Heal Fatty Liver Naturally: Root Causes & Strategies

Introduction to Fatty Liver Disease 0:00

Welcome to the Chronic Inflammation Summit. I'm your host, Dr. David Jockers. And today we're talking all about fatty liver disease, in particular nonalcoholic fatty liver disease, which is one of the fastest growing chronic inflammatory health conditions in the Western world. We know that over 100 million Americans are dealing with fatty liver disease. Many people do not even know that they have excess amounts of visceral fat around their liver. They don't know the detrimental effects of fatty liver disease.

We're going to dive into that deeply in today's interview, and we're going to go through root cause factors for fatty liver disease as well as natural support strategies. My guest is Dr. Holly Lucille. She is a licensed naturopathic doctor, educator, consultant, television and radio host. And she's also written two great books. her her bestselling book is Creating and Maintaining Balance A Women's Guide to Safe Natural Hormone Health. And she is she has a passion, to to really help people with natural medicine.

And she's won several prestigious awards. And she's also on many different boards, including the chair of the Institute for Natural Medicine. And she's on staff at the Beverly Hills Institute of Precision Medicine. And she works with a company called Pure Health Research as well. and they make a great fatty liver product as well. And her website is drhollylucille.com That's D R H O L L Y L U C I L L E.COM And we're going to talk all about fatty liver disease. So let's go into the interview. Well Dr. Holly Lucille always great to connect with you.

And today we got an important topic fatty liver disease. One of the fastest growing conditions in the Western world. And again, most people don't even know that they've got all this excess visceral fat around their fat or around their liver, and around. Their fat. Yeah, exactly. That's right. Pat on that. Yeah. You got it. And so we want to do a deep dive. People really need to know about this. And more and more people are looking for information on fatty liver. So we had to do this podcast here this episode.

So let's do it okay. What is fatty liver and why is it such a big problem. Yeah it's a great topic and I think it's the American Liver Foundation actually estimated that over 100 million Americans now have a fatty liver. And you're right. I think, a big portion of them don't know it. And so to your point, what is it? I think the name pretty much lends itself to exactly what it is there is fat that builds up around this organ, and not only the organ itself, but inside the liver cells.

What Fatty Liver Is and Why It Matters 3:00

And so, it's a problem because the liver is so important in our lives, our daily lives. I mean, over 500 different functions. And when you build up fat around that organ and inside those cells, you know, there are specialized cells in the liver, they're called hepatocytes. Right. And those specialized cells have specialized enzymes. Just do a little jobs all the little 500 jobs. And so when the fat moves in it really starts to affect the way that organ. Functions. So overburdened and not so efficient.

And it becomes a huge slippery slope into other things. Yeah, absolutely. And so what are some of the main symptoms that somebody or signs signs and symptoms that somebody has. Fatty liver. Yeah. So unfortunately some of the symptoms can overlap quite a bit with other things. Right. So you're thinking about you have a hard time losing weight. You've kind of tried everything. you're fatigued for no sort of reason. Nothing really has changed. No stress levels have changed. no sleeping patterns have changed.

if it gets really bad, some of the signs, you might actually start to see some of that jaundice. See that yellowing of the eyes or what have you. you can get actually pain in the area from the inflammation that's being caused. but again, a lot of people don't know it. And these symptoms and signs sort of overlap with other things. And so usually how it's caught is on a blood test when somebody goes for let's say their normal yearly, physical and they run a complete metabolic panel. So you're going to have your liver enzymes in there, right.

They're kind of checking out your, your electrolytes in that panel. They'll check out your kidney function. They'll check out some heart stuff. if a lipid panel is run, but then they'll check out your liver, and that's where your liver enzymes are elevated. So if you think about it, in those specialized cells, these enzymes are working. And they're supposed to kind of stay in those specialized cells. But if the liver cells get damaged by fat or something else, those enzymes then will kind of trickle into our bloodstream.

