Full Transcript Introducing Kelly and the podcast 0:00 you are guilty of babying her. 0:02 And I was like, my baby? 0:04 Yes, I do baby my babies. 0:06 It was just a moment of like oh you don't consider your baby a baby. 0:11 Yeah. 0:11 it's in the crib for more hours a day than it is with anyone. 0:15 Yes I will baby her for as long as she allows me to baby because she needs that. 0:27 Welcome to Spoil Your Baby podcast. 0:30 I am very excited to be here today with my sister-in-law, Kelly Yuppett. 0:35 She is a new mom, an entrepreneur, and amazing mom and business person and human in general. 0:44 And we've known each other for 17 or 18 years. 0:45 Most of my life. 0:52 And Kelly was also in my lab during my PhD. 0:57 She is, you're the second author on one of my papers. 0:59 I know. 1:00 Can't believe you did that. 1:01 So amazing. 1:02 You did a lot of work. 1:04 Okay, always give all my students the most credit I can. 1:10 And we're going to talk about your experience in motherhood today. 1:13 Thank you so much for being here. 1:15 Thanks for having me on and for teaching me how to raise Noah the way I am. 1:19 I wouldn't have done it without you I keep telling you it's the Greer Method. 1:23 Yeah, I should call the podcast The Grear Method yeah. 1:27 trademark that. 1:30 They mark it. 1:32 Um, yeah, i mean, your baby is the most incredible baby as all babies are the Most Incredible Baby, but obviously I'm partial to her.
Pregnancy expectations and traditional parenting views 1:41 And I wanted to have you on today to kind of give moms an idea of what it's like to fully embrace a high-nurture approach. 1:52 And I think it just gives people confidence and connection when they hear other people are going through this too, because so many people, 2:04 you may be included, like you have some people in your life, but so people people who aren't sleep training or who are you know, 2:15 taking the approach and you and I have had so many conversations about like, what makes this different because people ask you. 2:21 So we'll, we're talking about that too. 2:24 Let's start with pregnant Kelly and Corey, your husband. 2:34 What did you guys think having a baby was going to be like? 2:38 What were you expecting? 2:41 Tell us a little bit about your pre-baby mindset. 2:45 It's such a blur now thinking back. 2:50 But I'll tell you what I didn't think. 2:52 I did not think I would raise Noah. 2:55 in any way like the way I am. 2:57 I had really strong opinions about how I was going to raise her and that included, I kept saying I don't want to have a baby and it flipped my life upside down. 3:07 Like I wanted her to be part of my, life I didn't, want my to become hers, which I still think that ended up being the case but in a very different like 3:17 method of how, I thought I would definitely sleep train her. 3:22 She would be in the stroller. 3:25 I just thought, like, I'd love her unconditionally, but I was very much of the traditional mindset, because that's what other than you, 3:36 actually, other that my family, that all my friends were doing it. 3:39 And I'm like well, you know, my circle is doing that way. 3:42 Greer is crazy. 3:43 That means your entire life becomes your baby. 3:49 Um, and I, I feared that. 3:51 And I think I also saw the judgment that other moms got by saying the next year of my life is going to be dedicated for three, 4:01 my, the rest of life, is dedicated to my babies. 4:04 Yeah. 4:04 There's a lot of judgment around that mindset. 4:07 Um. 4:08 It's really complicated.
