The Real Reason Some Chronic Illness Cases Get Missed

Medical School Intensity and Ego 0:00

What is medical school? Like, explain in, like, a paragraph the intensity of what medical is. It's pretty damn intense. it's really about breaking you down and building you back up in the way they see fit. Its very similar to the military that way. What they do, and I tell people this all the time, I talk to my clients, look, here's what your doctor went through. They were the top of their class in undergrad. they were number one. So their ego is pumped, they're confident, and they should be. They're very smart people.

they go to medical school and now they are one of whatever the class is, a hundred. And every single one was that. So only one can be the top now. Yep. Now it's an ego experience, right? So you're breaking down the ego and people are like, that's not bad for anybody. I agree. It's not always bad for you, but it's hard because this person's been the smartest forever. So it is hard. And then they put you all together and they tell you do what we do and we're going to put through tests and you're graded.

If you get bad grades, you are going fail and all this money that you just spent, your whole life's goal is gone. That's going move you down a certain path of thought process. Hi, I'm Dr. Jess Petros, and on my podcast, Dr Justin Filtered, we uncover the real root cause of most misunderstood symptoms with help from top experts and real patients who've healed themselves. Hello again, and welcome back to the Dr. Jess Unfiltered podcast. Today, I'm really excited because I not only have a colleague, a really great friend of mine, but an excellent practitioner too.

His name is Dr Javen Moore. He's not just a chiropractor, he's so many other things, you guys. he is a national lecturer, He takes the stage and educates everyone. Thanks for having me. I'm excited to hang out and talk with you as always. Yeah, like I said, we're really good friends. And I guess, you know, for me, I've heard your story before, but I would love for the audience out here to hear, um, your health journey and how you got into what you're doing now. You know, I've got basically a double health journey.

So my mom, when I was young and I can vividly remember just being a kid and walking out of the bedroom that I had and it walked right into the living room, really small house. And my Mom was just always on the couch. always on the couch around 10 years old. So, you know, as a kid you have no idea what's going on. To give a little bit of information, she was on 40 medications at one point, in a single day, 40 medication, it's like pills, for depression, acid reflux, digestive issues, fatigue, brain fog, cholesterol, high blood pressure, You name the thing, she was on it and they were trying numerous to try and get her body under control.

They had no idea what was going on. And I know from practice that this is the story of millions of Americans. millions and millions of people around the world are dealing with this situation. She was about 105 pounds and she doubled plus to about 262 during this period of time while she was basically stuck on the couch, going to personal trainers, eating broccoli and chicken and was just miserable leaving her son, me, I was an only child,

Dr. Javen Mooreu2019s Family Health Crisis 3:10

leaving me with my dad and I remember what my Dad was cooking me and food and just thinking back, There's burgers and fries and hominy if you've ever ate that most nights, right? Because my mom's sick and she just can't function. I remember her watching the home shopping network every night, all night but being asleep all day. And the thing that changed all of this was she got in a car accident on the way from dropping me off for daycare before elementary school and she went to the ER and the doc was just like, are you diabetic?

Because she didn't put that on her paperwork. And she said, no. And this is a woman on 40 pills, right? So like you'd think she would know what she was diagnosed with at this point. So he goes back and he runs her labs twice to confirm her A1C was sky high. She had been missed for diabetes and all of this other stuff had developed over a number of years. Who knows how long I honestly haven't gone back. And done the deep dive into all the records because it was 30 years ago now. And somehow diabetes slipped through and it crashed her entire body.

And then from there, of course, they get her on diabetic medication, which is now throwing off all these other medications. To this day, 30 years later, she's still not right. She's had now a gastric bypass and a thyroid cancer surgery and lymph node removals up to today. So I remember at 10 years old, I was just thinking, like, do you want to help my mom? And there's gotta be a better way. And all of these pills are not working and why can't her doctors help her? And I wanted to be doctor my whole life since five.

So like, it was just this culmination of living in a world where the status quo wasn't good enough. But I still don't blame them. I just want to figure out how to do better for people. And then I ended up getting Lyme disease in college and my story is not as long. It was a college athlete, all American, I graduated, went to Cairo school, lost 60 pounds and, my body just started to crash. Which doesn't make sense, right? I lose weight, get healthier. I'm not in, you know, it's not professional sports, college sports.

It's like a professional training program. More balanced in life. And I am getting worse. Erectile dysfunction, joints killing me. As I go through school, when you're in school the cool thing is you are going to conferences, your meeting people. Like I met you at a conference. So I meeting doctors everywhere I And I'm asking questions and these are not just mainstream doctors. These are functional medicine doctors, naturopaths, chiropractors, everything. And they're all just like from the top of the spectrum to, you know, off the wall recommendations.

So the little blue pill. to a largenene, which is what a lot of functional medicine doctors are using when it comes to erectile dysfunction, to fasting or red light or sauna and somebody, and none of it worked by the way, none it works at all. And I was talking to some guys at another conference because I'm just trying to help myself. just like so many other people. And they're like, have you thought about Lyme disease? I was like no, because a decade ago Lymes disease wasn't popular. We don't have social media in 2012 like we do today where everybody's talking about everything.

If you got your algorithm going the right direction, you're going to run into some things. I ended up driving to Wisconsin, going a Dr. Linsley. The crazy thing is once you find someone that actually knows what the heck they are doing, and is willing to listen and work, within a few months, my whole life changed. And I'm back on my feet and feeling better. That's what catapulted me between my mom and myself to going, one, you have to have a systematic approach that makes sure you don't miss things.

