AOD-9604: The Peptide That Targets Fat, Not Muscle

Introduction to AOD 9604 0:00

They say on social media how they're going on about AOD that it's a fat burner. It is true. What they say in social that Aod is a fact burner, it is absolutely true Aody doesn't actually burn fat like people claim online. Yes, It does burn that for based on the physiological responses that happens with that lipolysis effect, right? Does break down fat and it all done in a natural way. Your health is shaped by more than symptoms. Through real stories and expert insights, we explore how your genetics, environment, and daily choices affect your wellbeing.

We uncover root causes and share practical tools to help you find the healing you need. Welcome to the Forum Health Integrative Medicine Podcast. Welcome back to the Forum Health Integrative Medicine podcast. I'm your host, Amanda. And today I am joined by Jocelyn Siegel, one of our nurse practitioners based in our Tampa, Florida location. Today we are talking about AOD 9604. Yes, a peptide. What it is, how it works, who it's best for, and what kind of results patients can realistically expect and, what you can do to actually improve those results.

There's a lot of misinformation online around peptides, so today we're breaking this one down in a simple, practical, and easily digestible way. Get ready and let's get started. Jocelyn, it is so great to have you on the podcast today. I am so excited to start our peptide series with AOD 9604. Before we get into that, tell our audience a little bit about yourself and how you got on podcast with me. Okay, Amanda, thank you for having me. Number one. So I am fairly new to form health. I started in the end of August and I'm directing our hormones by design bio identical hormone monthly program, which has been just one of my wishes along the way and women's health that health blessed am I to be working here and directing that.

But I've also gotten into peptides. So we wanted to really have Tampa stand out as, you know, the leader to get the peptide program rolling. I become myself, familiarize myself very well with these peptids. have a affinity towards AOD for reasons that we'll get into. Just to talk a little bit about myself, I am a family nurse practitioner. I've been for 10 to 12 years, and I was in primary care for a long time. And like most of us, we do get burned out, especially when it became managed care. You know, when I left, many of my patients were like they were so happy for me.

Jocelyn Siegelu2019s Background and Functional Medicine 2:37

And when they told them I was going into functional medicine, they're like, well, that's about time because you've been talking it, you know. Doing the functional medicines talk for many years. So I've acquired many principles of clean health, clean water, and clean food. I would, explain how, the things that were given here on earth, that's what is necessary for our body for growth, for nutrition. And whatever man created is not meant for sustainment and for health. Totally. Absolutely agree with that.

So today we're going to be getting into and starting our mini peptide series. Audience, what you have to look forward to is bursts of peptide education. Today we are starting with AOD 9604. And just for any of our listeners, if this is your first podcast, If you're not familiar with peptides, fast forward maybe 30 seconds, but peptids are short chains of amino acids. They are the building blocks of proteins, typically containing about 2 to 50 amino acid. Peptides act as body messengers directing cells to perform specific tasks like regulating metabolism, repairing tissue, and managing inflammation are just a few examples.

Your body naturally produces thousands of peptides to keep our systems working and running efficiently. Because they are small peptide, they act as specialized passwords, I would say. that bind to cells and receptors and tell the body what to do. They are cellular messengers. So that's peptides in a just quick little chunk there. And so getting into 9604, Jocelyn, let's start simple. What exactly is AOD 9 604? Okay. So AOD stands for anti-obesity drug. But I would like to change that name to achievement over doubt.

That's what it should really mean. Okay, because it is as an anti obesity drug, we're using it now either to either replace GLP ones or to add on because for many patients, they're not able to continue the drug or they've reached a plateau and they can't move on. but it is a synthetic peptide fragment of growth hormone, of human growth hormones. However, it was developed to act and mimic what growth hormonal does in our body, which is fat metabolism. So it's predominantly for that reason that they formed AOD and with the benefit of it not affecting our human-growth hormone levels nor creating the side effects.

that human growth hormone can cause, such as fluid retention, muscle or joint pain, or blood sugar escalations. That's fantastic. that is a great explanation of what AOD is. Why has this peptide become so popular lately? It's become popular because we're seeing cases where GLP-1 agonists like semiglutide and trisempitide, which are very common. These are your brand drugs, ozempic. Manjaro, they haven't been successful for patients. This peptide came along and it's like, wow, we have another alternative treatment plan for patient.