Early newborn sleep struggles in the hospital and at home 4:10 Because it's going be the biggest part of your life no matter what. 4:13 100%. And to go into having a baby with the mindset of it's not going to change my life, or I'm going do everything to minimize how it changed my I think, 4:24 in retrospect is a crazy thought when you're bringing a human life into the world. 4:30 Funny enough, I was just talking to him, my, My best friend's mom this morning. 4:34 And she was saying that she breastfed her like my best run until she Was three years old. 4:40 She was like, was ahead of the curve. 4:41 I said, actually, you were like behind like you were the old school way old old-school way. 4:49 But now she was like, you would a mom would be embarrassed to say that she's doing that in some circles in my circle, at least with my friends, 4:57 which is so I think I went during pregnancy. 5:00 That was my mindset was very traditional, very I mean, like typical modern way of raising her. 5:07 Yeah. 5:08 Which I think, you know, it's hard to define what the mainstream is. 5:13 And then also hard. 5:14 To define. 5:15 What the high nurture way is, but a lot of it is like a. 5:19 Lot of detachment of like, I want my baby to have like the like do the least amount. 5:26 Yeah, maybe this low maintenance baby trend is like online again, like I've seen it before it's on again. 5:34 Don't I don't want them to need me so much. 5:36 You know, everything at arm's length everything like minimal interaction, minimal contact, mineral baby wearing minimal care overnight. 5:47 And breastfeeding too goes along with that. 5:49 If people breastfeed, I see in a lot of places, it's about six months, maybe 12 months would be a long, certainly not natural term, 5:59 which is minimum of two years, every single health agency in the entire world recommends for so many different reasons. 6:07 So amazing. 6:08 My mom was like that too. 6:09 She breastfed me and my brother for two or three years. 6:14 as well, which was also very unusual at the time. 6:17 Okay. 6:17 So that was before. 6:19 Yeah. 6:19 And then you brought your, you bought Noah home and tell us then what happened. 6:28 Well, I'll start in the hospital. 6:29 We had her and immediately I was like, i don't want to be away from her. 6:34 Like I just felt that very, very quickly. 6:39 A bit of knowing from you and reading your book and understanding this alternative like quote unquote alternative way of raising her was a bit like in 6:49 my ear, I still was very much like fast net and that's what we're going to do it differently from what career says but then I had her in Maybe. 7:00 But we still like swaddled her and we put her in the bassinet and she cried and cried. 7:04 And we were in a shared room. 7:05 So I was like, I like it was more about I don't want this other mom to hear my baby screaming.
Choosing safe co-sleeping and trusting intuition 7:10 Of course, we didn't know what to scream. 7:12 We had a nurse come in and were like please help us swaddle her. 7:17 She was going to be going home tomorrow. 7:19 You need to figure it out. 7:21 I can't keep doing it for you. 7:22 And I was like, well, I don't know how to so I guess she's just gonna sleep on me. 7:26 And Corey stayed up and put an alarm on every four minutes to make sure that he didn't sleep like a crazy person. 7:38 calm and calm. 7:39 And like that was the only place she was calm, of course. 7:42 Then we came home. 7:44 I think I was still not admitting that I about to enter a co-sleeping journey. 7:51 We have an L-shaped couch. 7:55 Noah was tucked between the couch and me in my arm, and Cory was on the other side again with the four-minute alarm watching us. 8:03 and we couldn't get her in the bath net and then I called you and obviously we were chatting every couple hours probably and you were just like absolutely 8:14 not like I know you don't want to do it but that is extremely unsafe and it's almost like you're doing everything to not co-sleep that you are actually 8:22 putting your baby in more Harm than if you were to just learn to do it properly. 8:27 So we facetimed you showed me how to set up my bed and how make it all safe. 8:33 And I have not looked back and I think that was like the stepping stone into all the other things. 8:40 that I know you said it's hard to define it but in how I've defined nurturing Noah and like the tactical things that i'm doing that was like, 8:49 that just threw me over the edge of like well if I'm co-sleeping then I am doing everything and it feels right. 8:55 So many people find that right? 8:56 They're like if all the sleep stuff Yes. 9:02 And like, none of that's gonna work. 9:04 Like, let me question everything. 9:06 Also, maybe let mean, leave it with my heart and intuition and like the good feelings about it, right? 9:12 The first night that we've properly co slept in the bed, and I told Cory like I think this is what I want to do. 9:17 It feels right. 9:19 he spent that whole like he did not know that he was sleeping anyways, but he didn't not sleep that hole night because he Was researching like all about 9:26 co sleeping, where it started the history of independent sleep and where that and it kind of bubbled up with all the research of, 9:34 oh, now that we've done our due diligence from like, why independent sleeps started not necessarily the benefits of co sleep, 9:42 and but why the other way started, we were like that is horrendous. 9:47 Yeah. 9:47 we don't want to be part of that. 9:50 And I'm pushing myself to do at the time, like independent sleep, because I didn't wanna be judged by other moms, that's not how you parent. 10:01 I had you in my ear saying, just trust your intuition, trust her gut, and the more that I trusted my gut the I trusted my gut, 10:09 like the more I figured out that pathway, and I even think with the apps, I was using the app to tell me when she should sleep, 10:18 when should she wake up, feed. 10:20 And at one point I told you, it was driving me crazy because she wasn't following that app. 10:29 I felt like I was doing something wrong or that she was wrong because I wasn't following it or if she wasn t following those patterns. 10:36 But at the same time, because i was so reliant on it, I didn't know how to trust her and like trust my intuition.
