Improve Insulin Sensitivity With Plant Power

Introduction to Robby Barbaro and Mastering Diabetes 0:00

Hi everyone. Welcome to this episode of the Reversing Type 2 Diabetes Summit 2.0 edition Today, it's my distinct honor to interview Robby Barbaro. He's part of the team, a key part of the team, in fact, a co-founder with Cyrus Khambatta of Mastering Diabetes. And he has his own lived experiences with the realities of Type one diabetes. I've invited him specifically to give us a talk for this summit to learn more about many of the myths. And let's dispel the myth and nonsense that goes on. People get so much misinformation about human nutrition and its impacts.

And you know what we can eat and can't eat, particularly when it comes to plant based nutrition. I'm always amazed at the craziness that unfurls on social media and in regular media and Internet people's opinions. You know, your favorite auntie, your car mechanic, etc. Everybody is an expert on this, but actually they're not. So let's talk to a real expert. All right, Robby, welcome to our summit. It's so great to be here. Thank you so much for having me. I really, really just appreciate the work you're doing and the impact you're having.

So it's great to be part of your summit. Thank you so much. Would you give us a thumbnail overview of your wonderful background? You have a lot of interesting things that are true about what you bring to this work. I want to make make sure that people know what a wonderful expert you are. Yeah, well, thank you so much. I appreciate the kind words. And I know you're focusing on reversing Type 2 diabetes here, and I'm living with type 1, but the work that Cyrus and I do at Mastering Diabetes is really connecting all the various forms of diabetes through the lens of insulin resistance and maximizing insulin sensitivity.

So as a person living with type 1 diabetes, I and all the others out there living with insulin dependent diabetes were all great test subjects for what lifestyle choices can make insulin work more efficiently or less efficiently. So I get to see that in my daily life. I was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes on January 26th of 2000. So it's over 24 years now that I've been living with Type 1 and I've been following the low fat, plant based whole food diet that we teach at Mastering diabetes now for over 18 years.

And in that time I've had a just a wonderful wealth of experience with being able to test different foods, different combination, different different activities and all the nuances of diabetes management to really see what lifestyle choices maximize insulin sensitivity. And I personally tried a, you know, a ketogenic, plant based diet before I switched to a low fat plant based off of a diet. And when I did that change, I saw my insulin

Robby's Type 1 Diabetes Journey and Insulin Sensitivity 2:51

sensitivity improve by 900%. And I want to be clear, we are not I'm not here to say anything negative about low carb diets. Who or low carb folks are doing it. There's actually a lot of really good research out there about how not a low carb diets are the same and actually low carb diets where you are incorporating more plant material, more fiber, have far better outcomes than low carb diets that are eating foods, more like processed meats and processed foods. So not no diet is no dietary category can just be you have a blanket statement say, oh, this is good, this is bad.

Right? But what we teach is very, very clear. The one thing I again, that good or bad, which is scientifically true, is that there is there is one way to make insulin work the most efficiently. And through my personal experience and through Cyrus's personal experience and the work we do, we are showing that it's low fat plant based nutrition, moving your body and then doing all the things that everybody agrees on, Right? It's the sleep, it's the reducing your stress. And everybody agrees of walking.

Everybody agrees with adding more fiber like there's so much agreement. But then there's just not that overarching disagreement when it comes to like, okay, what carbohydrates can I eat? How much can I stuff? I'm sure we're going to talk about that today. But I really you know, my personal experience is is living with type 1, using insulin, using a physiologically normal amount of insulin. So if you're living with type 1, your goal, if you're living with any form of insulin dependent diabetes, any situation where your pancreas is compromised and not not producing enough of its own insulin, then in that case, your goal is simply to inject what your pancreas would have normally secreted.

