might use to get the cells mobilizing toxins that are stored there. But before we jump to that, we’ve got to make sure those organs of elimination are open.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Yeah. And if the cells don’t have energy that can’t get rid of these heavy metals, you know?

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Yeah, yeah. And this is, it really is. So, and sometimes they’re starting in multiple places, but, um, you know, this is a really great place for, for peptides. I actually really stressed that people should be identifying at least identifying infections and exposures before considering peptides. A lot of my reasoning behind that is that the body, the neurological system is sending a message to ourselves. Right? And oftentimes I see a lot of mold illness and what’s happening is that as people are longer and longer, they’re more and more reactive. And sometimes that can mean an autoimmune reaction. Sometimes it can mean histamine responses. So things like food intolerances or hives, or just feeling awful every day, feeling terrible after even just drinking water, people become more and more and more sensitive. And part of that is that the neurological system is sending our bodies a symptom and it wants us to pay attention, to get out of that toxic environment. And so if we then add a peptide, say like BPC, I view, and I both have BBC one 57, but if we add something like VPC to try to get a patient to be more tolerant of things, then we’re sort of overriding that signal at a BP BPC essentially is a cell signaling peptide that sends this message that the gut cells should behave. Like they’re healthy, right. To break it down. And

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

If it does block the effects of the toxins, but yeah, but you still have the toxic,

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

But if the toxins are still there, then do we really want to override that message? I think that what as providers, it’s important to have an order of operations, like what are we going to do first so that we don’t make the patient sicker. And I think there, a lot of times there’s a message. If we down-regulate, if our, if our brain is down-regulating the signals that tell us to have more growth hormone, sometimes there’s a reason for that. Sometimes our energy, like you mentioned so energy, we need enough of it. We are energy. Shouldn’t be going towards finding a mate or getting laid, right. If we’re sick, it’s going towards healing. And so maybe there’s not that much testosterone in the body driving libido. And if we just add more testosterone, do we really solve the problem? Or do we just put a bandaid on it even though with functional medicine.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

And, and I find too, and it’s like, you know, like how people in the same household and one person’s this, they’re all, you know, fall mold and you know, and the other people aren’t, it’s really interesting. And they usually have line whatever makes them unable to detox it or whatever it may be. They’re much more sensitive to it, even with my own situation. So my girlfriend has just developed terrible, um, dramatic raffia, you know, where you basically, uh, rub something. It makes a big, well, so very mass cell, if you got this cough and, uh, she has mold and I I’m negative. And, uh, we had a mold guy come out, not a lot, you know, so I don’t know if she’s getting it here or food, you know, she’s vegetarian or, or what, but, uh, it’s, it’s interesting the different tolerances to, and which part genetic combined with everything else too.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Yeah. So we’ve talked about structure briefly. I talked about it more on the macro level, but at the molecular level, certainly we see this with their cognitive function, the AOE for genetics and the ABP genetics. There’s, there’s a handful that really influence whether or not someone is susceptible to Alzheimer’s. So you can have a lot of toxicity that doesn’t necessarily mean you’re going to end up with Alzheimer’s, but if the right constellation of things, so the right, this perfect form, other than it could lead there, if you have that susceptibility for other people, it may end up being an autoimmune condition for other people, you know?

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Yeah. I think that’s with everything, you might have a diabetic gene, but you have the crappy, but it’d be great. We all get it. And epigenetically. And I think even, you know, in the womb that even was transferred, now your kids, kids, kids, you know, and which I think is a reason why obesity is there. Kids are exposed to all this stress hormones and the, in the womb and toxins. And like they’re showing autism, maybe number one thing, even over above vaccines is Tylenol. So wanting to get that out, tons of studies, I’m like, why don’t we ever hear about this? You know? Uh, it’s, it’s crazy the toxins that we have. Um, so w with that, so you’re getting good results. So just detoxify in these kids.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Well, it certainly is

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Compensate just because it’s, it’s not an easy thing,

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Part of the approach. Right. So I wouldn’t say that there’s any one thing, that’s the magic answer. I there’s so often that I wish I could talk to a patient and they’ve shared their, you know, this horrible story and how much they’re suffering and I want to give them the magic pill. Um, I wish I had that. And unfortunately, it’s just not right.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

It’s not life. Yeah.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

And so it’s about supporting the system. Um, and certainly I think toxins are a great place to start.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Great, great. Let’s I know we’re short on time. Um, what other peptides do you use?