And it makes sense. You'll get your blood drawn, and then those enzymes will be elevated in the blood. Really understanding that there's something going on with the liver. And then it's up to the doctor to go. In medicine there's called differential diagnosis. So why would this be. And so of course with a good intake, you know, have you been increasing your alcohol intake. have you traveled outside of the country. So there might be like a hepatitis or something going on. And so usually what follows that is an ultrasound.

And that is where we see on the ultrasound. I mean it's can't be missed. That liver that's supposed to be just nice and kind of functional and not supposed to look like a liver. It looks like a big blob of fat. And then that's where the definitive diagnosis comes in. Yeah. So is the fat kind of like almost like scar tissue there because the liver cells are becoming damaged. So they're spilling out their enzymes and their contents. And the fat almost is like coming in to take the place is like, is that basically what what was happening there?

I think that's a fair analogy. I really, really do it. Just I mean, if you think about fat anywhere, right, between the way it's completely just in the way and especially around an organ like that and inside those cells, it is very disruptive. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. And so, you know, one thing that I will tell people is if you have excess belly fat in general like it, you should be able to look down, you know, without bending your knees or anything and just be able to see your toes. If you have a protruding belly, okay.

And you can't see your toes, most likely you're developing fatty liver if you're not at the point where you're diagnosed yet. you are in the process of developing it now that doesn't go across the board where, you know, there are some individuals that are actually thin that are also developing a fatty liver. But we know if you have excess belly fat, you're in the process of developing it. So this is one of the reasons why metabolic health is such a key factor with this. and so that's one way, you know, just right at home that you can be looking at it before you even get liver enzymes or before you get any sort of lab testing.

Now, what are some of the key labs you mentioned? Liver enzymes. What do you like to see? You know, obviously they can be flagged high. is there like an optimal range when you're looking at bloodwork that you like to see the liver enzymes? I imagine you're talking about AST alt phosphatase GHT.

Symptoms, Diagnosis, and Lab Markers 8:00

Right. Is there an optimal range you like to see those in? Yeah. Well, first of all, I think this is a great point because I come across this a lot in my clinical practice. You know, different labs in different regions have different ranges. And so sometimes it's difficult. Right. But in reference range Lab labs you're going to have a range. And it's going to be, you know from like zero to something. what I usually like to do, if it's zero and we want it low like the liver enzymes, I wouldn't cut 20% off that that end, but I would cut 20% off the higher end.

And I like to. So that's kind of just my I like to see it more optimal. Vitamin D is a good example of that. Right? There's so many people that walk into my clinic and they have lab tests and hands, and my doctor says everything is fine and their vitamin D is like one click above rickets. Right? So it's like that range could be, let's say 34 to 100. They, they roll in at 35. Is that optimal. No it's not. And so I like to take those ranges 20% off that side 20% off that side. And we're looking at more optimal with those liver enzymes.

we actually want them quite low because we want them to be inside, you know, contained in those cells, doing all of those various functions. So what what kind of range are you typically looking at? If somebody were to come in to you, get some bloodwork done. where do you like to see that. The liver enzymes out. Again each each lab. So if they're using lab pork okay. Yeah. So labs is all different. So it's it's tough to say because I don't want to mislead anybody, but when you look at that range, we want it more optimal.

If it's high normal we also need to understand with blood testing it's very static, right. That that needle is in somebody's arm for 20s maybe. And so, you know, depending on the circumstances, that's just right. Then it's a snapshot. But where are they going if it's high normal or are they tending upwards. yeah. And so that or more optimal I would treat that high normal as hey, we should probably keep an eye on this and do some watchful waiting, but there is something going on because it's normal as it, as it relates to these ranges.

But is it normal and healthy for you? Yeah for sure. Yeah. I typically like to see in between 10 and 25 the ast alt somewhere in that range. GT alkaline phosphatase totally different range. Usually you're looking at that somewhere between like seven, you know, 60 and 90 or some, some somewhere around there. so you start to see all of them high, you start to know, hey, like there's some sort of damage going on here. And then other there's some other markers too, like I look at fasting insulin, especially when it comes to fatty liver.