That's the goal. So I'm eating well over 700 grams of total carbohydrate per day and I'm injecting somewhere between 20 and 30 units of insulin per day, depending on my activity. So I'm also a Ironman triathlete, so I did three Ironman in 2023 and I'll be doing a couple more in 2024. So moving my body is something that my dietary choices have really given me the energy to do, and I want that for everybody else as well. But I use a physiologically normal amount of insulin. I wear a continuous glucose monitor.

So this shows, okay, how well is my blood glucose control over a 24 hour period? Right. So A1C was historically the best tool for indicating our overall level of blood glucose control over a given period of time. Now, with this new technology, time in range has surpassed A1C as the most accurate tool to indicate somebody's blood glucose control. Because when you look at a CGM, you can see the percent of time that somebody spent below the target range, which for the diabetes consensus is for type 1 diabetes to be between 70 and 180 a minimum of 70% of of the time.

That's the goal. So what that means, and they want to minimize the lows. So no more than 4% in the low category. And so you could have a really great A1C have a lot of lows and a lot of highs on this huge rollercoaster. And that's not a true indicator of of, you know, an intelligent way to be managing diabetes. That's that's not safe. The time and range. You can't hide, you know you can't you can't get any any fake numbers there like it's just telling you the full story. So my time and rate is consistently above 85% and my percent of lows is 4% or lower over any given 90 day period of time.

So I'm I'm doing something that it really is very counterintuitive to have. Most people think is the smart thing to do for diabetes. Right? I'm eating a lot of fruit, a lot of carbohydrate, but I'm using a really healthy normal to a lot of people are shockingly small amount of insulin and exhibiting excellent blood glucose control. And my blood work across the board is healthy. I'm I'm 35 years old, so you probably expect some good numbers at this point. But, you know, my cholesterol, my triglycerides, all that stuff is perfectly in range.

There's no no indications of things going arriver. And I'm also proud to say in over 24 years of living with type 1 diabetes, I've never been hospitalized. I've never had any incidents like that. So I just feel really confident about my control. But more importantly, the fact that we can transmit this information to our clients, to the people who sign up for Mastering diabetes and for the program. It's not just me. It's not just me improving my instant sensitivity. It's not just Cyrus. We're using a very small amount of beans and for a large amount of carbohydrate, because we're using the scientific principles of becoming more insulin sensitive.

Yeah, I think this is a topic that does not get talked about. Enough people spend a fair amount of energy on insulin resistance, but we really want to focus on instead of the symptom, the thing we're trying to avoid, the thing that we want, which is insulin sensitivity. So thank you for that intro because I think it sets the frame beautifully. Now for as we go to dispel the myths, they are many when it comes to plant based approaches and some of these myths are really persistent. I am surprised that in this era it's still a big deal.

So in talking with you about this, looking at your information and just thinking about what would most serve this audience in the kinds of questions and comments I get, you know, social media people who replied to the email list that I have, etc., persistently, I see that there is confusion around

Protein Myths on a Plant-Based Diet 8:30

plant based protein whether or not people can get enough protein in general, do they have to combine, let's say, lentils with rice, for instance, or to get a complete protein? And I have more questions about protein. I'm going to ask some more stuff about body composition. But let's start with that plant based protein. Can an adult human get their needs met, get their needs met rather, with a plant based approach for an adequate, healthy amount of protein throughout their age span? Okay. So this is a great question.

It's it's absolutely mind boggling how much confusion has been generated about this topic. And the funny part about it is there's so much confusion, so much argument about a macronutrient for a which we don't actually experience problems as a society. We do. We don't have people that are being diagnosed with some element of protein deficiency. You know, kwashiorkor is when you basically are not eating enough calories. I think in food, but at large this is a truly non issue non-issue. Yet everybody is confused and chasing protein and concerned about protein, whereas the one thing we do have is we have we have obesity going on ravaging our country and people don't think twice about how much fat they're consuming.