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Yeah, so we had had a quick conversation about how I really love the ones that I can get ahold of.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

That’s a big problem right now,

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Being able to get ahold of them. Peptides are, I would say since I finished school 10 years ago, whatever it was now, eight years ago, not that long, not that old, um, since I’ve added a couple of things that have really profoundly changed my practice. So bill Walsh, his work was one early on and then training with dr. Bredesen was another training with doctor Neil. Nathan is another. And then peptides, I would say are like one of the profound things that I have added to my practice since, you know, starting naturopathic that this career and

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

They saved my life. And that changed her practice. Yeah.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Incredible. And the, sort of the, the philosophy around them that what we’re doing is we’re looking for, what’s missing in a, in a dysregulated state and what’s actually there in a healthy state. So instead of focusing all our energy on figuring out what’s wrong with this disease person, we’re saying, okay, well, what can we add? That brings more health. And as a naturopath, you know, of course I love that. But then to watch the results to watch people’s lives completely transform with adding, just peptides with that being the only thing to watch a, and A’s, it’s a, the anti, uh, you know, the antinuclear antibodies that markers for autoimmune disease to watch them go to normal after years of treatment is just, I mean, it brings you

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

And probably loves that too, you know, seeing it on paper.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Oh yeah. Seeing it on paper, getting good sleep. Finally, after years of insomnia, you know, having more energy, there are so many things. I had a patient whose Crohn’s disease completely resolved. Um, I mean, just,

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

We’ve had so many patients, nine year old going to get a collectomy and a little BPC and a TB for frag. And then we ended up later at a KPV and totally fine. And she would’ve had her whole life have been collectomy, you know,

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Scheduled for surgery, um, with the, um, getting the GHQ that has been amazing. Um,

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

And I just, there’s so many things as well. Yeah. Yeah. So it’s a copper peptide used a lot for cosmetics.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

I use it every day on my forehead for my wrinkles.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

You got great skin, so you’re a walking billboard for it. And you haven’t used really the dialects, uh, um, which there’s a lot of studies, uh, clinical trials on that. And the five meter, one MQ, mitochondrial boosters. They’re just so hard to get, but we are, again, probably are coming out with a five minute one MQ, which boosts mitochondrial function, uh, which is a nother theory of even aging. You know, we just mitochondria stopped working and the vicious cycle, you can’t, you know, the cells don’t work and then, you know, it just affects every system, body, the detox, and then everything gets worse. Um, and PPC also helps mitochondria as well. But, um, what else have you found that

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

I think in terms of integrating the peptides, I, I tend to use them after we’ve gotten rid of the toxicity and then when we’ve fortified with nutrients, right? Because so mitochondria, if you’re going to, you know, increase mitochondrial numbers per cell or something, um, if you want more mitochondrial function, you have to still have the building blocks. Right. We can send all the signals we want, but if, if the nutrients aren’t there to support that, then the peptides aren’t going to be able to that signaling isn’t gonna have any effect what’s the youth would love NAD, right? So NAD is so important. It’s one of those cofactors, right. That makes all of this possible. So we have to have all of the pieces, right? Again, it’s, there’s no magic pill. Um, peptides are the closest thing to that. Well, magic injection, you make sense.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

It makes sense that we’ve got other pieces that’s rare in medicine do it because that’s what I learned. You know,

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

The other thing, is it really getting a hold of that, that stress management, right? So we talked about some of this neurological Sydney lean that becoming a pattern. So what I’ve noticed in my practice is sometimes we can get rid of all the molds. We can, you can move out of the moldy environment. You can even divorce the toxic partner. And then that signaling is still there. It’s sort of like this learned programming. So limbic retraining is a big part of what I, I suggest people do. And whether it’s with Joe Dispenza or Annie hopper, there’s a lot of great people there. Um, there’s a group out there as well.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

How long does that take and how often do they do it?

