Spoil Your Baby Ep 29 – Trusting Your Own Intuition with Kelly Yefet

Introducing Kelly and the podcast 0:00

you are guilty of babying her. And I was like, my baby? Yes, I do baby my babies. It was just a moment of like oh you don't consider your baby a baby. Yeah. it's in the crib for more hours a day than it is with anyone. Yes I will baby her for as long as she allows me to baby because she needs that. Welcome to Spoil Your Baby podcast. I am very excited to be here today with my sister-in-law, Kelly Yuppett. She is a new mom, an entrepreneur, and amazing mom and business person and human in general.

And we've known each other for 17 or 18 years. Most of my life. And Kelly was also in my lab during my PhD. She is, you're the second author on one of my papers. I know. Can't believe you did that. So amazing. You did a lot of work. Okay, always give all my students the most credit I can. And we're going to talk about your experience in motherhood today. Thank you so much for being here. Thanks for having me on and for teaching me how to raise Noah the way I am. I wouldn't have done it without you I keep telling you it's the Greer Method.

Yeah, I should call the podcast The Grear Method yeah. trademark that. They mark it. Um, yeah, i mean, your baby is the most incredible baby as all babies are the Most Incredible Baby, but obviously I'm partial to her.

Pregnancy expectations and traditional parenting views 1:34

And I wanted to have you on today to kind of give moms an idea of what it's like to fully embrace a high-nurture approach. And I think it just gives people confidence and connection when they hear other people are going through this too, because so many people, you may be included, like you have some people in your life, but so people people who aren't sleep training or who are you know, taking the approach and you and I have had so many conversations about like, what makes this different because people ask you.

So we'll, we're talking about that too. Let's start with pregnant Kelly and Corey, your husband. What did you guys think having a baby was going to be like? What were you expecting? Tell us a little bit about your pre-baby mindset. It's such a blur now thinking back. But I'll tell you what I didn't think. I did not think I would raise Noah. in any way like the way I am. I had really strong opinions about how I was going to raise her and that included, I kept saying I don't want to have a baby and it flipped my life upside down.

Like I wanted her to be part of my, life I didn't, want my to become hers, which I still think that ended up being the case but in a very different like method of how, I thought I would definitely sleep train her. She would be in the stroller. I just thought, like, I'd love her unconditionally, but I was very much of the traditional mindset, because that's what other than you, actually, other that my family, that all my friends were doing it. And I'm like well, you know, my circle is doing that way.

Greer is crazy. That means your entire life becomes your baby. Um, and I, I feared that. And I think I also saw the judgment that other moms got by saying the next year of my life is going to be dedicated for three, my, the rest of life, is dedicated to my babies. Yeah. There's a lot of judgment around that mindset. Um. It's really complicated.

Early newborn sleep struggles in the hospital and at home 4:10

Because it's going be the biggest part of your life no matter what. 100%. And to go into having a baby with the mindset of it's not going to change my life, or I'm going do everything to minimize how it changed my I think, in retrospect is a crazy thought when you're bringing a human life into the world. Funny enough, I was just talking to him, my, My best friend's mom this morning. And she was saying that she breastfed her like my best run until she Was three years old. She was like, was ahead of the curve.

I said, actually, you were like behind like you were the old school way old old-school way. But now she was like, you would a mom would be embarrassed to say that she's doing that in some circles in my circle, at least with my friends, which is so I think I went during pregnancy. That was my mindset was very traditional, very I mean, like typical modern way of raising her. Yeah. Which I think, you know, it's hard to define what the mainstream is. And then also hard. To define. What the high nurture way is, but a lot of it is like a.

Lot of detachment of like, I want my baby to have like the like do the least amount. Yeah, maybe this low maintenance baby trend is like online again, like I've seen it before it's on again. Don't I don't want them to need me so much. You know, everything at arm's length everything like minimal interaction, minimal contact, mineral baby wearing minimal care overnight. And breastfeeding too goes along with that. If people breastfeed, I see in a lot of places, it's about six months, maybe 12 months would be a long, certainly not natural term, which is minimum of two years, every single health agency in the entire world recommends for so many different reasons.