This is very, very strange. But the simple answer is on a low fat, plant based whole food diet, you can absolutely eat. You can hit all of your protein targets. And to be clear, your protein targets could be all over the place. Even within the plant based world, you could decide, okay, I want to be an athlete, I want to be a bodybuilder. I'm going to like really increase my protein intake. Oh, no, I'm actually going to go on a low protein diet because I heard that actually helps me increase my instant sensitivity, which there's a lot of research indicating that is the case.

Too much protein can increase your blood glucose 4 to 6 hours after a meal, right? So people don't see it in the immediate short term, but it does end up raising their blood glucose later on. And by having large amounts of protein and consuming too much protein, it makes it more difficult to consume the high carbohydrate foods at at subsequent meals. Okay. So that spike is happening later that spike is leading to a little bit of insulin resistance, which then makes it more difficult to then eat carbohydrate foods at any given meal because then you will see that's that spike immediately.

Right. But when you're doing that, you add a bunch of protein to a meal and you're trying to keep it low carb, you're still going to see a delayed spike. All right. So that's a big thing that happens with protein and blood glucose control. It's all very, very short term focused. Right? So what you see on the social media is, okay. And and what you see is a lot of people getting these continuous glucose monitors and all these devices who don't even have diabetes. And you have this this whole group talking about, okay, what do I have to do to make sure my blood glucose is as flat as possible after I eat a meal that's their goal.

And they see if even see even a little blip and it goes up to like 141 3150 People are just very scared, that's all. I have the spike in that food is bad for me and they're really missing the point that that a blood glucose elevation is normal. It should come back down to 3 hours after the meal. Absolutely. But this this ebb and flow is part of human physiology. It's normal, it's healthy. So what's happening is people are they're chasing this very short term results, like, okay, I'm going to add more fat and more protein to my meal to try and flatten out that curve.

And it does work, right? They will see that result and that's what makes diabetes so confusing in a lot of cases. And blood glucose so confusing because it does work in the short term. But like I just said, the more you do that, the more you're increasing your fan protein at a meal, the less you are able to eat the carbohydrate rich foods at other meals. That's what's happening. You're you're really trading a short term result and losing the bigger picture, the long term situation of being able to genuinely be insulin sensitive.

And if anybody really wanted to test this, they could do a oral glucose tolerance test and you could really see what's going on. So a lot of times in the low carb world, you'll hear people really, really advocating for a super, super low carb diet. And yes, if you keep that carbohydrate super low and you don't venture into eating some blueberries or some potatoes or some some beans and stuff, then you can keep that flat. But the moment you do have a glucose challenge, whether that is trying to eat a banana or mango or just going getting an official oral glucose tolerance test, that person would technically test as living with either prediabetes or Type 2 diabetes.

And then of course, the response is, oh, that's just physiological insulin resistance. And they're like, Well, if we just changed our diet, we can go to the test and get a different result. And we're saying, yes, you're right. Why not always live in an insulin resistance state, right? Why live in a state of physiologic wants and resistance? We don't suggest that, especially when it comes to long term society. So can you get all your amino acids? Can you reach your protein targets? Yes. So even if you ate just fruit and greens, if that's all you ate, fruit and greens, which are foods that people don't associate with being high protein.

Right. That fruits and greens, although I should say even like a thing like like lettuce or something actually is pretty high in fat and pretty high in protein, but it's so low in calories, nobody thinks of lettuce or even kale as like a high protein. These don't eat enough of it to to get a significant volume of protein. So anyways, even if you ate those foods, you are still going to land at somewhere around 67% of calories coming from protein, which that would be on a very, very, very low end of, you know, what most people are looking for.

But based on the tests that were run to figure out how much protein the humans need, that would actually suffice. You'd be just fine. Now when you start adding in other protein rich foods such as beans, you start adding in grains. Okay, So adding in some of these more commonly known plant based protein rich foods, you can easily start increasing your percentage of calories for protein up to 1015, 20 if you want to. And we recommend people use a software called Chronometer.