Because every doctor is supposed to find diabetes. It's so standardized. But if you're not systematized, you miss it. And then also with mine, with Lyme disease, You also have to keep an open mind to look beyond your own knowledge. Because someone's going to walk in as soon as you get good at whatever you are doing, somebody's walking in with the next thing. So true. So let me ask you, you know, I come from the conventional medical world as a medical doctor and we weren't really taught about chronic Lyme.

I know a lot of people out there listening are saying, wait a second, You've got this weird symptoms that have nothing to do really overtly or directly with Lyne disease, at least taught in the Conventional world. Can you explain chronic lyme? Why is this missed by the convention medical? So it's not just chronic lying, by the way. We all just went through the pandemic, right? And they finally, for the first time in my lifetime that I'm aware of, accept that there is a chronic something, chronic COVID, like we all know long haulers at this point.

Yes. Long haulers is just the latest. You have an infection that left you with symptoms that perpetuate beyond when you have the active fever infection state.

Lyme Disease, Mold, and Recovery 8:40

Lyme disease is the same thing. you Have an Infection that is sticking around longer. Well, what is that? Is it that you? Have the actual COVID or Borrelia, which is by the way, Borrellia is a bacteria for those listening. I know you know this, but the bacteria that is associated to Lyme disease. That is the disease scientific species name. But it's so much more than just that one thing. Because if you can get a chronic infection, Lyame disease, it is not because your body is healthy and strong and resilient.

It is because there is something that makes you vulnerable. So in my case, I was living in a moldy basement in college because I as a poor kid and I took the room that nobody else wanted in the basement because it's 200 bucks a month. And I remember to this day vividly, the smell of mold in that room. I Remember the floods that would come up through the drain and I would squeegee it back to the Drain. Remember mold growth and mildew growing up the bottom of the floor, like up to The paneling like the wood panel, old school wood panelling growing Up that.

And i was just like, I don't care. It's cheap. Like it smells. My girlfriend didn't like it, but I didn't know any better, just like so many people listening, right, don't any know better about a lot of things. So that made me vulnerable. And that vulnerability led to food allergies, which was my body being overreactive to the things that I was eating. It led body pain and joint pain, the babesia, a co-infection of Lyme disease, getting into my joints and wearing on them. And by the way, there's no antibiotic or medical treatment that I've ever ran into that can get all the ways into the joints and get it out.

You have to get something that could be transdermal, get into tissues. Look it up, do the research right now if you're interested in this. you cannot get the antibiotic into ligament and tendons in the tissue. Like you just don't get antibiotics in there. So you have do something different or better Dr. Lindsley figured some of this out about going transdermal. So he's got creams that you would put on your joints and your hands. And I've had people come into my clinic that had been through years of pick line or port IVs that still have awful joints.

and I give them a cream, topically, of herbs, and they're like, I'm good. Yeah, it's wild. So Lyme disease is a great mimicker. When you're weak, the infection goes to your weakness. If it gets in your brain, go look up studies. It's going to be MS, in you heart, Lymanendocarditis, which is where you get inflammation around your heart. You can have tachycardia. I've seen Babesia, that co-infection I mentioned earlier, a parasite. Do that. Lime doesn't really do a lot to the gut in my experience.

And when I say lime, I mean Borrelia. I'm not talking about different co-infections that can be associated. It absolutely will make your joints weak and tired. You can get Bartonella, another bacterial infection that could get into your blood vessels that cause inflammation. So then you don't have the endurance and the muscles. It can also get into your heels where you have pain in your heals. So Lyme disease, because it's a great mimicker, it goes where your weak and all the co-infections can attack at your body when your mitochondria is down.

And that's why I was bringing up COVID earlier. When you're weak from mold or the trauma you has as a child, the radioactive water you are drinking, which 170 million Americans are taking radioactive If it's the VOCs in your house, when you're weak, these infections, the stealth infections or as you call them frenemies, I remember stealing that from you when your on stage one time and I was just like, that's genius. And I've said that in practice so many times. That's when this stuff gets at you.

The misnomer is that people tell me all the time, they're like well I don't have X, so I can't Like, I don't have this symptoms, so I can't be that. And I was just like, these infections don' play by your playbook. They don''t play buy the medical charting play book. Like yes, it's good to have an idea of where they go, but also let's run some tests. Exactly. I agree with you completely. So you brought something up. You said that Lyme is a great mimicker. It can cause this myriad of symptoms for depending on the person and what genetic predispositions they seem to have or what life experiences they've had.

Why does conventional medicine and, you know, my boat of doctors that I was trained with, why did they kind of poo poo away conventional LyME? Why don't they, what's the difference or the discrepancy here between the different fields? Let me go down to two rabbit holes for you. There's two rabbits holes that I talked clients about because here's the deal. I don't blame your medical doctor. That's, the GP or your endo doctor that you went to next or you're gastrologist or even your neurologist for missing some of this stuff because they're trained on a gold standard.

They're trained, and you know this, I mean you can speak to this better than I can, but there is a standard of care that follows the insurance model that allows them to go out on a certain path, right? So they're just following what they are allowed to do. They're also only allowed to run testing and do certain practices and they have to follow, let's say, the CDC lab testing, which is complete garbage. I'm a math guy. So for all of you out there that don't like math, I'll show you why this doesn't make sense.