Yeah. Because that's a big factor. Triglycerides right. That's a big list. Right. So yeah triglycerides is a big one. Because if you think about a tri three glycerol sugar or three sugar molecules on a fatty acid backbone, usually hand in hand, when I'm looking at a fatty liver situation, I see that triglyceride being elevated, that fasting insulin hemoglobin A1C2. Right. Yeah. So that average blood sugar over the last three months and you can get an elevated glucose. But you could be I mean I've had elevated glucose is and I've been fasting for 15 hours now.

Yeah. I happen to work out on that fast. Right. I also drove through L.A. Traffic on that fast. So my body's sort of taking care of me. My brain saying there's nothing coming in. We should probably tell the liver to kick out some people. Neo genesis. And that's why I like that air. Right. Because you're taking the fasting glucose times. Fasting insulin divided by 425. So it's like you're taking into account because glucose might be high but insulin's really low. It's not an issue. Right. If glucose is high in insulin's high then you have a problem.

Then you got that insulin resistance. Yes. Yeah that's a good point. You don't need me on the show. Why don't you just do this all by yourself? No, no, I enjoy the conversation, you know? So. And the banter that we have. Right. So. Yeah. but yeah, obviously, you know, looking at some of those factors I think is key when it, when it comes to lab work too, because a lot of times, you know, people are going to go in for the biopsy, you know, like and it takes a while for those liver enzymes to get to the point where they're clinically high.

You know, I mean, you and I specialize in actually catching fatty liver while it's developing before you get the actual, you know, disease process. And you have to go through the biopsy and all that kind of stuff, why don't we just catch it earlier, you know what I mean? And think about it. I mean, there's a subset of the population that are children who are not going in for an annual visit or who are not having these things. Right. But why? So let's talk about, the reasons why a fatty liver would happen.

You mentioned one obesity. That's certainly one of them. Yeah. Insulin resistance. Right. So those cells get resistant to insulin. So that insulin is going to be high in the bloodstream because it's not doing its job. And and you know, utilizing glucose and all of that stuff. But it's the high fat and especially high sugar diets. Right. We think about fatty livers like fat, fat, fat alcohol what have you medications perhaps. But really so NFL D right. Nonalcoholic fatty liver disease and so saturated fats trans fats refined sugars can all lead to of course, obesity and insulin resistance, which we've been talking about.

and then you've also to metabolic syndrome. Right. So a cluster of those conditions high blood pressure, high blood sugar, excess fat, abnormal cholesterol, all of those things we start to see. And then the end result would be the fatty liver. Yeah. And that's key that they have that distinction that distinction nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Because 50 years ago 56 years ago pretty much the only people with fatty liver were alcoholics, you know, so they had to create a new a new classification as we started, you know, basically consuming all these ultra processed foods.

and they became so prevalent. And obviously they're, they're hyper palatable. So we're eating a lot of them, you know, they're full of, high glycemic, high in slow genic, ingredients. And so now we're ending up with, you know, insulin resistance, metabolic disease, and, of course, you know, the fatty liver. And so but if, you know, you looked at talk to doctors back in the 1960s and you said, hey, what do you know about fatty liver disease? They would say, oh, it's alcoholics. It's exactly what they would say.

Yeah. And now it's like, you know, like like we talked about a hundred million Americans and. Oh, and I, you know, one of the things that I do when I travel is, I kind of do research and because I feel like a nice random, random slice of the population, right, is in the airports because you're getting people from everywhere. It's it's just like and what I have seen lately in children, the obesity rates in children and just actually just viewing it like sitting there waiting for a plane. Right. or waiting for a ride and just watching people.

I, I it it makes my heart hurt. And this is all 100% modifiable and it's diet related. Yeah. Yeah. When you understand what visceral fat is actually doing, how it's like choking off blood supply to to healthy tissues and spouting out inflammatory cytokines. And you see somebody that's got a protruding belly right. And, you know, I was just at the grocery store with my wife today. You know, we got four young kids. So when we do dates, a lot of times it's like practical dates, right? So we were doing some grocery shopping.