And I think that's so important when you're coming in for weight loss. You want to have a plan set up. In my practice, and its always part of my mission, is that I will never fail and provide some kind of treatment plans for my patient and I'm very passionate about it. So when they leave my office, I know that they're satisfied that we had a working plan in action. And that's where AOD really comes in. So it's kind of been no more as like a secondary add-on agent for weight loss treatment. And what's really nice is that it spares muscle loss, where in GLP-1 agonist, we have muscle lost.

Okay, that goes along with the weight loss.

What AOD 9604 Is and Why Itu2019s Popular 6:30

And part of this could be because patients aren't following certain criteria about maintaining their protein. But why you see such sudden weight-loss in people who take GLP-1, it's because it is not just losing fat, its losing muscle. That's where AOD really comes into the picture is that it spares muscle That's fantastic, yeah. I feel like the muscle loss with GLP-1s has, that's just one of those big areas that a lot of people are suffering, right? They're losing too much muscle, not the fat. Skinny fat, so is this the same thing as growth hormone or is it completely different?

So number one is the synthetic fragment of growth hormones. So it is not truly growth hormone. And that's why when we have patients on AOD, we're not concerned about check. I mean, We still do check their levels, but we don't see an increase in their growth factors. GF1 is the lab test that we check, and so we do not see any increases with the use of Aod. So, it's not acting as a human growth factor where you're going to see those changes or those side effects, like I just mentioned. How do you explain AOD to patients in a way that actually makes sense?

So the first thing I do is I want to review their history thoroughly. Like what has worked well in the past for you? What weight loss medications have you used? what dietary plans have use? Are you on an exercise program? And then if you were on a GLP-1, why was it stopped? Was it because you reached a plateau in your weight loss and you couldn't go any further? Or is it that you developed really severe side effects? And that's very important to know because these GLPs are known to cause chronic constipation or can cause reflux.

I mean, I've had some patients where I had to stop it because I don't want them to have to rely on taking an omeprazole, an over-the-counter proton pump inhibitor to decrease the acid in their stomach just for them stay on GLP-1s, right? So this is where AOD comes into play, where it makes sense for me to go and say, well, we need to kind of put a halt or drop your dose of GLp- 1 so we don' have this reflux and then let's start Aod. I also offer it as, I explain also that it's an excellent option too for supporting body composition.

So there's not much talk about body competition when you're talking about GLP-1s. And when we think about Body Composition, we want to think more of inches than pounds. We want see how is fat distributed in your body because it is distributed different ways and we know that because some of us have the the little muffin tops and some of us have the love handles and you know there's many ways to see how it's distributive and actually when I start women on hormones usually I tell them let's wait three months before we add on a peptide because you're going to start seeing a little fat redistribution with the hormones they're very synergistic and then usually they will they may not have exact weight loss but they'll notice like I can fit these pants that I haven't been able to wear in two years right because the waist circumference may have been decreased And we see that in AOD.

That's fantastic. I love that. At Forum Health, we uncover the why behind your symptoms. With advanced lab testing, hormone optimization, and cutting edge therapies, We help you heal and perform your best. And now, through shopforumhealth.com, you can access physician-grade supplements trusted by our providers, supporting everything from adrenal health to focus and longevity. Learn more at forumhealth.com and explore supplements at shopforumhealth .com. Moving on with AOD, how does it work? What's actually happening in the body when someone takes Aod?

Okay. I just went through this explanation with a patient earlier today. So it works by providing two signals, okay? The first signal is enhancing lipolysis. And liprolyses is the breakdown of fat. Then it inhibits lipogenesis, which is accumulation of the fat, and how it work is for in lipolysis, This AOD will attach itself to specific beta-3 receptor sites. I know that's kind of big words for some of the people out there that may not know, but just understand that there's many different types of receptor-sites

How AOD Works in the Body 10:45

in our body in order to cause a reaction, right? We need something to causes a reactions. So this Aod is going to make these receptor site kind light up a little bit on fire, and it's going release an enzyme. And enzymes are what creates chemical reactions, so to speak. So it releases the enzyme lipase and then lipases actually goes and it converts the stored triglycerides in our body and breaks it down into free fatty acids and glycerol. And then these compounds are then sent into the bloodstream where it can be utilized for fuel.