The CDC, and I believe it was about 2015, they said, okay, we found 25,000 people. that tests a positive for Lyme, but we think, this is the CDC, more like 300,000, up to a million people contracted Lyne this year. What's the math on that? It's less than 8% accuracy. Yeah. That's an awful test. Anybody else get an 8% success rate in their job and they keep it? No. So why are we using this test? Just don't run the test, which any doctor, even the infectious disease guys that I've talked to that were treating some of my patients, they even know like that's probably just a clinical diagnosis, right?

So the doctors that are in the know, your LLMDs, they know that that test is garbage. They're going to move on from it, but they're still going follow the standard of care, which is going be antibiotics because that's what the insurance is covered, if at all, and that is what they are allowed to be trained on. And then the other part is this. Have you ever looked at like the CIA and what mind control looks like or going down this rabbit hole of how to brainwash somebody? Safe and effective, Jayden.

Safe an effective. What is medical school? Like explain in like a paragraph the intensity of what medical is. It's pretty damn intense. it's really about breaking you down and building you back up in the way they see fit. Its very similar to the military that way. But what they do, and I tell people this all the time, I talk to my clients, look, here's what your doctor went through. They were the top of their class in undergrad, they were number one. So their ego is pumped, they're confident, and they should be, They're very smart people.

They go to medical school and now they are one of whatever the class is, a hundred, And every single one was that. So only one of them can be the top now. Yep. So now it's an ego experience, right? So you're breaking down the ego and people are like, oh, that's not bad for anybody. I agree. It's always bad, but it is hard because this person has been the smartest forever. That's true. And then they put you all together and they tell you, do what we do and we're going to put through tests and you are graded.

Why Chronic Lyme Is Missed 16:20

If you get bad grades, you will fail and all this money that you just spent, your whole life's goal is gone. That's going to move you down a certain path of thought process. And then I'm going put you into residency and you're going work 80 hours a week while studying and we're gonna sleep deprive you. Yeah, that's what happened. So, okay, now you are sleep deprived, you just had a study to keep up with the other most brilliant people in the country, and, your trying to do everything you can just to survive.

so that you can eventually get out and make a dollar or two, because you also have no money because, you're paying hundreds of thousands of dollars in school and you are making almost nothing when you in residency. And then you get of school, and now you still the low man on the totem pole, still get the crappiest shifts, You still have an 80 hour work week, but you start making a little money after residency is over. You think that that person that just went through all of that, wants to now go and learn how to actually practice human medicine and figure out what the most cutting edge thing is after they just got out of school where they were taught what is 20 and 30 and 40 years old and is not the cutting-edge and it's not what real patients need by the way in most cases I remember going through school in my opinion and I didn't go through medical school but I've talked to a lot of people who have and went through chiropractic school.

We're taught how pass a test. That's true. Not how help an individual. Yeah. And you're saying that's true. So just think about your medical doctor and go, do you think that when they graduated school, the first and most important thing on their mind was to go learn more and research more, and stay up all night to figure out what the hard client is dealing with or the heart patient is. Or is it like, man, I just got out of this and I would like to like go meet somebody to fall in love with, or go on a vacation or, Hey, how about this sleep?

Yeah, because when you're constantly working in survival mode, it makes you kind of selfish because you can really only think about yourself. You can't really think of the people you are caring for even though that's the whole purpose of your job because your sleep deprived and hungry. And they do this because they want you to be able to function sleep deprived. So if you're working in an ER, but I'm like, sure, maybe you do these ER doctors and trauma docs, because maybe that's necessary. I don't know.

Why does your infectious disease doc that works nine to five need to be in that same thought process? I know this is way off of like the whole conversation, but like I'm kind of defending the medical system, the doctor part, not the system part to say, when I got into practice, I was different because I had just gotten out of school where yeah, I studying and I going through boards and was sleep deprived to some degree. I did not go through like the same medical residency where you're doing it like that.

I got out and I was studying Lyme because I had it. Yeah. And then when I get in practice, sure, did I go and have a little bit of fun and probably didn't study a bunch my first month, but then the docs that I always going and searching from that knew that had Lymen that couldn't help me and the one that did, they're like, oh, by the way, this is before virtual doctoring by way. Well, you're the guy in the Midwest now. We're going to send everyone with Lyman to you. Well, first of all, I had no money, so I was going to take on any client I could, and I would call, call back these guys and get help.

But secondly, you're the only person I saw that day, maybe. Which means that I knew I have to do a really, really good job for that person. And it gave me such a leap forward into research and learning and being at the cutting edge. I think there's something to doctors that one, passionately have a direction for it. But secondly, ones that learn from their patients. And I am where I'm today because every time you get somebody better, they send you someone harder. It's not like it's, not that they just send you more of themselves.

They send someone harder, someone that the next guy hasn't figured out and that, that this patient honestly can't figure out after everything they've been through. And for me as an athlete, it was always just fun to like take on that challenge. And then, you know, we get where you and I are now, or you're down the rabbit hole of, of Lyme turn, mold turn parasite, turn nervous system, turned MCAS. Everything. And you are just like, how, How does this symptom exist? Sometimes I step back and just think to myself.

How is this happening? It's a snowball effect. Really. Once the system is dysregulated, it's really easy to pull the other organ systems out of whack. I think it is just a like a snow ball effect almost with people. I mean, can you believe, if you're listening right now, there are people that are so sensitive to the world that they can eat two foods that can't stand in sunlight, 10 seconds of red light triggers them, and one pinch of a granule of something triggers their body. Those people exist, you just step back and you are like, no, that's not real.