Individual Nutrition Differences and Tracking Data 15:30

It's a nutrition log and software. You get it for free. You can use my fitness pals, plenty of them out there. But if you have this concern, I highly recommend you just handle it through your own objective data entry and just put in a bunch of meals, put in a bunch of sample meals, put them in the software and he doesn't need this, me, that, or just literally just try it and do it and then just log your food as you're doing it and see, Oh wow, I got every single amino acid. I reach my overall protein requirements and wow, plants do have enough protein.

And if I wanted to tweak it a little more, I could add this, I could add that. And so it's really a non-issue. And the short answer to your question is yes. All right. All right. That's a great tour through the the land of the myths around this. You know, it's been interesting to just watch the nutrition wars that unfold and the confusion that goes with it and people start arguing about, is this the best form, etc.. And you know what's so interesting, Robby, I would love to get your thoughts on this.

I don't hear people talking about what should be obvious, which is by individual responses. Some people have more of a response and get more benefit from fill in the blank big macro category of nutrition. Whether that's going to be protein is going to be carbohydrates, especially the complex resistance, starch, slow burning kind or the healthy kinds of fats. Right. Some people get more, some people do better with less. I mean, we're not identical. What is the struggle that goes on with this? Because it goes across all aspects of health.

And certainly when we're talking about any kind of diabetes, this confusion is poor people often will start out or will persist with eating a kind of nutrition that is not kind to them. They're not getting their health results, you know? Yeah, it's so true. You know, I just looked up yesterday on Google is like how many people are living on the planet right now. Google told me 8.1 billion people. And I always like to say, even if everybody decided to eat a plant centered diet, there would still be 8.1 billion different ways to follow a plant based diet.

Now, I know not everybody wants to and everybody is going to, but let's just pretend they did. There are so many nuanced differences, so many ways to adjust a program within the parameters of seeking to maximize your internal sensitivity. Even within those parameters, there's an infinite number of ways to do things differently and gather the data. So the mass and diabetes method is something we wrote about in detail in our book, and it has four components. There's low fat, plant based health, food nutrition, there's intermittent fasting, there's daily movement, and then there are decision trees.

And number four, that's decisions which are very, very important. That is our version of a diabetes logbook where you write down the activities you're doing throughout the day, the foods you're eating, the medications you're using, the activity that you are like physical activity, exercise. You're putting it all on a sheet and seeing all happen in chronological order and you're going to be able to connect the dots and observe which choices are make me more insulin sensitive, and I see insulin sensitive.

And that is your opportunity to observe how certain foods, certain macronutrient ratios are working for you and helping you achieve your goals. And so that's a big part of our program. Now, that makes sense to me, right? Because then people can dial in what's true for them. I have another friend, a speaker on a prior summit who recommended that app phone ometer and friend. It's spelled cr0 no amit e r not chr0 no. Because I was astounded at first I couldn't find it. I know people sometimes like to check these things out, so make sure you got the right spelling for that app and you know, her advice was and I'm hearing you say the same thing too, is be curious, find out what works for your own health.

Enter the information, look at it objectively.

Fruit, Blood Sugar, and Fat Intake 19:30

Be clear about what your goals are, and then see if what you're doing is actually working. There is no such magical thing as one size fits all when it comes to human nutrition and I think I think people, they want that. They want that list, They want that check list. If I eat this, I know 100% of the time, regardless of whether or not I'm male or female in my pregnant, am I an athlete, Am I breastfeeding, am I recovering from major surgery, etc.? Right. Like they just want something that's going to fit at all moments in life and it's just not it's not true, folks.

You know. There's going to be nuances, There's going to be nuances and details are 100%. All right, Ravi. So as we continue our conversation, I'd love to know more about what your experience is with fruit. I know many people with Type 2 diabetes pre-diabetes are terrified of fruit and buy fruit. Friends, I'm not talking about peaches and heavy killing syrup. And I can no, I mean, honest to goodness, actual fruit. All right, Robby, take it away. This is a great question. And I understand why people are concerned and scared and frustrated because they have likely tried eating fruit and then they tested their finger on a bug glucose meter and saw 200, 300 or they saw it on their CGM and they're just like scratching their head being like, I love fruit, I want to have fruit.