Letting go of schedules and using baby cues 10:41 And then once I just got rid of the apps, Now we just have this like very symbiotic relationship where I just know her and I know when she's tired and 10:50 it doesn't follow any schedule. 10:53 Like she really doesn' even at eight months, she still, it's all over the place, but that works for us and, and its fine and she is thriving. 11:02 I remember that day when I was like, you're still using the app, what's happening? 11:08 And you were like I don't know if I can tell if she was tired. 11:10 And I'm like try the experiment, just try it, try for a week. 11:14 like people and it's such a good thing to bring up because so many people listening who are not sleep training are still going to have followed that too, 11:22 right? 11:22 Because it is there and you know, seemingly easy, but it also process. 11:29 It's definitely a process for some, but it's also like I would say relatively easy to figure out those sleep cues. 11:34 Yeah. 11:34 Right. 11:35 And you felt like very your relationship deepened even more once you did that. 11:39 Yep. 11:40 Because I'm not and I could put my phone away because I've not constantly being like, Oh, it like what I don't need my foam anymore. 11:47 Whereas before you need it because I didn't know when to feed my own baby unless the app was telling me, God forbid my phone died, 11:53 she'd starve. 11:57 Recently, I had a friend say to me like, don't you want her on a schedule because sometimes she goes to bed at like 9 p.m. 12:05 Corey and I will have dinner and she sits with us. 12:07 And yes, it's late for a baby. 12:09 But that, that just, if that's how it worked that day, and it was fine. 12:13 And the three of us got to have a really nice dinner, we went for walk together. 12:17 Then she started to get tired. 12:18 So we want to bed. 12:20 I don't need her on a routine, because that means I have to be on that routine. 12:23 This is the first time I kind of let go of that. 12:27 It feels so nice. 12:31 It's not too of like my type anus was a process to really like to let go of that, but it's been such a really good work. 12:40 The other thing is you mentioned in the beginning was like, do I have to totally give up my life? 12:44 Right? 12:45 You're on maternity labor in Canada. 12:47 You got 12 to 18 months here. 12:48 So you are on maternity leave, but you're also bringing her around in your life, right? 12:55 Like we have these discussions too. 12:56 Um, you want to tell us a little bit more about that? 12:59 Yeah. 13:00 So I, again, like having a routine would make it so that I'm on her schedule, But I just call, I call her either my like little Velcro or my kangaroo or 13:12 like Joey, because she just is because we're not so regimented, I get to just enjoy my life, go have a walk with a friend, 13:21 and go for brunches, whatever. 13:23 And she just is part of- Post a keynote speaker at a major event. 13:26 Yeah, like, not a panel. 13:29 I still be part these really amazing things. 13:32 That was on stage and got to be with these big-time investors in Canada, because that's something that I'm super passionate about doing. 13:41 She just- I put little headphones on her and she came along for the journey. 13:45 And it's totally fine. 13:47 Had I been really regimented, none of those things would have worked because I'd have to be on her like, oh, it is 10 o'clock, 13:53 I have be home for her now. 13:55 But no, she just kind of comes along and she and naps on me. 13:59 Like even at eight, everyone told me at six months, you're not going to have her nap on you anymore for eight months. 14:05 And she still loves napping on. 14:07 Me. 14:07 It's amazing. 14:08 Music carrier like for years. 14:10 Yeah. 14:11 know. 14:12 I'll eventually switch it to your bag. 14:14 Exactly. 14:14 She'll swing around and become a little backpack at some point, but it's the best. 14:18 And it is interesting to see parents where we just not get it.