It's a tendency not to believe these people, honestly. And they are dead serious with us. I now believe everything they say. And, and you know, they're, you're taught in school to like question it to some degree. And I'm like, these people are not coming in and paying good money and doing the work. That's the thing. They're doing. The work to lie to me. Now, are there cases where they come in and maybe we do need a mindset shift? Maybe that's a piece of the puzzle. And I'm not saying it's in your head.

I am not calling you crazy. Not saying you need depression medication. Just saying there needs to be maybe a different angle that we need to look at things from. That is sometimes the truth. But it is just so interesting when these people come and they are like, no one believes me. Why would you be bedridden for fun? Well, you know, these doctors before you mentioned, they are the top of their class and some of them, not all, but some them have not worked through their ego issues. And so it's really difficult to tell a patient, I don't know what's going on with you when you have an ego.

It's easier to say you're making it up. Oh, I tell people all the time. I don't know what's going on all of a time, all time I'm like, you know, what? I. Don't exactly know. What's. Going on here. We can work on this and this, and I want to research that. And I call two friends over here, but as my clinic has continued to grow, gotten the opportunity now to bring on medical doctors and kind of help them escape the system. And I laugh with them and I'm like, all right, look, you remember all those patients when you were a family care or when your an internal medicine that none of y'all wanted because there was no solution.

Medical Training, Burnout, and System Limits 23:30

They took a lot of extra time. We're the ones that you couldn't find answers for. You're like yeah. I like that's all of our patients. That's who we see. And the great thing is the one that have come into our practice They're ones that are like, I always wanted to help them, but we literally don't have time or resources or training to even know where to go. And I'm like well, we've got all of that. We will figure it out. If you run into somebody you can't figure out, let me know and we'll go down the Rolodex.

I got the old black book and I'll like we will go to the rolodex and call someone and figure this out because there is an answer. It's not always easy. And I tell clients that every day. I'm like, I know what's going on with you, but it doesn't mean that it's easy and it does it mean it fast. Absolutely. That's the truth. It is really setting expectations for these people in clinic. Speaking of things people don't pick up on or know, what is going all the time. You mentioned radiation and drinking radiated water.

Sounds like something from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Can you explain, please? You're not going to become Spiderman with this. Yeah. Oh, the sludge. I'm going back in time. Remember all my Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle days? I'll give you a picture for the podcast at the bottom you can put on there when I was like seven and I with Rafael. Yes, The Nunchucks. She doesn't even know, see? She was the pretty cheerleader. It's the sigh for Rafael? Oh yikes. He was The nunchuck, Leonardo. Nope, that was a sword.

Michelangelo. There we go. I'm the nerd over here. Yeah, I am the Nerd. So radiation, right? Okay. First of all, as you're listening to this on one of your screens, because we all have multiple screens these days, except for Jess when she's working, who does that? So what you got to do is go to ewg.org, go their water database, type in your specific zip code, and then just scroll down and find your city and see what's there. If you have uranium, radium, thallium or cesium your water is radioactive.

Why is this important? Well, you don't want to stand in a microwave. You don' want go hang out near a nuclear power plant and you dont want radon in your basement. For a reason, it will kill you over time. And it's not good for you. It's going to mutate your cells. Unfortunately, like I said, You're not going turn into Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Your not gonna turn to Spider-Man. you're going the other way. So you are wasting away your immune system's weakening. your internal body feels like it is vibrating.

You just generally feel weak, exhausted, overwhelmed and burnt out. That's what's going to end up happening. So when you look up your water supply and it says uranium, and then you're just like, Oh, well, I have a fridge filter. No, that's not it. Well, okay. I've a carbon filter, uh-uh. No. Kangen, not doing it. No, sorry. Reverse osmosis, right? That's great. The only thing I've seen consistently remove uranium and radium and all of these is actual distilling of water, which is a very specific type of filtration.

And the reason we want to remove it is because I've only seen a couple of things absolutely crush your mitochondria as a toxin where I can see it repeatedly over and over. One is mycotoxins are mold and the second one is radioactive elements. The third that I have seen is a ton of mercury and I'm not talking about like the little bits that you get even from like one filling. Is that a problem? Yes, but it hasn't crushed mitochondria, where I can see in an organic acid test, or I could see your Krebs cycle, and I see you're fatty acid cycle actually like collapsing, like where they're just all red ping to the side of the testing.

No, that's uranium, radium, and mold. So that's why it's important. If your mitochondria are off, you just, all the symptoms I said earlier, feel awful and you're not coming out of it. You're in cell danger response and that building and your breaking. And the reason why distillers work, just take us down that, is a distiller, and trust me, You know you have a distiller if you a have distillery. if your like, I don't know, maybe I'll go check. you don' have the distiller. And here's why. A distiller takes effort because you have this machine that has to be cleaned once a month.

And when you own a distillery and you'd have to clean it, you'll never not have a destiller again. Gross. Because when go clean this thing, You're scraping off like a quarter inch of what looks like this off white, yellow, hardening stuff that looks it should be in a toilet. and it smells like it. You got frenemies to me, I got infertility water from you. Yeah. So that's what that is. The infertility water, yes. I've absolutely said that a million times. And so when you have the distiller, you know what you're cleaning and it heats the water and those really heavy elements, those radioactive elements that are at the bottom of your periodic chart, stay in the tank.