So amazing. My mom was like that too. She breastfed me and my brother for two or three years. as well, which was also very unusual at the time. Okay. So that was before. Yeah. And then you brought your, you bought Noah home and tell us then what happened. Well, I'll start in the hospital. We had her and immediately I was like, i don't want to be away from her. Like I just felt that very, very quickly. A bit of knowing from you and reading your book and understanding this alternative like quote unquote alternative way of raising her was a bit like in my ear, I still was very much like fast net and that's what we're going to do it differently from what career says but then I had her in Maybe.

But we still like swaddled her and we put her in the bassinet and she cried and cried. And we were in a shared room. So I was like, I like it was more about I don't want this other mom to hear my baby screaming.

Choosing safe co-sleeping and trusting intuition 7:10

Of course, we didn't know what to scream. We had a nurse come in and were like please help us swaddle her. She was going to be going home tomorrow. You need to figure it out. I can't keep doing it for you. And I was like, well, I don't know how to so I guess she's just gonna sleep on me. And Corey stayed up and put an alarm on every four minutes to make sure that he didn't sleep like a crazy person. calm and calm. And like that was the only place she was calm, of course. Then we came home. I think I was still not admitting that I about to enter a co-sleeping journey.

We have an L-shaped couch. Noah was tucked between the couch and me in my arm, and Cory was on the other side again with the four-minute alarm watching us. and we couldn't get her in the bath net and then I called you and obviously we were chatting every couple hours probably and you were just like absolutely not like I know you don't want to do it but that is extremely unsafe and it's almost like you're doing everything to not co-sleep that you are actually putting your baby in more Harm than if you were to just learn to do it properly.

So we facetimed you showed me how to set up my bed and how make it all safe. And I have not looked back and I think that was like the stepping stone into all the other things. that I know you said it's hard to define it but in how I've defined nurturing Noah and like the tactical things that i'm doing that was like, that just threw me over the edge of like well if I'm co-sleeping then I am doing everything and it feels right. So many people find that right? They're like if all the sleep stuff Yes.

And like, none of that's gonna work. Like, let me question everything. Also, maybe let mean, leave it with my heart and intuition and like the good feelings about it, right? The first night that we've properly co slept in the bed, and I told Cory like I think this is what I want to do. It feels right. he spent that whole like he did not know that he was sleeping anyways, but he didn't not sleep that hole night because he Was researching like all about co sleeping, where it started the history of independent sleep and where that and it kind of bubbled up with all the research of, oh, now that we've done our due diligence from like, why independent sleeps started not necessarily the benefits of co sleep, and but why the other way started, we were like that is horrendous.

Yeah. we don't want to be part of that. And I'm pushing myself to do at the time, like independent sleep, because I didn't wanna be judged by other moms, that's not how you parent. I had you in my ear saying, just trust your intuition, trust her gut, and the more that I trusted my gut the I trusted my gut, like the more I figured out that pathway, and I even think with the apps, I was using the app to tell me when she should sleep, when should she wake up, feed. And at one point I told you, it was driving me crazy because she wasn't following that app.

I felt like I was doing something wrong or that she was wrong because I wasn't following it or if she wasn t following those patterns. But at the same time, because i was so reliant on it, I didn't know how to trust her and like trust my intuition.

Letting go of schedules and using baby cues 10:40

And then once I just got rid of the apps, Now we just have this like very symbiotic relationship where I just know her and I know when she's tired and it doesn't follow any schedule. Like she really doesn' even at eight months, she still, it's all over the place, but that works for us and, and its fine and she is thriving. I remember that day when I was like, you're still using the app, what's happening? And you were like I don't know if I can tell if she was tired. And I'm like try the experiment, just try it, try for a week.

like people and it's such a good thing to bring up because so many people listening who are not sleep training are still going to have followed that too, right? Because it is there and you know, seemingly easy, but it also process. It's definitely a process for some, but it's also like I would say relatively easy to figure out those sleep cues. Yeah. Right. And you felt like very your relationship deepened even more once you did that. Yep. Because I'm not and I could put my phone away because I've not constantly being like, Oh, it like what I don't need my foam anymore.