And I will tell you, you know, three fourths of the people, you know, I mean, you could clearly see the visceral fat, you know, on them and it's like, wow, you know, these people are just you know, their body is is destroying itself from the inside. So yeah, you're right. It's heartbreaking. And we see it everywhere. It's it's something. But the good news is we can do something about it. That's right. So let's talk about that. You know some of the main root cause obviously main one is insulin resistance, metabolic dysfunction that's that's taking place.

And so what do we do to go and go in the process of healing and repairing? Well, I mean, I think the foundational things that you and I always talk about are diet. Right? So I mean, really cleaning up that diet, getting some, help

Root Causes and Metabolic Risk Factors 16:00

if you need it as far as education and also adherence. Right. It's there's there's a lot of information out there about how you can eat healthily. Right. So balanced in fruits and vegetables and lean proteins and food quality, you know, being clean and all of that stuff. good. You know, cold water fish and polyphenols and antioxidants and, whole foods. Right? Just not processed. I think somebody asked me the other day about, all of the different, names that are used by the food industry to really kind of cover up that their sugar in the product.

And if I could speak to that and they're like over 50. And we did we had a nice conversation about all of them. I mean, high fructose corn sirup, sucrose, fructose, all of those things being there. But my point at the end of the conversation was like, if you are eating food that actually don't have a label, it's probably best for you, right? That's like the best. That's Whole foods, right? Whole non processed foods where you actually because that other thing is a food product. So I think that that diet is certainly super important.

I mean limiting alcohol consumption goes without saying. Definitely if there is a weight loss desire or a weight loss need, controlling that weight is going to help 100%. so moving and exercise to help with that. And as well, I think reducing exposures to as many toxins as we can because I think the environment is another contributing factor. Right? We think about products and toxins in the air that we breathe, in, the water that we drink in the food that we eat. And so making sure that those things are mitigated as much as possible are certainly a good start.

And then, you know, there are healthy, natural ingredients and products out there that can really help with this situation. Yeah. So let's go into that. So we want a clean diet. you know I always say try to maximize nutrients, minimize toxins. Right. So as organic as much as possible animal products, grass fed organic as much as possible, as much as you can. You can follow the dirty Dozen clean 15 by the Environmental working group. which is a good guide, right? And like EWG dawg, I don't think that there is a patient that I see or a podcast or show that I'm on that board does not come up.

It's a valuable resource. Valuable resource, invaluable resource. Yes. And I'll tell people, you know, just as a general rule, if you're going to eat the outer layer of the produce like a blueberry or strawberry, then it's easy for the pests to penetrate. Therefore, they spray it with a lot more chemicals. If it's, like if it has a hard outer peel that you're going to peel off, you don't want to eat it like an onion or avocado, then it's going to have let you know less pests, right? Less predators in a sense, and then less less pat less pesticide herbicides.

So that's kind of the general rule, to follow as far as that goes. If you don't, you know, download that guide. But yeah, as clean a diet as possible, clean a lifestyle as possible, clean up your area, water quality, you know, water filtration, air filtration I think it's all really good. Be careful about what you're putting on your skin as well. a lot of people are putting a lot of chemicals on their skin. I always say, you gotta pick your poisons. I don't I'm not saying you got to get rid of everything.

There might be, like, a certain type. like, for me, it's shaving cream. I got to get the foundation. Shaving cream. Yeah, but, you know, it's one of those things. Pick your poisons, try to limit them as much as possible and be, you know, acknowledge that they are a poison. So that way, you know, you can limit your overall exposure. Yeah. You know, and also has that cosmetic database where you can actually that's. Good. Input your cosmetics are using. I mean, I think it's an old adage is if you know better you do better.

And it took me a while. I mean, you know, as well as I even started because I live in this world, getting more and more familiar with how many things have so many toxins. And you're right, our skin penetrable right. You can put it on there and then. Then it absorbs right in there into your bloodstream, and then your liver has to process it. So it's just one more thing. And that, that cosmetic database. Amazing. Because cosmetics, lipstick, you know, foundation sunscreen even it goes on your skin.