Oh. the H2O evaporates into another tank and then it gets filtered so that you can remove anything that goes with the vaporized water. And then now you're drinking it. So in my home, we have a carbon filter the whole house because you cannot distill to your house. Yeah. Then it goes to the distiller. We don't have to clean the still quite as often, which is also a benefit. The thing is, You have to live in an environment that is safe enough for you to get well. For you get to well, right? Like for me, I go through my brain as a systematic approach because we all love all the new stuff, Jess.

We love the latest cutting edge thing. You know, is it Ibu or ionophoresis or is this cool red light therapy or this dopamine chair that you have here that I was sitting on? The cool new tech is fun and it goes viral. The problem is you can't forget about the old stuff. And as we go down our list as docs, there's so much to think about. There's. So much too. To remember that you need to just check off the list to understand if somebody can't even get well. Water is one of them. It's not sexy, but like check water and air and food and hygiene and implants and dental.

Like just going down the list, you have to be in a place where you can get well to, be able to get. Well, and many doctors, they're like, Oh, I got this new supplement routine, or I've got. This new therapy, this, new coffee and the new colonic. And, And they skip steps. Yes. And that's the important thing that people really have to realize. And we don't want to talk about water. Just don' drink plastic. It's not that, it's more.

Radiation in Water and Mitochondrial Damage 30:40

I'm just like, we've got to dial in each of these pieces. If you live in a place that is now safe, do you feel safe there? I ask people that too. You're exactly right. And if you ask people, I don't know if, you've had this happen. You know, a number of people that I've asked, do you feel safe? And that question is so foreign to them as a concept, like to even think about feeling safe and relaxed somewhere. like of course you're not getting well they don't even know how to answer it sometimes they're like stutter on the answer because they've never even thought about that i know and most of them don's no if you have okay if your listening right now and as i've been saying anything your shoulders are creeping up you know they just kind of like going up to your ears like Climbing or you're leaning in more and more more as we're listening You're a little on the edge of your seat or your just like oh, man.

I haven't checked that I've done this and you've got this list in your mind It's constantly stressing you out and your worried about it or if you grown up in a household that You honestly picked up on these habits and or personality types a type people-pleasing OCD your worrywart Those personality type You're a great mom, wife, provider, employee, but you might not be a care giver to yourself because you're wearing yourself out, which is why you end up in our clinic. Because if there is a battery or a bank account that you could check your charge on, you spend half of your daily energy on all this other stuff.

And it's not on being well or healing or feeling safe. And that's what a lot of the clients that I'm working with really have to realize is like, you only have so much energy to spend in a day. Where are we putting it? Exactly. I think a lotta people don't think about that. What happens to the body long-term when you're stuck in flight or fight? Does it show up as pain, autoimmune? What do you see? all of that. So I'm going to go from labs to symptoms to outcomes, right? So what happens when you're fight or flight all day?

Cortisol goes up, which here's your fight-or-flight hormones, comes from the adrenals, you see the late night commercials. Cortisols up. You're going get fat here, so that happens. So you're in the United States where we are undernourished, overweight, and it's because we get bad nutrients, too much stress and we end up getting fat, right? So, you've got that sort of thing going on because you are stuck in fight or flight for whatever reason, all the things we talked about. Then I go and look at your labs, your minerals are low in your body.

So I can look in organic acid tests, bottom of the test, minerals were low. You're not breaking down amino acids, so proteins aren't breaking, down your gut is leaky. And then we look your nutrients, you're burning through your nutrient so they're depleting. Your probably trying not to eat because you like, I'm overweight. It's not a food problem. And in many cases, the clients that come into my office is because they've already been through seven doctors that have already corrected their diet, hoping that that would solve the problem and it doesn't.

Then I go into a hair tissue mineral test and your sodium and potassium are just gone. They're just bottomed out. Your cobalt, which is methylcobalamin or B12 is used up. So we're starting to see this pattern developing across the labs. These people, oftentimes, they're like, I'm exercise intolerant. I just have no motivation. i'm burnt out.I just don't enjoy things that I used to enjoy. And that can be anything. They start retracting from society.They're not as social as they used To be. Wait, are you saying this is nervous system dysregulation?

Because I don t think a lot of people would pick up on that. So yes, nervous systems regulation is a key piece of this. I talk about in many podcasts like the neurotoxic loop. So what is nervous system dysregulation? Is this that your nervous is dys-regulated because of lifestyle, trauma, personality, genetics that, that create this, this fight or flight state without the infections and the toxins. So you've got that classification of people over here and those people, um, not necessarily them, but there's, there a class people that they just want to do breath work.

They want to listen to the, uh, the turtle drum that's super relaxing and, and you know, you're listening to all the right music. You're doing your binaural beats. Your listen, looking through your, um, neurofeedback glasses, your you doing all of the things nervous system. And then you've got the other category of people who they're like, well, my nervous system is just regulated because I have infections and toxins and that is causing my body to feel unsafe, which is leading to all the symptoms.

But I don't want to do all this stuff over here, all those nervous systems stuff. I just want kill stuff and detox it. So it's neurotoxic loop because if you're toxic, your nervous system is just regulated. Your nervous systems just regulate your immune system, suppress your detox pathways are broken. So then you don't detox. Then you accumulate all the stuff. You have to figure out. It's both. And even if you go to social media right now and you start Googling, you're going to find all the people you I'm going start.