In lipogenesis, AOD prevents the process of converting excess calories into fat. I love that. And I loved that this is like a twofold thing. It's almost like you're stopping it from creating more fat, and then you are also targeting the fat cells themselves and dissolving them, essentially. When they say on social media how they're going on about AOD that it's a fat burner, it is true. What they said on the social medias that Aod is a Fat Burner, is absolutely true How is it different from stimulant-based weight loss products?

Well, that's an easy question for me to answer because when I was in primary care, I prescribed ventramine quite often. Of course, if they had high blood pressure, we had to have a very clear understanding that their blood had pressure had be within a certain range before I would start them on a stimulent like ventrimine. So, Fentermine is probably the most common weight loss medication out there. It is not meant for long-term use, only for short- term use usually about three months. And what we find is, well, what know is that FENTERMINE works directly on the central nervous system.

It releases norepinephrine. Norepinephrin is a very potent vasoconstrictor and our brain, it's part of a fight versus flight in our nervous system. But when nerepinephin is released, It actually suppresses our appetite, but it also has some bad side effects too. Like I mentioned about the person who has a history of hypertension, they can raise their blood pressure, can raised their heart rate. They can get a little more nervous. It can cause insomnia. So there's a lot of more neurological effects.

Stimulant. Right? Like stimulant, you're going to be stimulated. Yes. And with that, they're losing weight, not from a metabolic standpoint. They're loosing weight because number one, their food noise has gone. Yeah, they're losing calories and they are skipping meals. And that's not healthy either because now you are losing your ability to put the right fuel in your body. AOD, does it actually burn fat like people online claim? Yes, it does burn that for based on the physiological responses that happens with that lipolysis effect, right?

So it does break down fat and it's all done in a natural way. This is a reason why peptides are really on the forefront of modern medicine because we've discovered that peptide, they're abundant when we're younger and as we grow into adulthood. But as we age, like me, the peptides come down. They're low. And so this is why it's considered anti-aging medicine, too. There's nothing wrong about that. These peptide have been proven to be very, very safe. So when we're using AOD, there's also some things that we have to explain to patients.

When you're doing it, you have have lifestyle modifications and a clean diet and proper sleep. And we'll talk a little bit more about inflammation and that when dealing with fat, fat is inflammation. Inflammation causes resistance in weight loss and resistance and our insulin. If you want to get more down to the cellular level, but I know we are going to more into that. soon. Perfect. Awesome. Why do some people feel like their metabolism just isn't responding anymore? So that leads me to explaining how our body, if we have antagonistic forces inside our sleep disturbances, hormone imbalances.

It's going to counteract against the effects or negate the affects of AOD. And as we know, like I've mentioned that fat in itself is inflammatory. So this is why when people start losing weight on Aod and the fat is being burned off, is coming off naturally, all of a sudden, before they'll see even inches disappear, or the scale shows a lighter weight, you're gonna start feeling the differences. Because of the inflammation, it's been reduced. So maybe you'll feel like you can fit the rings on your fingers better, they're not so tight.

Or maybe I'm not puffy in the morning, even my eyes, I don't have as many bags. Overall, their gonna starts feeling difference before you actually see the results. If you reduce inflammation, which fat loss, lipolysis, dissolving that fat in the body is reducing inflammation because fat is inflammatory to the bodies. Yeah, correct. Looking at who is a good candidate, who tends to do really well with AOD? I think that anyone can be a candidate. I that if you have the motivation and the desire to achieve your weight loss goals or improve your healthy lifestyle, anyone is eligible for it.

But especially, typically who we see, again, are those who are just suffering, they'll come in and they're like, I don't understand. I'm doing all the right things, right? I am eating a clean diet, exercising, doing my muscle strengthening, sleeping well, just started bioidentical hormones with Jocelyn. You know, am doing these things but some things not, you know. Am doing the things right but am getting the wrong results. And so it's very, very frustrating for patients. And, so I want everyone to know, everyone will be given the opportunity to have their treatment plan reviewed and really AOD is a great second option or even a first option.

Like I discussed with one of my patients who's in perimenopause, a lot of peri-menopausal women, they just want to get rid of that 10 pound belly fat. They're not really concerned too about like reducing maybe their A1C or maybe they have insulin insensitivity.