And so those products need to be clean for sure. Yeah. Great great advice. So let's talk about some of your favorite herbs and nutritional compounds to you that will help with liver function. I think my favorite is milk thistle. milk thistle. Salmon is the active ingredient in it. It's known for its potential antioxidant properties. it is used. It can be used in, it is it's so powerful in helping. It's a paddle. Protect it. Right. So it can protect the liver as prevention, but it also can actually induce protein synthesis.

So your liver can regenerate new healthy cells. But it's protective and it's curative at the same time. Curative is a strong word. So but milk thistle is one of my favorite. Yeah I would say it's the most well-studied herb out there for liver function. Right. For helping to regenerate liver cells. Also really good for the gut, good for the kidneys. Right. Has other, you know, benefits that go along with that milk thistle is great. and I always say bitter is good for the liver. Now, most people have never had milk thistle, but it is a bitter herb.

And there are other bitters as well. That's that helps support overall liver function. So milk thistle anytime you if you're looking for like hey I want to find a supplement that like is liver based, I'd say pretty much just about all of them. Unless it's like, you know, like a liver organ supplement, pretty much all of them are going to have milk. This all because it's so well studied and it really works. Top up there. And you know what I have done before I will get the organic milk thistle seeds.

because, you know, a lot of times I'll have people use your beverage as your medicine. Right. So green tea polyphenols, red clover for women if you need it. But it also use your snacks as your medicine too. And so these milk this will seeds. They're a little bitter. But if they're around and kind of out in the kitchen like pistachios would be on grab. And it's and people do like that kind of that fixation of, of eating something. Right. And so it's just a nice thing to do and it's, it's there and it's healthy.

So those milk thistle seeds you can actually get whole. so that's a fun little way to augment a supplementation is, you know. Have to try that out. And, you know, when you're having that bitterness in your mouth, kind of like ginger, like the pungent ness that actually stimulating your vagus nerve. So it's great thing to do before your meal because that will help activate stomach acid bile production as well as digestive enzymes. Support to get you ready for a meal. One of the things I'll have people do sometimes is, you know, chew on a little bit of ginger root before their meal.

So this will seed. You can do as well. And it's probably a little bit

Diet, Toxins, and Lifestyle Changes 23:00

more palatable in there than the ginger, because the ginger is pretty strong there. And then I think my second and maybe even close to being as well, my favorite is you, you got to say tumeric or the active ingredient is, curcumin. yeah. As a layperson term, like just curcumin. So anti-inflammatory. Antioch oxidants helps in so many ways. I mean, this is one another big studied ingredient. aids in digestion, as you said, also really important for reducing high cholesterol levels. one of the things I love about curcumin, and I always say, and this is also something that I love about plants in general, when you're using them medicinally, like let's say you have, a medication like Cox two inhibitor, what does it do?

It does one thing. It inhibits the Cox two enzyme. So for pain, right. If you're looking at curcumin you're looking at its ability to touch over 100 molecular targets. And that is why, you know, people have accused me of like, oh you always. Use that. Like that. You're a one trick pony or what have you. And I'm like, well, no, there's just several hundreds of applications that are evidence based for, tumeric and curcumin, the active medicinal ingredient. But that's definitely one of them. That would be really important for a fatty liver.

Yeah. For sure. I always think about tumeric. And like you said, curcumin. When I think about inflammation, one of the best terms well study you talking about well study with milk. This or tumeric is really well studied for reducing inflammation in the body. And inflammation plays a huge role in fatty liver disease. And so, you know, just going back to that idea of you know, bitter is good for your liver. So you got things like dandelion for. Example, in wine. Yeah. Another bitter. You got it. So any of those.

Do I do a dandelion leaf. Right. So we think about this as a weed. And I think there's a famous saying out there that a weed is just, is just a medicine not yet discovered. Right. So I will get organic dandelion leaves and make, the green juice out of them with a little bit of ginger and lemons. It parsley and cilantro. sometimes I get it really right where I can actually drink it down. sometimes it's a little bit too pungent and bitter. but all of those things are really important. Dandelion is great. I think artichoke extract, too, is really important to have on board for this.