I don't want to come up with a new word right. You got the nervous system, bros, or the, the the. Nervous system ladies that it's all nervous. And we should just breathe our way through and do our eye yoga and, and then everything's going. No, it's not necessarily just that. But then you also have your other people that are like, oh, just take ivermectin all day and take charcoal or Ibu or chelate. And if you do that, you're fine. Then your nervous system will go back. I'm like no, no you won't.

You're going to end up in my clinic because one or the other won' t work and we've got to do both. That's right. So do you think possibly that being in flight or fight chronically is attracting said pathogens? Is it attracting it or is it making you vulnerable to it? And we all run into it every day. Yes. Which one? What do you think? Is that possible? I mean, you're going down the conversation to me of like the energetic path of what's attracting to your body. I think that if you are stuck in fight or flight, You have dysregulated your gut, which opened up the gut to being leaky.

That leakiness allows infections into your think that you're suppressing your immune system so your system can't respond appropriately so then you end up not being able to defend against the toxins. I think your body's not focused on detoxification because it's in fight-or-flight so, then the toxin start to accumulate which further suppresses yourimmune system because why is it that one person can handle the radioactive elements in the water and another can? Well, could it be genetic? Sure. Could it, be that, one persons more anabolic and working out and flushing their body more?

Yes. Or could it be that this person's in fight or flight, so their body's not focused on detox, it's focused and survival.

Fight-or-Flight, Labs, and Nervous System Dysregulation 38:00

They're different. And then this over here is in a spot where they are, um, Not, not fight or flight, right? So their body's just dealing with things as they're coming. They go into rest and digest at night. Their body is able to flush things out versus, you know, are they being attracted to you? Do parasites, viruses, or otherwise want to come into you because of it? I don't know the answer to that, but I know your terrain is just trash. Yes. When you're stuck in fight-or-flight and that's what the world does to us.

I don't care what your political affiliation is, your algorithm will tell you and it will feed you all the crap that'll trigger you over and over. It will trigger. You, the world's coming into an end because of ex-politician or, um, you know, if it's health that you worry about, You're going to get all of the guys that are out there that fear-mongering that they're posting. Everything's going kill you with no solutions. Or, yeah, The world is just wired to trigger us. And that's just the way it is.

Absolutely. Can you give me an example? You know, you work with people who've basically tried everything, seen all kinds of variety of doctors. You know, I was thinking about this in a conversation I have with my team. They're just like, what's the coolest change that you've seen? And I'm like I've seem like 10,000 clients at this point. The coolest one was this guy. He was a scary book writer for kids. Oh. He's like a Goosebumps writer kind of guy, right? Like, he was 31 years old. And when he came in, my room in my office was like 60 foot down the hallway.

That's not that far for you and I to think about walking. They're like, can you put a chair in the middle? He is 31-years-old. Two years earlier, He was overweight, but totally functional. Now he's emaciated. He has curled over on a walker. They didn't know what to do with him. And just to make everybody laugh, because this is a frame of reference thing. The patient that referred him in was his uncle-in-law, right? And the guy was like, oh, my nephew down South Missouri, cause I'm Northern Missouri.

Nobody can help him He's, he's just got a little bit of pain. Can you help him? I'm like, probably. There's like a, little neuropathy. Okay. I probably can help them. So they bring them up. He comes down my hallway and I was like. That's a a bit neuopathy? And I remember this patient's name and he came with him. And he was in my office. We have real big different definitions of neuapathy, but he is coming down. My hallway, and then he sits down after two stops and gets in. He'd been to Mayo, he'd be to all the clinics in Kansas City for a stack of labs a stick.

He was diagnosed with B6 toxicity. Oh, I've heard of this. Yeah. And that was his diagnosis. And at the time I was doing a test where we prick your finger and look at your blood, which no longer can I do because they, the CLIA, The Lab Governing Body came in and said, well, to do this, you have to have a class blah, blah blah lab that has this this and that. And basically the only way you can do it is if you a medical doctor that's had a year or longer as a pathologist working in your lab, in office.

So I can't do. They're like, no, You can. You just had blah and they'd go through the, I'm like. I don't make $6 million a year to have a lab and pay a doc to do this for me all day. And I do for like 20 bucks because I want people to see it. Anyway, I can't do it anymore. But in the finger prick, and at the time lab testing was bad, now we've actually got testing where I could look this stuff up, but there were more bacteria in his blood. than there were blood cells. So I was like, obviously that's not a B6 toxicity.

Something else is going on here. I couldn't give him a diagnosis based off that. It's just an observation. Then I went on to look at the lab testing that was a CDC negative Lyme, which was trash. he couldn't tolerate hardly any supplements. And this was pre-COVID, pre the mast cell explosion. This was my first guy with mast cells I ever worked with. We spent almost a year trying to help him to be able to detox. I mentioned scary book right earlier, right? He, when we started doing parasite cleansing at a very light amount, started pooping out parasites.

But this is one of those guys that because of his profession got real into it. Yeah. And of course he wants to show you pictures. He measured his parasites 300 foot a month for three full months before he just gave up on doing it. They were changing type and he was putting them in a five gallon bucket. I was like, first of all, that's nasty. That's just nasty, and that is going to smell. But he was into it because he really wanted to heal. And I came up with a method of treatment for him because we kept fighting and trying and fighting, and working.