Bringing baby along to work and daily life 14:22 But eventually you're going to want to move her in a crib, maybe, also maybe not. 14:28 Because I remember I was old enough to have a memory of just wanting to be in my parents bed and sleeping in between them. 14:38 So why would I like if that's something she needs to feel safe until she's XYZ age? 14:45 Why would i take that away from her? 14:49 Yeah, I love it. 14:49 We have to have Corey, your husband on another time too, because I want I wanted to pick up on that other thing you said as well. 14:55 Like, i was so happy that like, you guys did all your did your own research. 15:00 You were on Reddit groups, who were like doing all these things. 15:03 And Corey was coming at me like can you believe this part of this card and like this is all based on nothing and that I was like yeah. 15:11 He was out there. 15:12 Yeah. 15:12 It's not coming just for me. 15:17 I don't want that. 15:18 Something interesting too, at the very beginning, and maybe my mother-in-law will listen to this, she's been incredibly supportive. 15:26 But at beginning we were like, we're not going to tell her because we don t want to upset her that Noah is sleeping in the bed. 15:33 And then eventually it's just like well, It's obvious because her bedroom has become my gym, so she doesn't have a bedroom at our house. 15:42 And she was like, yeah, of course, you guys just have to do whatever is comfortable for you. 15:45 Now I know not every mother-in-law is going to be that supportive, but it was just like a moment for me of even if she wasn't supportive of it, 15:54 who cares? 15:55 This is how we're raising our baby and eventually they'll get over it. 16:00 In this case, she was just like, I don't care how you're sleeping as long as everyone's safe, do your thing. 16:08 But I think that for a lot of people is also a worry of how your family is going to perceive you or how they will feel about what you are doing. 16:17 Absolutely. 16:18 So many people have issues. 16:20 Yeah, other people judging. 16:23 It's so emotional. 16:24 I think it's because I did one of my first episodes on this because it so triggering. 16:28 They see how intimate and safe and supported and connected the relationship is. 16:36 And that's like threatening because like either they didn't get that or they don't do that. 16:44 Yeah. 16:44 You know, um, so people just, you know some family members, friends, they will like attack a high nurturing mother, like calling them constantly, 16:54 saying like, I hope you're putting your baby down today. 16:57 Like, i hope that you are not, loving that baby as much as I know you. 17:02 I had a friend tell me, and I can't remember what it was, but we were talking about something with no one. 17:07 She was like well, You are guilty of babying her. 17:10 And I was My baby? 17:13 Yes, I do baby my baby. 17:15 It was just a moment of like, Oh, you don't consider your baby a baby like you. 17:21 it's in the crib for more hours a day than it is with anyone.