Who AOD Is For and Lifestyle Requirements 16:58

They want lower their fasting insulin levels. No, they just want to lose that belly fat. So it's actually become it comes in to be very handy for my ladies in our program. Another good factor I want to mention too is having a health coach available too. I think in order for your plan to be successful, here at Forum Health, we have health coaches and our specific health Coach for Tampa is Amber Shuey and she is amazing. She just has a great rapport with patients and they're top cheerleader. You know, I've been in on her visits before, just foreshadowing in the beginning when I first started working here.

she has an amazing impact on patients. And this is almost like a reverse question. So we know that AOD is a good fit, especially for patients who are following those lifestyle factors. I would love to say that everyone is a good candidate, but we have to be careful. So patients who may have uncontrolled diabetes, and they may be on multiple medications, although AOD won't interact with those medications. You know, we are concerned that there could be some metabolic disturbances along with that. The same with severe cardiovascular disease.

Okay, We have To be Careful. Remember, were pulling fat out of your body. Your bloodstream the tank is going to be full with a lot of fatty acids rolling in. And that in itself could be a pro-inflammatory factor for some people. Uh, you know, during our plan, we usually explain too, how important, the hydration, that's going to be very important too. That if you're on it, really you need to flush out the tank to make sure that you don't have any residual buildup. Why is it so important that when you are starting a protocol that involves AOD, why are following like certain lifestyle principles and lifestyle changes so importantly?

Like why can't I, if I'm on Aod, Why can I go to McDonald's? I think that's a very natural reaction that people have, right? They want an easy fix or a quick fix. And I, you know, I did that in my practice with Fentermine where I would use it because, they had a wedding to go to and they just needed to lose the weight quickly or they knew they were going up, going on vacation. And they knew that they would be overeating and maybe not exercising as much. And so they will use us as quick fixes. But it's not to say that you're not going to lose weight if you are sedentary, if aren't eating a clean diet, but it is not gonna be optimal and it not a healthy way of losing weight.

We need to have things on hand, you know, the important things like having clean food, fresh food. Every time we put something in that may be processed, we're now going the opposite direction. You're not creating inflammation and now the AOD, it's got more work again to do. It's you're putting more stress on that peptide to the work and you are not going to achieve the results that you would expect. A lot of times when I used to talk to patients about this also, when you're looking for an AOD, I want to keep doing what I'm doing.

I like sitting on the couch or I am sedentary.I'm lookingfor something to give me quick results. Peptides, like we said in the beginning, are cellular messengers and they're going to signal to the cells to do work. And if you're not providing the environment for your body to accomplish that work, these are cellular messengers. Like you said, they're going to attach to receptor sites and they are going tell your to do all the things. But if your doesn't have the ingredients or the To do all the things that you're signaling it to do, you are not going to get the results you expect.

You'll get some results because you got some of the environment in place. But if you not putting all of your pieces of a puzzle together, You have an incomplete picture. That is so true. It's not meant as a replacement for lifestyle. In AOD, in the protocol, it strictly says this is for body composition as adjunctive with lifestyle modifications like diet and exercise. So talking about like results and expectations, what kind of expectations should people expect? How long or how quickly do patients think this works versus the reality of the situation?

I think that's an important concern to address because like I mentioned before about that quick fix, you know, people just want to, they may not be patient to give it some time. You know, the speed of weight loss is going to vary person and you know in AOD you will see, you may be disappointed in an AOD because you might not see the results. Like I said, You will feel the result before you see it. We use more of waist circumference measurements versus looking at the scale. These are the things that are going show us how well the peptide is working for you.

I think overall, I thing setting yourself up for realistic realistic expectations will help avoid feeling like a failure. So I think that everyone needs to be patient with themselves and say, okay, I'm going to allow this amount of time. And typically we are prescribing this medication for 12 to 14 weeks or 12-16 weeks. You could start seeing some results as early as four weeks, again, results does not equate the same as results to a GLP-1. The results may be I have less inflammation in four, weeks I feel great.