There's many. And and when you're looking at a liver supplement, that combination synergistic ingredient to get the whole job done, I think is instead of just a standalone is really important. Yeah, I think that's important. And those bitters, they thin the bile, which is so important because bile not only is a key for fat emulsification, so we need it to emulsify fats be able to break them down, digest them, absorb fat soluble nutrients like vitamin A, D and vitamin K, but also that bile flow is really key for sterilizing the small intestine as antimicrobial effect.

and so it helps to sterilize the small intestine. We don't have good bile flow. We end up oftentimes with a microbial overgrowth in the in the small intestine and poor nutrient absorption and more inflammation from the gut. So all those bitters like you were talking about really help with thinning that bile, getting it to flow in the bile also carries out toxins, right? Yeah. So super important for carrying out toxins as well. Keep it moving. Yeah. We want things moving like a river through our body.

Not like a stagnant pond. Piles not flowing well, things are going to stagnate, rot, petrify. You're going to get all these endotoxins going to obviously create a really unhealthy environment inside of your body. So super key there. are there other compounds outside of maybe some of those herbs that you talked about? maybe perhaps some amino acids? What do you think of like, I mean, the liver needs a ton of different amino acids. What are some of your favorite amino acids when it comes to liver health?

I mean, glutathione is my my go to, I mean, and and I would say the building blocks of good time as well. You know, I do a lot of testing just because of the variety of people that I see and the amount of people that have, low glutathione levels. It is a lot to me. And also then, I mean, it just it basically decreases their ability to process all of these, environmental toxins we've been talking about and as well, estrogen, you know, estrogen. It's weird. Our body does look at estrogen as a toxin, and it does have to be metabolize, is broken down and then eliminated.

Three different pathways deliver the good, the bad or the ugly. And so glutathione, just comes to my mind absolutely 100%. And then, you know, and it's the building blocks. Yeah. Cysteine. You know, glutathione is three different amino acids. Assisting is the let's consider the rate limiting amino acid. That's the one that in a sense we need more of in order to produce the amount of glutathione that we need. So, you know, if you're looking for a good liver supplement, you want something that has cysteine, right, with the L form a cysteine or an acetylcysteine something along those lines.

Now how about glycine? Glycine. Play it. Play a key role here as well. Oh I think glycine would be an incredible. Absolutely. Yeah. Real key also for Liberty Talks and the production of glutathione as well. As lysine glutamine I would throw in there 100%. Yeah yeah yeah. And glutamine also crosses over and has great benefits for gut health and immune health too. So that's another really good one. Now outside of IRBs nutrients, is there anything else that you're having people do like castor oil packs or, coffee enemas or anything like that in order to help support liver health?

Yeah. Castor oil packs are really a go to. It's an old advocacy remedy. you'd sort of look at castor oil as a counter irritant. And so it kind of brings immune enhancing cells to anything it's placed over. And so, you know, easy to do a wolf flannel pack, castor oil right over that liver, which is right under its big organ, right under your right breast area and their. Upper upper right quadrant. Upper right corner. Yep. Right there. Right, right out of the pack or the breast. Yep, yep. So they're a little bit messy.

But if you get it down and can contain it it is so effective. And so what I'll do often is I have a solar sauna from sunlight and so I'll lie in there. I'll put my castor oil pack on and that's for general health maintenance. Right. I'm just like, I don't have a fatty liver. I would say as far as I know, but I actually know I don't have a fatty liver. Yeah, but in the sauna with the castor oil pack, it's a it's a passive way. Right. So people get fatigued with a lot of the things that I ask them to do.

Because we're talking about dietary modifications. We're talking about lifestyle modifications, we're talking about, hey, I want you to change some of the products that you've been using forever. so there's a lot, right? Oh, and now you're having pill fatigue or what have you. So in order to get the adherence, I like those passive things.