We called it the pulse method where we would do like a dose on and then like seven days off, a dos on six days, off because his body could not tolerate building up by titration, like one, two drops a day building, up, to higher doses. So we figured this out for And I just remember him going from there to like, again, a year later, his uncle walks in, who's still seeing me just on an occasion for tuneups. And he shows me a video and it's this patient who couldn't walk down my hallway. He was doing this.

like LR Janine body movement where you like flap your arms and you kind of flap you legs which he could not do at the beginning and he recorded himself. He could NOT flap his arms for 30 seconds sitting down when we started. And he flaps his arm and then he jumps up and kicks his leg in the air and claps his hands under his legs. Oh my gosh! And the guy couldn't walk down the hallway without a walker. And like, I just stopped and I started like tearing up. I feel like I'm going to do it right now.

Cause I was just like. Holy crap. Like this is why we do what we. And I remember the amount of sleep I lost and frustration I had and conversations I have with, with team members and friends and colleagues, because I mean, had never seen someone so destroyed by what he was dealing with. And I just, last time I talked to him, it was because he was better, had a full-time job, was making money. His wife who had had MS became a patient who has dropped foot and lost feeling in her arm. And that was gone and that had gotten better and they were just checking in.

So they both had Lyme. They both ended up having lime. Wow. We don't know if it's sexually transmitted or whatever. Um, big, huge question, but I just, you know, I'm just thinking back to those, those two, that family. And it's just like, it was such a blessing for me to have them when I did and be able to work with them and have then like open my eyes to so much.

A Severe Lyme Case and the Pulse Method 46:00

Cause he taught me the pulse method. Taught me patience personally and professionally. And he gave me that confidence to working with me long enough. to be able to figure it out with him. So like he blessed me and my practice and so many people after him that I've been able help. And I taught the pulse method from stages and doctors will message me that it's helping their patients. We wanted to name it after Him and I'm like, that's not HIPAA compliant. But originally I had it named after Hem on my paperwork in the clinic.

The coolest part of that whole story is just that he's living. 31 years old. He's out there, he is living, He is thriving. And it all started because they moved into a rental that had a jet tub that has mold behind the walls of the tub in the pipes. And I had no idea that when water gets through a tub, if it's not an air jet, oh, it was a water jet. Then it will almost always grow mold in there. So he was soaking his Epson salt baths and he, he doing all this stuff in this tub. Oh man. He's basically forcing mold across his skin into his body.

And that's the beginning of this whole story for him. So mold lowered his immune system enough to where he could get Lyme disease or it could take over his body in some way. What do you say to these people out there, the naysayers, who say parasites aren't that big of a problem and that's not what you saw coming out of him? It depends on who's saying it. If they have reasonable logic in their brain, then I start having a fun conversation with them. Am I okay? So parasites don't exist? They're not in the United States, right?

Cause that's, that the prefaces. That's where they prefaced it like, where's the research? Show me it? Okay. Let's talk. So, so can we agree that parasites exist in the United States? Not necessarily in humans, but just in general on the soil that can get into animals. Yes. No one's arguing that. Do you do a parasite cleanse of some sort? Does your vet recommend it and they have proof that it's necessary, at least usually twice a year? Yes, you. So do they. Have testing to find this parasite? Can you see this come out of them if you have pets?

Okay. I guess no question. Does your indoor cat get parasites that never leaves the inside or your end or dog in the condo of New York or whatever that does not go outside? What do you feed it? Little pebbles, right? A little pebble is a whatever. Or maybe you fed a human food because today people feed their animals better food than they feed themselves. Let's be honest. But do feed a really quality food or pebbles? I guess. Okay. So let's go with the pevel people. The pebel people, The industry standard has to be that there's no parasites in the pebbles because they check for that.

So now they are feeding food that, there is absolutely no parasite sandwich. By the way, as humans, we food parasites on all day because do you eat raw fruit, raw vegetables, not fully cooked? Do you medium or less meat? I do not have sushi anymore. Okay, well, a lot of people does. Do you stick your hands in the dirt? Do play in sand? You go swimming in a lake upon the ocean for that matter? If the answer is yes to any of that, do you have an animal that can have parasites? Absolutely. Then you're around parasites.

If you do any that. So if your animal lives in an environment that there are not parasites in your home, because they're in the 27th floor condo of New York, never go outside and eat food that doesn't have parasites, but they still get parasites. Where do they come from? You. They come the human that drags the men with their shoes. Or. they're blowing through the wind and they get in through, the window or through. The door or however they. Get in, they, get, in because we come into contact with, with food and or environment of parasites constantly.

All right. So, so we know they are here. You can't deny it anymore. I don't care who you are. It's not deniable. Like tell me you don' come in contact. Don't try it. They're only in Africa. There only. In Mexico. No. They're absolutely not only in those places. We just proved that they're where we are. Okay. Now, human bodies, are we healthier as a population than that dog that you curate their life? I'm talking about princess bag lady, perfect life puppy that, you still deworm. No, you don't live a better life than them.

I guarantee you, don' eat better than than. You go out and have a drink, You get stressed out, take your antacids, and you have taken antibiotics. you do all the things that make you vulnerable to parasites because if your gut bacteria are not healthy, guess what? you're going to get a parasite because the bacteria defend you against parasites. So if you've had an antibiotic, an antacid, a drug that messes with your immune system, so antidepressants or otherwise, you are not going have an immune systems or digestive tract that can protect you properly.

any of that. If you're stressed out, you decrease your hydrochloric acid in your stomach, which takes away the protective lining of acids that would incinerate the parasites when you eat them from your raw vegan diet, your fresh fruits. I'm not telling you not to eat those things. That's going to potentially have parasites. Your meats, sushi, whatever, it's all coming in. So Now that we know that your digestive tract as an American for sure and as a human is likely vulnerable, and you're also getting the parasites in your diet that is coming from Mexico and Colombia and India and everywhere else, how could we not be vulnerable and have parasites?