I can fit into those pair of pants or you know, or I looked on the scale and I did lose a couple pounds. It's not going to be as evident in the mirror that a GLP-1 will be. I have a love-hate relationship probably like most women out there with the Scale. You know this is also about body recomposition and like you said you could be feeling the results before you see the results, especially on the scale. Body recomposition, muscle weighs more than fat, okay? So if you lose a pound of fat but you gain two pounds of muscle, like if ever seen out there, maybe we can have somebody clip this in for us, but like five pounds fat is like big, it's big.

It's a lot, right? And two pounds of muscle, five pounds muscle is a lot leaner. So the scale might not be, it's a way to track progress for weight loss. Yes. But I really love our in-body scales. That actually shows you your body recomposition. It shows where. your muscle and your fat lie. It gives you how much muscle versus how fat you have in the body. That feels like a more realistic way to measure success with peptides like AOD that, yes, they help you lose weight with several different mechanisms of action, but they're also doing body recomposition.

We want you to build muscle, and lose fat. And if you're building muscle losing fat, that's not always going to translate on the scale. Place the scale in the garage while you're on AOD. Stop into the office and get your in-body done, right? Get your body composition right, love that. And like you said too, you guys are using other, like do your waist circumference. I used to do this with coaches too is doing bi-weekly or monthly check-ins and doing progress check ins where what was your energy like this past month?

And things that you are not going to necessarily notice on the Is your face less puffy? Do you have more energy? Your joints hurt less. There's a lot of non-scale wins. I think that's one of the big values of a coach is they're going to help you see those results and keep you going and on the right track as well. With AOD, what can patients do to actually improve their results while using Aod? There's a few things that need to be done. First, that protein intake is going to very important. The RDA was just recently changed.

Now, the recommended daily allowance is 0.5 to 0,7 grams per pound of body weight. So for most people, it's going equate to maybe 90 to 120 grams of protein a day. Obviously, if you're heavier and you over 200 pounds, you are looking at 200 grams protein. I think the greatest challenge really is how can I get that much protein in 24 hours, right?

Results, Expectations, and Body Composition 25:18

Not even 12, 24-hours, you know, in 12-18 hours before I go to bed. That's where I love our health coaches because Amber does a great job and really, she'll come up, but she comes up with these recipes too that, that's high in protein. And then of course, many of our products from Inwell, our Complete Cleanse, Total Reset, they already come with 20 grams of protein, Awesome. You know, you already started, Amber's already given me some ideas of where to go for healthier protein bars to choose from and great.

And so I just forward that information over to my patients and family too as well. The fiber is very important too, right? Because that will also help with transportation of fat out of the body and muscle training. So even though AOD is muscle sparing, just the combination of increasing muscle mass and flexibility also will help our joints. It increases your energy, it's going to help you sleep better at night, so they're all a win-win. So protein, fiber, strength training. I would say hydration too, because one of the big things with this is breaking down fat cells.

Toxins are stored in your fat. AOD is going to help dissolve, reduce, get rid of fat cells, right? So we're going be dispersing more toxins into the body. The liver has to be prepared for that. I love your suggestion for the complete cleanse because not only does it give that 20 grams of protein, but it also supplies all these nutrients to support phase one and phase two of liver detoxification. Brilliant, brilliant, So supporting the liver, supporting detox, you want to flush the toxins out of the system, right?

You want get them out. You don't want feel them anymore. Fantastic. Does sleep and stress really impact results that much? AOD and the daily five days on, two days off. Are they doing this at a certain time in the day? Do they have to do it on an empty stomach? Are there any other considerations when they're giving themselves this injection? Yes, we do prefer that it's given in morning on a empty-stomach. If they do have some GI upset, they would contact us. We can always give them a little Zofran in case they are a bit nauseated with it.

But typically a lot of times it is like we increase your fluid intake because again, maybe that's just you have the lipids that need to be flushed out. We try to look at other things. What other modalities can we use to help improve your symptoms? But for the most part, you know, if they stay well hydrated, they're eating clean. Usually if there's any side effects, the few people that I've already had them on, They've been tolerating it very well. It could be an alternative to GLP-1s if you're not finding success or if your stalled, those kind of things.

So alternative or an add-on to glp-ones is one way to look at it. When, going back to the injection, empty stomach in the morning, how long should somebody wait to have food then after they give themselves an injection? They can eat within about 60 minutes. It's fine. Just it works better in a fasting state, not that food is going to really cause any side effects for them. By being in fasting, it's going work better. Why is it important to work with a practitioner instead of just ordering this online?