Whereas before you need it because I didn't know when to feed my own baby unless the app was telling me, God forbid my phone died, she'd starve. Recently, I had a friend say to me like, don't you want her on a schedule because sometimes she goes to bed at like 9 p.m. Corey and I will have dinner and she sits with us. And yes, it's late for a baby. But that, that just, if that's how it worked that day, and it was fine. And the three of us got to have a really nice dinner, we went for walk together.

Then she started to get tired. So we want to bed. I don't need her on a routine, because that means I have to be on that routine. This is the first time I kind of let go of that. It feels so nice. It's not too of like my type anus was a process to really like to let go of that, but it's been such a really good work. The other thing is you mentioned in the beginning was like, do I have to totally give up my life? Right? You're on maternity labor in Canada. You got 12 to 18 months here. So you are on maternity leave, but you're also bringing her around in your life, right?

Like we have these discussions too. Um, you want to tell us a little bit more about that? Yeah. So I, again, like having a routine would make it so that I'm on her schedule, But I just call, I call her either my like little Velcro or my kangaroo or like Joey, because she just is because we're not so regimented, I get to just enjoy my life, go have a walk with a friend, and go for brunches, whatever. And she just is part of- Post a keynote speaker at a major event. Yeah, like, not a panel. I still be part these really amazing things.

That was on stage and got to be with these big-time investors in Canada, because that's something that I'm super passionate about doing. She just- I put little headphones on her and she came along for the journey. And it's totally fine. Had I been really regimented, none of those things would have worked because I'd have to be on her like, oh, it is 10 o'clock, I have be home for her now. But no, she just kind of comes along and she and naps on me. Like even at eight, everyone told me at six months, you're not going to have her nap on you anymore for eight months.

And she still loves napping on. Me. It's amazing. Music carrier like for years. Yeah. know. I'll eventually switch it to your bag. Exactly. She'll swing around and become a little backpack at some point, but it's the best. And it is interesting to see parents where we just not get it.

Bringing baby along to work and daily life 14:20

But eventually you're going to want to move her in a crib, maybe, also maybe not. Because I remember I was old enough to have a memory of just wanting to be in my parents bed and sleeping in between them. So why would I like if that's something she needs to feel safe until she's XYZ age? Why would i take that away from her? Yeah, I love it. We have to have Corey, your husband on another time too, because I want I wanted to pick up on that other thing you said as well. Like, i was so happy that like, you guys did all your did your own research.

You were on Reddit groups, who were like doing all these things. And Corey was coming at me like can you believe this part of this card and like this is all based on nothing and that I was like yeah. He was out there. Yeah. It's not coming just for me. I don't want that. Something interesting too, at the very beginning, and maybe my mother-in-law will listen to this, she's been incredibly supportive. But at beginning we were like, we're not going to tell her because we don t want to upset her that Noah is sleeping in the bed.

And then eventually it's just like well, It's obvious because her bedroom has become my gym, so she doesn't have a bedroom at our house. And she was like, yeah, of course, you guys just have to do whatever is comfortable for you. Now I know not every mother-in-law is going to be that supportive, but it was just like a moment for me of even if she wasn't supportive of it, who cares? This is how we're raising our baby and eventually they'll get over it. In this case, she was just like, I don't care how you're sleeping as long as everyone's safe, do your thing.