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

People do it daily. And I have patients who feel better in three days, you know, it, it,

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

And that’s the limbic system where all the fear and yeah, it makes sense. And I think of it kind of like a feral cat, where if you immediately bring in a feral cat, it’s going to be like a regular cat. But if you, if it’s got it’s wiring and environment for a month, you try to bring that cat in no matter what you do, you know, it’s so difficult. So a man you must made some people’s lives. It’s so much better.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

I certainly hope so. I, you know, there’s the world needs problem solvers

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

And their family members. My gosh. Yeah.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Yeah. We need, we need these people to show up to be part of our communities, to be engaged in their families and, and, you know, help the world make it a better place. Right? Like, it sounds so cheesy, but that’s really why I do what I do when I watch, um, you know, these families who, who have loved ones who are sick and or alien, and they’re not able to engage with them. They become more of a liability than an asset to the committee.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Oh, just figure the dynamics change and just, Oh, you’ve just made so many lives better. I, I, I can just tell how long I hate to ask the question because it may not be in it. I’m like, how long does it usually take, let’s say for an add patient or an Alzheimer’s patient depends on how bad, I guess, you know, what’s, what’s the success rate

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Some cases. Well, thank you for asking. So that’s what we’re doing at the clinic right now. We are currently recruiting for this study where we are trying to answer exactly that question. What’s the success rate. If I spend the time, take, spend the money, spend the time and do commit to this program, change my diet, get the toxins out, do all the testing. How likely is it that myself or my loved one will get better? We don’t have the answer to that question right now. So dr. Bredesen has published case studies. I’ve certainly seen it in my clinic that this is absolutely reversible in some cases.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

And it’s, it’s scary how, you know, no one funds these things. If they want one pill, one, you know, basically one outcome. That’s not how the world works. Yeah. Hopefully we contribute.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Hopefully we’re contributing to that paradigm shift. There was a study they’re just rehashing these same old jugs. It’s like $47 million of taxpayer dollars. Went back into studying one of these, um, one of these drugs that sort of already been proven not to be effective. And yet people keep talking about the Bredesen protocol. Like there’s no scientific evidence saying that it works.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Yeah, exactly. And you look at the studies on these drugs and the lines are like, they do little things to manipulate the data and it’s barely better than placebo and billions of dollars they make with all the side effects.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

So my first Bredesen patient, I was not feeling overly confident. Um, because I, you know, I was still under that assumption that there was nothing that we could really do. I’d heard Bredesen talk, but I’d never done it myself. And I had a patient. My first patient come in and she had a mocha of two. We sent her home. They were really excited about it. Her husband was very, very supportive, really wanted to be doing this program. Got all of it started right away. She was better. Three weeks later, it was unbelievable. It literally, I was moved to tears. I was sobbing. I could not believe it then. You know, not everyone of course gets that kind of results. The easiest patient to treat is to prevent, right, like at this adage, it’s way easier. It’s way less expensive. It’s way less heartbreaking to prevent this kind of disease rather than try to go in and reverse it. It does take awhile. The analogy dr. Bredesen uses is like this great big tanker ship going through the ocean at full speed. We’ve got to first slow it down. And then we have to slowly turn it around and then we’ve got to get going in the other direction. So what I, I ask patients to give me a minimum of six months commitment. No, it’s nothing

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

There too. Oh my gosh. A progressive illness like that. And it can go on for years and years and drain the family of income and, and just be so difficult. They’re not the same person, you know,

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

It’s a challenging program to implement. And if patients can do it, then

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

They have to be full on board.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

They have to be fully onboard. And that’s challenging when there’s cognitive decline. And so that is why I opened Marrama the residential care facility. It’s an immersive experience in this protocol because how in Jean, I saw so many families suffering and they were, they were asking me, where do I send my loved one? I want them to be able to do this, but I can’t, I can’t, I can’t be the I’ve got to go to work. So I can’t keep them from like walking on the street. Yeah.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

It would be like the future model. How many beds are there just

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Currently? Um, certainly we hope my, my goal is really that we, we shift the entire industry. So I see,