It's something I've, you know, I've enjoyed in the past. And the data just shows me that it just doesn't work for me. So I'm just going to 90 fruit and that's unfortunate, that's frustrating. And that's where we go back to understanding that it's not the fruit's fault that you had that high blood glucose reading. It's not the banana, it's not the mango, it's not the whole peach, it's not the tangerine. It's the fact that you are living in a state of insulin resistance. Your body is at that. It's actually a warning sign.

It's a beautiful blessing. Warning sign for you to see that. Oh, wow, I can't actually eat a banana without seeing a bug because go above 200 are reading above 200. Right. If that's the case, that's a warning sign that you are living with the insulin resistance and you can decide to make changes so you can enjoy the fruit. So when you look at research on, you know, large groups of people over an extended period of time, whole fruit, the more whole fruit you consume, the more intense you become. The lower the rates of diabetes, the lower the complications if you're increasing your fruit consumption.

So we know that from epidemiological research. And the key point here is that fruit whole fruit is different than fruit juice. Whole fruit, the sugar found in that whole fruit is different than the sugar found in some sort of candy bar or some beverage, like high fructose corn syrup found in sodas and stuff like that. They're completely different. So again, something happens when it comes to research on fructose. Yes, fructose is has based on research has terrible outcomes. When you're eating it in the form of pastries and high fructose corn syrup and stuff like that.

But the fruit dose that's found in a whole banana, a whole mango comes in a package. And that package includes vitamins, minerals, antioxidants, phytochemicals, fiber and water, lots of fiber, lots of water. And that's a difference. So if you want to be able to enjoy fruit and see that you have excellent blood glucose readings after a meal that includes fruit or a snack that includes fruit, the key is it goes back to understanding how much dietary fat are you consuming and how much saturated fat are you consuming.

Those are the two biggest culprits when it comes to not allowing people to eat fruit because their insulin resistant. So at mass diabetes, we teach people to keep their fat intake under 15% of total calories. Okay. And another way to look at that would be just to not go over 30 grams per day. That'll work for most people. And again, the only way to really figure that out is through food logging software. You're not really going to be able to calculate and know how much you're consuming without the software because every whole food contains fat.

And not only does every hot food contain fat, it contains essential fatty acids in small quantities, and it's added up throughout the day. You can reach a significant amount of your essential fatty acid intake. We recommend a some ground up flaxseeds are ground up chia seeds in order to ensure that you meet your essential fatty acid requirements, especially on the omega three side. So it really comes down to decreasing your fat intake. And when you start to add fruit back into your lifestyle as you're becoming more insulin sensitive, don't expect this change to happen overnight.

Okay? So you're going to make sure to take some time to be decreasing your fat intake and slowly increasing your carbohydrate intake and making sure that you're having whole fruit, making sure that you are moving your body and making sure that you're eating at a reasonable pace. Right. So I don't care if you're insulin sensitive or not, you could be super insulin sensitive, but if you try and eat, you know, two mangoes in like 2 minutes, that's that's a lot for anybody's body to handle. So enjoy the fruit.

Take your time and mix it with greens and non-starchy vegetables. That's a huge tip that we work with, with our clients, and especially especially when you're working your way out of an insulin resistance state that that element of greens in non-starchy vegetables can help stabilize your blood glucose and you still get to enjoy those amazing fruits and the same thing when it comes to, let's say a fruit like grapes. So when you look at the glycemic index, there's only one or two fruits that are even on the very cusp of high, like the right between medium and high.