But I think that for a lot of people is also a worry of how your family is going to perceive you or how they will feel about what you are doing. Absolutely. So many people have issues. Yeah, other people judging. It's so emotional. I think it's because I did one of my first episodes on this because it so triggering. They see how intimate and safe and supported and connected the relationship is. And that's like threatening because like either they didn't get that or they don't do that. Yeah. You know, um, so people just, you know some family members, friends, they will like attack a high nurturing mother, like calling them constantly, saying like, I hope you're putting your baby down today.

Like, i hope that you are not, loving that baby as much as I know you. I had a friend tell me, and I can't remember what it was, but we were talking about something with no one. She was like well, You are guilty of babying her. And I was My baby? Yes, I do baby my baby. It was just a moment of like, Oh, you don't consider your baby a baby like you. it's in the crib for more hours a day than it is with anyone.

Family reactions and the emotional side of high nurture 17:25

Yes. I will baby her for as long as she allows me to baby because she needs that. What an accusation. You're baby, your babying your babies. Yeah. It was just like one of those moments, like, oh, okay, I'm happy that that's not my, that not how I do things. Yeah. And you bring that up too, right? That's the other huge difference is like there's a deep relationship, there is the connectedness to your baby's cues for feeding and tiredness and play and all of their emotions. requires so much emotional work and energy.

You're baby wearing, you're holding her for naps, or going for walks with her in the carrier, your co sleeping, that's adding up to many hours together versus a baby who's you know, encouraged to play alone on the floor a lot, who's encouraged sleep in their crib alone for naps and for overnight, like that ends up being, I always say it's 50 to 60% less input to the baby, just the number of hours, if not the quality of the relationship too. It's night and day, right? It goes to, I know we were chatting about this just before, but wherever I go with Noah, and maybe there's like, you want to dig into this more, But wherever go I with her, people are always telling me, she's such a happy baby.

She's a such happy, baby, such as happy. And she smiles at everyone and she waves at every one. This has been from the moment she could smile to now at eight months. I hear a lot of the time, like you're so lucky that you have such she hardly ever cries, like very rarely. And there is probably an element of luck. I don't know, in a parallel universe, if I did sleep train her and I do all the other things, I dont know what she would have turned out to be like. But in this universe I I don't think that it's luck.

I think I have dedicated all of those hours so that, and as Josh, like my brother, your husband says, his theory is that I've given her so much safety and nourishment and all these things by spending so many time with her that allows her to be curious and allows to actually interact with other people and smile and feel safe to interact Other babies are a bit on high alert so they don't have the opportunity to smile. So I think that I've had an easier time than most moms because I love the co-sleeping and I loved the baby wearing, but I also think it's really hard work to dedicate that much time to her and it allowed her to be this very calm, very happy, and very playful baby.

She's amazing. We all know it. I mean, it's true. It is true, right? We do know that, she expects people to be supportive and safe and loving. She does not expect people To be scary or rejecting or, you know, isolating her or ignoring her.

Why close care leads to a calm, happy baby 20:35

And she's trusting the world, and she is able to Be in safety to the exploratory and social and curious and develop her mind, versus like, preoccupied with Is my mom going to answer me the next time I'm stressed? Is someone going be there for me? Are they available now? Or are they not available? Babies monitor. If they don't have that safe, secure, constant care, they're always looking for it, right? And they have to use a lot of their energy to find it. completely. Um, yeah, she's so special and you're doing amazing.

And might I add that koala baby is napping right now. She is on her own. Yep. I thought I wanted her. But yeah. and, and like sometimes it doesn't work, but a lot of the time she gets a two hour afternoon nap and I, in she sleeps the two hours and then I get to do whatever I need to. Yeah. And it took a bit to get here, but she feels safe in bed and it's great. Yes, completely. And there's always those landmarks too, right? It's a season, especially those first six months, or like we say, like nine months in, nine month on, yeah.