How is it even conceptually possible to argue that fact? It's true. I agree. And we don't have the best food system in the world anymore. We don' have best immune system anymore, so it makes sense to me. with parasites, you know, they seem to be a central part of how we practice. And, I've learned a lot from you and other chiropractors as a medical doctor. I credit a of my knowledge to people like you, and your colleagues. So, how come, why does that still scare people? And what keeps people stuck from learning about what you do and medical doctors from I think what it is, I mean, one, medical school is hard to get into.

So there's ego, right? Like if that's the peak, then why are we going to go below? Why are going go to people that we don't look at as highly educated or that are at the top of the system or Whatever thought process. So there's some of that because trust me, I have a social media account like you do and man, the hits that we take for you're not this, you can't know about it. I'm like, wait a minute. so I can research something and have clue about anything because I don't have MD after my name. Like when, when did we become information police everywhere?

Like it's insane. I can go and try GPT right now and I learn how to code.

Parasites, Medical Skepticism, and Healing Mindset 54:00

Can learn to be an engineer. Not saying I'm going to go out and build a giant bridge, but I could at least learn about it and talk about. And to honest, the computer programmers and the tech people in my world now never got degrees and they're way better than the people that are getting degrees in most cases. patients who have 10 times more knowledge than most of the colleagues I have with whatever degrees, MD, DO, DC, PT, whatever, because they're passionately researching what's on the cutting edge.

And I really truly think that it comes down to there is just a There's just this thing that we used to think about that is no longer the truth, which is you go to school and you learn information and then you're the expert because information wasn't moving at light speed. Right. Today, if you are not keeping up, you falling behind. That's as simple as it is. So if have a medical doctor that graduated 20 years ago, Can they save your life if you need CPR or if need some basic life-saving practice that has not changed because it's an ER move?

Yeah. Please, if it is an emergency, go to the ER. Right. But if its about the cutting edge of the best medication, the herb, lifestyle management, best diets, Go to somebody who is up to date. And that is not information that one is being taught in school today anyway. You have to be at the cutting edge and it's moving faster every day. And we all know this. So when I'm at conferences and I am hanging out with your friends as medical doctors, every time I hang around you at a conference, there's a new medical doctor that walks up to you that's like, I thought you were this crazy person that was whatever.

When we were at this conference at the CEU, this whatever, which is continuing eds, and now they're like, now I see what you're talking about. Every time I'm at a conference, you have another medical doctor thanking you for being at The Cutting Edge. And now, they are like I feel so far behind you, Jess. Yeah, I thought it was a quack the whole time. That's what they made me feel like, for sure. Yeah. It's all coming full circle now. I guess, Dr. Javen, For the person listening out there who's exhausted, anxious, inflamed, they have no hope.

What's the first belief they need to let go of to heal? believe they have to let go of to heal and that their body isn't meant so it's not necessarily a belief outwardly it a lot of people walk in and they don't realize their bodies supposed to be healthy. It's so interesting because the norm now is sick. It is not well. The norm is now symptoms, it's not the lack of symptoms. You and I joke about this all the time because I've been through my health journey. I have gone through Lyme and mold and parasites and the whole thing.

And my body overall genetically is really hard to break down. I was really, really stupid in college because I'm very, very stubborn with my living experience. And what I've realized is when you're well, your body does amazing at staying well. If you give it the confidence, it will stay there. So many people don't realize that. Don't think about my digestive tract. I don't even know it exists. Like do you ever think of your gut? No, never do think your brain like do realize the brain is there like you can feel it you think About it No.

Do you think about your knee joints or your elbow joints? Or your heart? Your lungs? No, you survive. You're just you're like living without the knowledge of all these individual little parts of your body. Whereas most of our clients and patients, they know all of these things are thinking about all the things they it's symptoms that tell them that those organs exist. So the belief I want you to get rid of is the believe that you should need to know of that. Ah, And the belief that you have to do this on your own, you to monitor all that, and you, have, to you.

When people come into my clinic, I'm like, look, don't give me trust blindly. But you followed me for a year. You've looked at what I do. you've researched, You gave me the trust to give the time, because time is expensive and the money to pay for this appointment to run the labs. Can you give a couple months of trust where you stay off the Facebook forums? You get out of Instagram scrolling. Step away from being a leader in your world of health. And you know, you just allow yourself to go back to living and you allow for me to take that burden on for you so that you can then rest.

So it's surrender and trust. Yeah, I love that. I loved that so much. Dr. Jaben Moore, thank you for coming on the podcast today. It's been your wealth of information. And I Love you as a friend and a colleague and business partner too. So can you tell everyone listening, where can they find more of you? Just look me up my name, Dr Jabin Moore. We're on every platform. All of them. Yeah. So platform, you have a virtual clinic, right? You have Prick and Mortar Clinic in Kansas City. We do. Okay. Yeah, we're here just to help.

I mean, after you've gone through what I've done through, You just want people to know it's possible to heal. You Just want them to have the hope and the knowledge whether I can help you and you want to work with me or not. you just need to Know your body is designed to be well and your design to get out there and do the things you love. I love it. Thank you so, so much.