It's like watermelon, I think pineapple and maybe another I can't remember exactly, but even grapes, like if you put grapes in a salad, so you get some spinach, some arugula, some grapes, some mangoes, some scallions, and maybe throw some some chickpeas on there if you want to just or if it's just a fruit salad. Like for me, I would eat this. An actual salad. I read grapes, spinach, arugula, mango, white onion, scallion, some blueberries and some strawberries and some tomatoes. I'd say I got nine ingredients in that salad, so it's a pretty good mixture.

And so the grapes in context of that entire meal are not. That's a beautiful salad with a lot of other ingredients. So that's the issue with the glycemic index is that first off, we don't usually eat foods individually. And when you come when you combine the foods together, it changes how your blood glucose is going to interact. So I want people to if there are certain foods that you love, Eric I just I miss having those foods we like really teaching people how to get them back into their life. And so putting grapes in a salad is something we love to have people do.

There's so many varieties of grapes, really. Like, I just love them and I hope people, you know, don't remove them from their diet because they're insulin resistant. Yeah, exactly. You know, I think that the points you make here so helpful because you're laying it out and make it specific and we're meeting people where they're at. You know, often it's sometimes an issue of of not only just necessarily missing a taste or even cravings, but it could be an issue where maybe there's a cultural relationship to that food, there's a familial, you know, a social emotional relationship to that food.

And it could be that it's about portion. And one of the things I've noticed with highly refined, ultra processed foods is that portion control usually a strong right out the window. Bill, too, is designed to be over consumed. It's a it's a disaster. But when you're eating something, that's all food, real actual food, no chemicals.

Transitioning to a Low-Fat Plant-Based Diet 27:30

It's food, right. Nutrient dense. You know, it's got all of the goodness in it. People don't overeat. They also don't crave. And part of that balance, that relationship, I think that happens with fruit is some of us, particularly as kids, maybe we're used to eating fruit in a can with, you know, some kind of syrup or whatever, which was not actually fruit. And so our relationship to it has been so skewed. And if we're going to reclaim healthy relationship to food and reclaim healthy blood sugar, we have to be able to enjoy all of nature's bounty.

And so we need to have fruit and actual fruit, like I like to say, with fruit, with the skin on. So like no peaches and things that are peeled from their skin. The actual peach, Right. I love that. I love it. You're saying 100%. 100%. Yeah. Yeah. We've been set up to fail and we got to reclaim what I feel is everyone's birthright, which is to be healthy. But we have to be smart. We have to be savvy consumers because there's a massive amount of marketing and wild chemicals added to these other foods.

You know, if you look at the labels, I remember as a kid, food used to say things like it had, let's say, flour and it had oil. Usually it's butter or something like that. It was completely pronounceable. You understood what the oil was. It had salt, it had sugar, and that's all right. It had like four or five ingredients. Now there's 20 ingredients. It's all chemicals, lots of hyphens and dashes. You're like, What in the hell is that? And it's kind of a mess. And I maybe we shouldn't be surprised that there's been such a rise in the incidence of Type 2 diabetes pre-diabetes happening at younger and younger ages.

And we're also seeing an increase in type one and much older ages. It's just been crazy to watch this. It's so true. Yes, we are seeing these increases and it's sad and there are things we can do. And you're exactly right. These ingredients that we can't understand, we can't pronounce, they are it's unnecessary. You know, this is a really there are options for wildly delicious meals that can be prepared fast and easy. 2024 is one of the greatest times to be alive, to be doing a plant based diet in a convenient way.

So we are not against canned and packaged foods. It's about what's in those cans. You can just get really clean, simple, beautiful beans and chickpeas in a can. You can get pre cleaned the regular in a bag. You can get pre-cooked greens that come in a bag that you just have to heat up. Like there's so many amazing convenience items to make it happen. But these are whole natural foods prepared in a way to accommodate your lifestyle, put the right combinations, put the right sauces on top, and you can succeed and it can be wholesome and delicious and natural.