Family reactions and the emotional side of high nurture 17:26 Yes. 17:26 I will baby her for as long as she allows me to baby because she needs that. 17:32 What an accusation. 17:34 You're baby, your babying your babies. 17:35 Yeah. 17:37 It was just like one of those moments, like, oh, okay, I'm happy that that's not my, that not how I do things. 17:43 Yeah. 17:43 And you bring that up too, right? 17:44 That's the other huge difference is like there's a deep relationship, there is the connectedness to your baby's cues for feeding and tiredness and play 17:57 and all of their emotions. 17:59 requires so much emotional work and energy. 18:02 You're baby wearing, you're holding her for naps, or going for walks with her in the carrier, your co sleeping, that's adding up to many hours together 18:13 versus a baby who's you know, encouraged to play alone on the floor a lot, who's encouraged sleep in their crib alone for naps and for overnight, 18:22 like that ends up being, I always say it's 50 to 60% less input to the baby, just the number of hours, if not the quality of the relationship too. 18:35 It's night and day, right? 18:37 It goes to, I know we were chatting about this just before, but wherever I go with Noah, and maybe there's like, you want to dig into this more, 18:45 But wherever go I with her, people are always telling me, she's such a happy baby. 18:51 She's a such happy, baby, such as happy. 18:52 And she smiles at everyone and she waves at every one. 18:55 This has been from the moment she could smile to now at eight months. 19:01 I hear a lot of the time, like you're so lucky that you have such she hardly ever cries, like very rarely. 19:08 And there is probably an element of luck. 19:13 I don't know, in a parallel universe, if I did sleep train her and I do all the other things, I dont know what she would have turned out to be like. 19:24 But in this universe I I don't think that it's luck. 19:28 I think I have dedicated all of those hours so that, and as Josh, like my brother, your husband says, his theory is that I've given her so much safety 19:41 and nourishment and all these things by spending so many time with her that allows her to be curious and allows to actually interact with other people 19:51 and smile and feel safe to interact Other babies are a bit on high alert so they don't have the opportunity to smile. 20:01 So I think that I've had an easier time than most moms because I love the co-sleeping and I loved the baby wearing, but I also think it's really hard work 20:10 to dedicate that much time to her and it allowed her to be this very calm, very happy, and very playful baby. 20:18 She's amazing. 20:20 We all know it. 20:25 I mean, it's true. 20:26 It is true, right? 20:27 We do know that, she expects people to be supportive and safe and loving. 20:33 She does not expect people To be scary or rejecting or, you know, isolating her or ignoring her.
Why close care leads to a calm, happy baby 20:41 And she's trusting the world, and she is able to Be in safety to the exploratory and social and curious and develop her mind, 20:50 versus like, preoccupied with Is my mom going to answer me the next time I'm stressed? 20:57 Is someone going be there for me? 20:59 Are they available now? 20:59 Or are they not available? 21:01 Babies monitor. 21:03 If they don't have that safe, secure, constant care, they're always looking for it, right? 21:08 And they have to use a lot of their energy to find it. 21:13 completely. 21:14 Um, yeah, she's so special and you're doing amazing. 21:18 And might I add that koala baby is napping right now. 21:23 She is on her own. 21:26 Yep. 21:26 I thought I wanted her. 21:29 But yeah. 21:30 and, and like sometimes it doesn't work, but a lot of the time she gets a two hour afternoon nap and I, in she sleeps the two hours and then I get to do 21:39 whatever I need to. 21:40 Yeah. 21:42 And it took a bit to get here, but she feels safe in bed and it's great. 21:46 Yes, completely. 21:47 And there's always those landmarks too, right? 21:51 It's a season, especially those first six months, or like we say, like nine months in, nine month on, yeah. 21:58 Nine months beside, the rest of your life. 22:02 Yeah. 22:03 around, hopefully, if like they love us and trust us. 22:07 Yeah. 22:08 That's another huge part. 22:09 You're setting her up to be able to come to you as her safe person for her, which is what every parent wishes for. 22:15 And yeah, now you're in this next stage, right? 22:17 We're like, she's in the next phase of sleep, she is comfortable and safe on her own for naps and the first part of the night. 22:25 And that just grows and grows. 22:27 Right? 22:28 Yeah, that's it. 22:29 I think just to hit on that another point that if anyone's listening and like deciding what their journey might look like, 22:34 I get a lot of comments from my circle of Don't you just want like a few minutes to yourself? 22:39 Like, don't You need mom time? 22:42 One, like, I feel that I still get to do all the things I want to Do. 22:46 Like I got a pedicure the other day, and she just sat on my lap and played. 22:50 So I Still get To do All the Things I wanna do. 22:52 But I used to get my eyebrows done. 22:55 I went and got Brazilian and She just like called me and the lady was like Are you sure? 22:59 And I was Like yeah, yeah. 23:00 We're good. 23:02 We're one for one. 23:03 It's fine. 23:03 Yeah, exactly. 23:05 I was like, she knows those parts, like we're all good. 23:08 But so yes, I do get to do all of the me thing. 23:14 Also at nighttime, it maybe took longer than if I were to sleep trainer, but I put her down to bed, if she's not on one of her like 9pm evenings, 23:25 that I she sleeps. 23:28 And then I come out, me and my husband hang out for the evening. 23:31 Then I go back to bed with her. 23:32 So there is like, I still get a couple hours a day that is just my time. 23:40 Maybe it took longer than sleep training, but I got there and got their knowing that she's safe and happy and comfortable. 23:48 I knew you've been rested this whole time, relatively rested and thought you just rest during the day a little bit. 23:58 I think I get more sleep than other moms because I'm also like still like breastfeeding on demand but because I'm not waking up and having to go pull her 24:09 out of a crib or a bass net and feed her and rock her, I just roll over and she's there. 24:14 It just makes it easier.