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Well, we feel the outcomes and saves money. You know, it may be here. It’s not in stock.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Well, we hope to expand, you know, we, I literally opened a nursing home, um, March 1st of 2020, and then COVID hit. So that has been an interesting wild ride this year. But I would say,

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

I worry about other regulations and, you know,

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

We, we Wade through all of it, but our first resident moved in, um, the first week of March. And so she’s been there now, six months, we’re recording this in September. And her MOCA score went from a 19 to a 24. So our first resident is already better measurably, better. Our second residents, they moved in about 12 weeks later. Um, and they are already doing better. We’re not quite measuring it yet, but talking in paragraphs rather than one word answers, engaging at a totally different level. Um, and so, and also mood just the mood changes, sleep

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Alone because like they can be with their loved one and the loved ones, not cussing at him. You know, God, I hope I hope there is a trend in the funding, these things and changing that cause what, what do they get when they go to the neurologist six minutes? Can I take this and this by and nets that don’t work. They don’t, Oh, Hey, you’re doing wonderful work. Obviously you’re very caring and I don’t know when you sleep, but, uh, uh, I’m very impressed with, with all that. And I just wish you the best of luck for, for the country and the world. I think you’re just doing some amazing cutting edge things and, uh, I hope it catches on. Yeah.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Thank you. Thank you for your support. Thank you for helping me share what we’re up to and that this is possible. You know, I, dr. Bredesen says it Alzheimer’s should be a rare disease. This is preventable. It’s also treatable. If you start early, we have more confidence. So go out there and get the testing, get a, he calls it a Cognos scopy, right? Like just like people get a colonoscopy. We should regularly be regularly be checking all of these parameters that influence our cognitive function so we can maintain it.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Yeah. Just, just real quick. I know we have to, but, um, do you genetics, you do. W what testing do you do?

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

So, like I described sort of with all of the, um, the, the elements that I feel influence, um, our, our cognitive health, right? So we do all of the labs that we talked about for toxicity. So micro toxins, heavy metals and chemical toxicity. We do a full panel. So we’re looking for hormones. I often run a Dutch panel because I like getting that four point cortisol. Um, and then the, the breakdown of metabolites of estrogens. And then, um, we run, usually I run like a Cyrex rate, 12, which has an infectious panel. I always do a GI panel, whether or not people are complaining about GI issues, because sometimes we find things there,

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Brain access is huge.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Absolutely. What else is on that list? Oh, well, should the Welsh work? Of course. So I’m looking at thinking copper ratios, your encrypted pyros help, whole blood histamine levels and how that affects methylation. Um, so certainly detox capacity mood there’s Alzheimer’s, um, the things that come up with the, the Walsh ratios and metrics there. So at least that list, and then depending on the patient, um, we may add other things that might be relevant and an ape for status. Of course.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Yeah. I think that’s something that’s, that’s good to know. Yeah. So how do people find you if they want to find you?

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Yeah. So North County, natural medicine.com is the clinic Murayama experience. Mar AMA Meramec experience is the residential care facility for the elderly. And, um, I also host the podcast at neuro hacker collective insights.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

How do we, how do we find that neuro hacker select data? Yeah.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Collective insights is the name of the podcast. And it’s available where all podcasts are.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Nice. Do you do that once a week?

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

You know, I, I host it. I don’t really own it. It’s it’s, um, through narrative, through neuro hacker, who they’re the makers of quality and I love and support the crew there. And so show up as the host and dig in deep to the people. I guess

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

It’s tough. I mean, you have to be prepared and, you know, you have to know your stuff. That’s, that’s great. I don’t have to check that out too. Um, I’m gonna send you some products too. I’d love for you to evaluate and give me your, uh, opinion on that. Yeah.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Once there’s conferences happening again, I know that I’m going to be running into in person more and more.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Yeah. Yeah. If we can get through this virtual conference thing. Yeah. So, uh, Hey, thank you so much for, for being on this has been a great conversation and just learn so much. Uh, so, uh, thank you. And again, the best of luck to you and, uh, you’re just doing great things.

 

Heather Sandison, N.D.

Thank you. Thank you for getting the peptides out there. People need them.

 

Kent Holtorf, M.D.

Great. Thanks so much. Have a good one. You too. Bye. Bye.

 

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