Absolutely. And it can look beautiful, too. Can have a feel for your eye as well as your tongue. I agree. I always say for eating like please don't suffer. Let's make sure our food is flavorful and rich and, you know, is going to affirm our life. So our health span equals our lifespan and that causes us to die early and horribly, right? Yes. All right. So now just thinking about where our conversation will need to go here before we wrap another thing that comes up is people go, okay, I'm all in.

I want to do a plant based diet. I understand the benefits to my blood sugar control. And I know that if I want good glycemic regulation, I need to have like a bridge strategy. And how do I get started, Right? So if someone wants to get started with eating a low fat diet, if their blood sugar begins to spike when they eat high carb foods, let's say like fruits, like what is the pacing? Because I know people get scared like you talk about if they start to see these spikes that are absolutely natural, physiologic, okay things, but they don't know how to interpret that data.

I love this question. It's something I talk about all the time, and I do a lot of live webinars and I have a section where I call mastering the transition. It's a really and this is exactly what you're asking. So number one is to realize that you are going through a transition. Okay? You are making lifestyle changes to solve a problem once and for all once, if you're going to solve this problem permanently. And so there are some bumps along the way. So don't get too stressed when you see a little bit of a higher reading.

Know that this is this is just a transition phase. So that's number one. Understand that. Number two is we help people make changes slow and steady. We think if you make too much lifestyle change at once, it becomes overwhelming. It doesn't even last. So our book and our coaching program, it's all designed to change one meal at a time. And as you're changing these meals, we are having you incorporate a significant amount of greens and non-starchy vegetables at every single meal. Okay. And we are encouraging people to incorporate more walking as much walking as you can do if you're living with diabetes.

The ideal time to walk is after a meal. That would be best it can be. It does not need to be rigorous. It could be just a couple of minutes. It could be up and down the stairs in your house. It could be a loop around your house. Something is better than nothing. So we're eating, we're making changes. Slowly, we're adding green and non-starchy vegetables. We're walking. And again, you're trying to eat at a reasonable pace. If you do these things and you consistently keep your fat intake low, that is the most important part.

If you can avoid the blips of like, Oh wow, one day I went and I just I couldn't help myself. I had to go have an entire bag of nuts and I had, you know, two avocados like that, that blip right there, You're going to you're going to have some consequences for several days after at least. Okay. And so if we can consistently keep the diet low, in fact, under 15% of total calories, you are going to consistently see your insulin sensitivity increasing and you're going to soon enough

Final Advice and Encouragement 33:00

get that experience of like, oh, my gosh, I just ate a whole mango. I loved every bite. It was juicy, was delicious, and my blood glucose profile was absolutely natural and normal, and I feel good about it. It just takes a little bit of time. It could take days, it could take weeks, but you will get there slow and steady. That's what wins the race. Absolutely. I love I love, love, love. The message here, Robby, you know, that was great. So friends, wind it back, if you need to rehear that slow and steady wins the race.

You didn't get into trouble overnight and you're not going to get out overnight. You can get out quickly. And then over the course of weeks and months, absolutely doable. Absolutely. That's not crazy at all. But on the other side of it, to expect that within 24 hours all problems are solved is not realistic. Well said well said All right, Robby, any final words you'd like to share with us before we end our interview? I just want to encourage people to take action, whatever it is, Don't ever warm yourself. Don't, don't.

And it's a lot of information, a lot of people saying different things. Just pick what resonates with you and just start taking action. You will never regret that day when you move your body and you eat that healthy salad, right? So start making steps in the right direction and know that it will pay off in the long term and really have a lot of compassion and self love along the journey and you will achieve your goals. Fantastic. Thank you so much for being such a wonderful guest here on reversing Type 2 Diabetes Summit.

So, friends, please be kind to yourself. Remember, you know, you're with yourself 24/7. Learn to be your own best friend, your best advocate. And if you get discouraged or if you get off track or if life is unkind, that's okay. Things happen. Just pick yourself back up, get your community around you, and join us on this journey. We can turn these trends around, but we're going to need to be really mindful about it. Thank you everyone, for your time and attention.