Well, let's first talk about the online ordering because it can be done. I had a patient that told me that her husband ordered a peptide online. from China, we have to be careful. Any product that comes outside the US and that's called offshoring, there could be harmful ingredients that could added in there. Other countries may not be following the same rigorous standards that we do as far as what we're putting into our products and then the compound pharmacies that use. We want to make sure that they're top rated.

What's interesting is compound you know, testing and observation than any local Walgreens or CVS. And many people don't realize that, but they do. They have to meet state standards. So a practitioner, why is it important for us to have a practitioners? Because you need an expert. Okay. Again, if you go through, you may go down the street to a med spa and they may have it there. Okay, but how experienced are they? And they made the nurse practitioner TA because you have to be licensed in order to prescribe these peptides.

But, what's their years of experience? Who do they have? on board, what allied healthcare professionals do they have on-board to assist you on your journey? So you definitely want to make sure that you're with the provider. Are they following up with you? Are the giving you a personalized dose? are they in tune with what your side effects are? Do they understand your goals? Is it just a prescription and then I'll see you tomorrow? Or is it, let's talk about if this prescription is right for you and let us talk what else you need to make sure that you're doing in order to achieve

Dosing, Safety, and Working With a Practitioner 30:18

the results that your getting. And by the way, if you have this side effect, this effect and this other side effects, these are the tools that we have in our toolbox to help you with those. If you are using a practitioner, yay, you should, but two, are they engaged with you as a patient? Do they understand your final results? Are they asking you for a follow-up? are you kind of just set off and saying, here's the dosing protocol? Have fun. I'll see you in a few months. Are they following up with you?

Are you making sure that this is working for you and with your body? are you getting the right lifestyle and complementary protocols? This isn't just a pill for an ill. There are things that you are going to need to implement in life. Make sure you have on your side in order to achieve the results that your really, really looking for. That is so true. What is the biggest misconception you wish patients understood about peptides like AOD? Oh, that peptide are so dangerous. You know, I mean, honest, when I was in conventional medicine, and I'm like, what is all this hoopla about peptides and anti-aging and all that?

But you know this is what happens when we're not involved or taking the time to really do the research to find out more about it. because there's a lot of misleading information out there. And what's interesting is that, you know, insulin is one of the very first peptides that was made. That took a while even for the FDA to even approve that. So, things are slow when it comes to for for FDA approved things. Something could be sitting on the table for years before it's actually looked at. We're not going to prescribe any peptide unless it is safe.

Okay, that's number one. And we have enough research and data to support the safety of using peptides. I think one of the big misconceptions about peptide like AOD and like weight loss peptids for me is also, it's kind of like the pill for an illness. If you take this, here's the results that you're going to get. One of big misconception is like these peptidies are here is your solution and it is a tool that you have to, again, they're cellular messengers. You have I think expectations for patients is also kind of a misconception, like, I'm going to start taking this, and I'll start seeing results in like a week or two.

And to your point, setting up the right expectations, sending up a right lifestyle, making sure that your body is prepared for these, these things work and they work well, but it's not going work in an environment that is not conducive for the cellular messenger to get the worker V's in the body. to go and get the results that we're looking for. So I loved this podcast. This is going to be so, so helpful for so many people. Stay tuned for more everybody. We've got more peptides to discuss. Jocelyn, thank you so much for joining us today.

Thanks for having me, Amanda. And there you have it, folks. Hopefully this helped simplify some of the confusion around AOD 9604, what it is, how it works, and who it may be helpful for and what realistic expectations actually look like. Peptides can be an incredible tool in the right patient, but they work best when combined with the foundations, nutrition, movement, sleep, stress management, in overall metabolic health. If you're curious about learning more, don't forget to visit formhealth.com to find a practitioner near you.

And don' forget, we have just launched our new peptide consultations. Get in today. Thank you for joining us on the Forum Health Integrative Medicine podcast. Each episode, we help you understand your health from every angle and inspire your lifelong wellness journey. Follow the show, share it with someone who needs hope, leave a review, and take the next step toward feeling your best at forumhealth.com.