Nine months beside, the rest of your life. Yeah. around, hopefully, if like they love us and trust us. Yeah. That's another huge part. You're setting her up to be able to come to you as her safe person for her, which is what every parent wishes for. And yeah, now you're in this next stage, right? We're like, she's in the next phase of sleep, she is comfortable and safe on her own for naps and the first part of the night. And that just grows and grows. Right? Yeah, that's it. I think just to hit on that another point that if anyone's listening and like deciding what their journey might look like, I get a lot of comments from my circle of Don't you just want like a few minutes to yourself?

Like, don't You need mom time? One, like, I feel that I still get to do all the things I want to Do. Like I got a pedicure the other day, and she just sat on my lap and played. So I Still get To do All the Things I wanna do. But I used to get my eyebrows done. I went and got Brazilian and She just like called me and the lady was like Are you sure? And I was Like yeah, yeah. We're good. We're one for one. It's fine. Yeah, exactly. I was like, she knows those parts, like we're all good. But so yes, I do get to do all of the me thing.

Also at nighttime, it maybe took longer than if I were to sleep trainer, but I put her down to bed, if she's not on one of her like 9pm evenings, that I she sleeps. And then I come out, me and my husband hang out for the evening. Then I go back to bed with her. So there is like, I still get a couple hours a day that is just my time. Maybe it took longer than sleep training, but I got there and got their knowing that she's safe and happy and comfortable. I knew you've been rested this whole time, relatively rested and thought you just rest during the day a little bit.

I think I get more sleep than other moms because I'm also like still like breastfeeding on demand but because I'm not waking up and having to go pull her out of a crib or a bass net and feed her and rock her, I just roll over and she's there. It just makes it easier.

Rest, breastfeeding, and making the approach sustainable 24:15

You barely have to wake up sometimes. I hardly wake. Now I definitely don't wake, like, a little bit I wake but she could sleep through the night or she just feeds on her own and I can wake in the morning and not really remember. what it was like because she's like, sleeping. Yeah, right. We that's kind of how it's supposed to be. Yep. And when we can relax into it and have the confidence, you know, it can be that way. So Amazing, amazing. Well, thank you so much for coming. We'll try to get Corey on another episode.

Definitely. I think that'll be a cool perspective because he totally changed his belief system on raising her. Like I should get Josh to host Corey. That would be cool. And they should do a dad episode? I love that idea. Let's do that. Yeah. Awesome. our collaboration. So Kelly was also able to launch a business with their baby between zero and eight months. It started in late pregnancy, maybe. Yeah, I think we started my end of third, like August, the end third trimester. Yes. We created these amazing affirmation cards for moms.

If you're watching the video, you can see they're beautiful cards that just give you a boost of Like love and celebration and how else would you describe them, Kelly? I think they're the mantras or affirmations that you can say to yourself daily or every other day or however often you want to use them. The box is can also be your display, which is kind of nice. Like I have my propped up on my desk or you could toss them in your diaper bag.

Launching affirmation cards and wrapping up 26:08

And what I love, because Greer wrote every single one of them. And they're all rooted in science. That, I think, is really different than the typical affirmation cards. When I read some of the reviews that we have on Amazon, that's what differentiates it from our moms. They're not just super fluffy, they are super deep and meaningful, which is special. makes me so happy because they're not you know I always speak to my audience and with these on Amazon people from all over the world and all different places are loving them and that makes Pretty much anyone with these beautiful universal messages.

I love that. Your audience obviously loves them, but what we're seeing on Amazon is people who haven't seen you yet are finding them and loving them. So that I think is really exciting that we are bringing a new audience to you that might have not found you otherwise. And that's really special that it's growing and more people are realizing there's this great way to raise your baby. I love it. Yeah, walking the walk to Yeah. Even more important. Um, so yeah, anyone who is interested, you can get them on amazon.com.

And for our Canadian friends, they will be in stores soon. We'll announce them. Coming soon? Yeah? yeah. Amazing for having me on. Well, maybe we'll just have you back at Noah's next stage of life. I would love that. We can keep it going and we'll make sure Josh and Corey do an episode too. That'll be a really fun one. Yeah, that's cute. All right. I'll speak to you soon.