Herbs and Nutrients for Liver Support 30:00

So obviously in a sauna, when you're sweating things out, it does help stimulate detoxification through your largest detoxification organ. And that is your skin. And then also just that passive way of having a castor oil pack. I think it's a great point. Yeah. And I like what you're talking about there because you're stacking different bio hacks. Right. It's nice when you're able to take two really well, you know, well evaluated kind of proven, strategies, you know, and I always call them advanced strategies because, you know, they're, they're, they're kind of add ons oftentimes after we eliminate the bad foods, change the diet, start adding into key supplements.

It's nice when we're able to stack two of them together. So you're, in a sense, two birds with one stone. So I like that idea. and here I can give you this one. Feed two birds with one crumb. Yeah. There you go. I've been trying to get away. And it's amazing that how many violent analogies we have, like, there's one, but. So it's like, there's more than two ways to skin a cat. And I'm like, well, there's more. That is the pedicab. But the wind. Wants to get a cat, right? Yeah. The one that I can't get away from that works so well.

And it might even in this particular situation is with genetics. I've always said your genetics can load the gun, but your lifestyle pulls the trigger. Right. And I haven't been able to swap that one out yet. But, there could be a genetic predisposition for this. and, you know, a certain risk in developing fatty liver. But to my point, your DNA does not have to become your destiny, right? I was talking to a woman yesterday. She and her kids. Well, she has expressed the disease of ankylosing spondylitis, and she had her kids tested.

And they have a variant of this gene. Right. But my education for her was it doesn't necessarily mean that that disease is going to be expressed with them. And here are some things that you know, right. Knowledge is power. What can we do about it to perhaps kind of clean up that gene, turn it on, turn it off. and it doesn't have to do that. So, that's another analogy that I'm working on. Maybe your biography doesn't have biology, doesn't have to be your biography or vice versa. I'm going to work on it, but I've been trying to get rid of all our very violent analogies that we have.

Yeah, that's really good. And, you know, we're we're speaking about liver. So I think actually the idea of like getting rid of violent analogy is a good idea because in Chinese medicine the liver is a seed of anger. And so in Chinese medicine they would say, if you have a liver issue, you probably are holding on to bitterness, anger, frustration. Maybe you have an anger issue or you're holding on to bitterness and unforgiveness. Yeah, it's a great point. I mean, I will tell you, every time I drive in Los Angeles traffic to my acupuncturist.

I ask her in almost in jest, in joking, I have a liver. She rising right now because it was it was so difficult on getting here. You know, you live a mile and a half away, and it took me 25 minutes though, so we should get on the table right now. Right? But you're right. Liver and anger go right together. And Chinese medicine. Yeah. So. Absolutely. So that's a great thing to be able to just check in with yourself, you know, because the more that you're holding on to anger, bitterness, you know, all of us experience that.

But, you know, we need to process it and let it go more that we're holding onto those things. And we're we're stressing the liver, which is our key detoxification organ right now. We're going to hold on to toxins, and we're going to create a really unhealthy internal environment. And then think about when people are actively drinking. Right. Like maybe even going on a bender or just maybe having 4 or 5 drinks at a party. They get home and all of a sudden the fight erupts with the spouse, right? Or there's the I call it a short fuze syndrome.

Right? So it's like, so that's an active liver being barraged by Etowah or ethanol. Right. Or that that ingredient in alcohol that the liver has to work so hard in processing and can do it just fine with some time. But if you are just like drink after drink after drink after drink, not allowing those poisons and toxins to be burned off and metabolize appropriately, then it's going to build up and the liver is going to get angry. And so are you. Yeah, it's going to be a big problem. And so, how about hydration?

How big a role does hydration play when it comes to help and support the liver? I think huge, huge I think staying hydrated, I as I continue on in this process of life, I feel like a lot of clinical complaints people have that you can't really put your finger on. Right. But if they would just really stay hydrated, some of those things would get like fatigue, hunger, irritability. I've done a test myself because I, you know, the same thing with other people when you let's say you're at the office and you always have your water bottle and like, oh, the, the, the water cooler is right there and you're kind of stay hydrated.