Rest, breastfeeding, and making the approach sustainable 24:16 You barely have to wake up sometimes. 24:18 I hardly wake. 24:19 Now I definitely don't wake, like, a little bit I wake but she could sleep through the night or she just feeds on her own and I can wake in the morning 24:31 and not really remember. 24:33 what it was like because she's like, sleeping. 24:37 Yeah, right. 24:37 We that's kind of how it's supposed to be. 24:39 Yep. 24:40 And when we can relax into it and have the confidence, you know, it can be that way. 24:45 So Amazing, amazing. 24:48 Well, thank you so much for coming. 24:51 We'll try to get Corey on another episode. 24:54 Definitely. 24:54 I think that'll be a cool perspective because he totally changed his belief system on raising her. 25:01 Like I should get Josh to host Corey. 25:03 That would be cool. 25:04 And they should do a dad episode? 25:06 I love that idea. 25:07 Let's do that. 25:08 Yeah. 25:08 Awesome. 25:13 our collaboration. 25:15 So Kelly was also able to launch a business with their baby between zero and eight months. 25:22 It started in late pregnancy, maybe. 25:26 Yeah, I think we started my end of third, like August, the end third trimester. 25:30 Yes. 25:32 We created these amazing affirmation cards for moms. 25:36 If you're watching the video, you can see they're beautiful cards that just give you a boost of Like love and celebration and how else would you describe them, 25:50 Kelly? 25:51 I think they're the mantras or affirmations that you can say to yourself daily or every other day or however often you want to use them. 25:59 The box is can also be your display, which is kind of nice. 26:04 Like I have my propped up on my desk or you could toss them in your diaper bag.
Launching affirmation cards and wrapping up 26:08 And what I love, because Greer wrote every single one of them. 26:11 And they're all rooted in science. 26:17 That, I think, is really different than the typical affirmation cards. 26:20 When I read some of the reviews that we have on Amazon, that's what differentiates it from our moms. 26:26 They're not just super fluffy, they are super deep and meaningful, which is special. 26:34 makes me so happy because they're not you know I always speak to my audience and with these on Amazon people from all over the world and all different 26:44 places are loving them and that makes Pretty much anyone with these beautiful universal messages. 26:52 I love that. 26:53 Your audience obviously loves them, but what we're seeing on Amazon is people who haven't seen you yet are finding them and loving them. 27:01 So that I think is really exciting that we are bringing a new audience to you that might have not found you otherwise. 27:07 And that's really special that it's growing and more people are realizing there's this great way to raise your baby. 27:16 I love it. 27:17 Yeah, walking the walk to Yeah. 27:20 Even more important. 27:22 Um, so yeah, anyone who is interested, you can get them on amazon.com. 27:26 And for our Canadian friends, they will be in stores soon. 27:31 We'll announce them. 27:32 Coming soon? 27:33 Yeah? 27:34 yeah. 27:34 Amazing for having me on. 27:37 Well, maybe we'll just have you back at Noah's next stage of life. 27:40 I would love that. 27:42 We can keep it going and we'll make sure Josh and Corey do an episode too. 27:46 That'll be a really fun one. 27:47 Yeah, that's cute. 27:49 All right. 27:49 I'll speak to you soon.
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