And then on the weekends you're out fussing about and you are out of that routine. I've done it myself and I'm why do I feel so lumpy right now? And I go back and I just do a small little autopsy of my day. I haven't really you know, I worked out, I sweat and moving about the cabin, doing a lot of things, and I have not stayed hydrated. As soon as I rehydrate that feeling of like, what is going on so much better? Oh yeah. I mean, goes back to the idea to of just keeping everything moving like a river.

You know, people will say, you know, I get them started on a, on a plan and they're like doctor Jockers. Like, I feel a lot better, but I got to pee every hour and I'm like, well, that's good. I mean, you got to pee and poop the toxins out, right? That's how that's one of the main ways your body eliminates some, along with rest aeration. So breathing and then, you know, perspiration. Right. You mentioned the sauna. So sweating is how we eliminate the toxins. We don't want to let them just sit in the body.

So hydration is key. What do you think of, like, warm lemon water in the morning or something along those lines? I think it's great. I mean, lemon, obviously very stimulating.

Hydration, Movement, and Daily Habits 36:00

You talk about bile keeping that river flowing and also whatever it is for the individual to actually get it in. You know, some people will say, I don't like the taste of water. Well, let's change up the taste. What can we do? You know, let's get creative. I always say just put it in your way. Just put it in your way. but I think warm lemon water is a lovely way. Perhaps. Maybe swapping out another hack, for coffee. That's not organic, right? That has been sprayed with a lot of pesticides. caffeine that's going to burn the liver even further.

And also the adrenals. it's a it's I think it's a great habit to get into and it feels good and it stimulates peristalsis as well. Yeah. Absolutely. So that warm lemon water. Good idea in the morning or herbal tea. You know, warm drinks in general going to help stimulate the vagus nerve. Right. And that's going to help in a sense open up the liver, help the liver to function better. So I think that's a that's a really good hack, really good strategy. Now how about just yeah. Just how about just movement in general is movement going for a walk.

Right. Or something like that. How does that support the liver? I mean, going for a walk, lifting weights, doing a session of hit training, maybe even getting up and walking up a hill back down up a hill, back down. look, you've got you got the river flowing there again, right? You've got natural endorphins that are going. You're going to feel better. You've got your lymph flowing. everything is moving. You're waking your cells up. And it's like, if you haven't moved in a while and you start doing it, your body is like, oh, let's go.

All right, we got. Yeah. And I think it's it's it's a great lifestyle piece of this, of this puzzle for sure. Yeah, absolutely. So we just gave the listeners a lot of great strategy is great recommendations right there. And really honestly like starting to put this together. You know, hopefully it's not overwhelming. I think, you know, just taking a few pieces out of this, really making the nutrition changes, finding a good liver support, liver health supplement, I think is really helpful. It's one of the key ones that I put a lot of people on to get started with, because the liver such an important system to get working right when you're trying to overcome it, really any sort of chronic inflammatory condition and optimize your health.

Yeah. And then following the healthy lifestyle practices like we've been talking about. And I'll tell you, the payoff is huge because I have seen people do this work and clean themselves up, right from all the little aspects we've been talking about. And their face changes, their eyes change. There's a brightness back, there's a vitality there. There's a softness back. It's not. So why do you look so tired all the time? You know, kind of worn down. when people start cleaning up their liver with all of the habits that we just talked about.

it's like one plus one plus one equals like 80, right? You can start doing a little bit of this and doing a little bit, getting a good liver health supplement on board, watching what you're eating, eliminating and reducing toxins as much as possible. All of a sudden it's like your appearance changes and it makes

Final Takeaways and Closing Remarks 39:00

a huge difference for people. Yeah, really, really good stuff. guys, you can check out Dr. Holly, drhollylucille.com That's her website. And, she's a wealth of knowledge. Thanks so much for your time, Dr. Holly, any last words of inspiration here for our audience and those that are looking to really dramatically improve their liver health? I would say keep staying tuned to Dr. Jockers and everything he does, because you got to go in on that. Thank you for that. He meant it. That. Absolutely. All right.

Well, thanks so much, Dr. Holly. Until next time. and for all the listeners, we'll see you guys on a future interview and be blessed. Yeah. Thank you.