Full Transcript Opening with the NBCC Rising Star win 0:00 Welcome to the Wellness on Tap podcast 0:02 with your host Dr. Debs Eastwood. 0:06 >> 2024 I won the NBCC Rising Star. And it 0:11 was really interesting to watch because 0:14 as the names came up on the screen, like 0:16 people were like clapping and cheering. 0:18 Nobody captain shared for me. 0:20 >> Nobody knew who I was. 0:21 >> Ah, okay. Just because you were at that 0:23 point still anonymous. 0:25 >> Yeah. Nobody knew. Okay. And so then 0:27 when I won it, I was like, 0:30 what has just happened? Because, and I 0:33 know you can't base like cuz people have 0:35 got people with them and you can't base 0:38 cheers and claps um on things. 0:44 >> However, like it's usually a pretty good 0:48 indicator and it was near enough silent. 0:50 There's a few people in the room who 0:52 knew me. Like nobody knew me. absolutely 0:55 nobody. And everybody's like, "Are you?" 0:58 And I was like, "Yeah, like I I don't 1:01 know how." And it was really interesting 1:03 because when I went back a year later, 1:05 so November just gone, 1:08 I'm going to say I probably knew 1:14 a good 80% of 1:19 the main people in that room. 1:21 >> What a difference a year makes. E. 1:23 >> That's really interesting. And I was 1:24 like, that's some hard graph that is. 1:26 >> Cuz these aren't just like, 1:29 and no disrespect, like your normal Joe 1:31 blogs, 1:33 >> they were literally like top echelons of 1:36 people in 1:39 government in it was just it was the 1:42 most bizarre 1:45 experience I've ever had. So I was 1:46 sitting on the table with this woman and 1:48 she kept looking at me and smiling 1:50 and then she said, "Oh, you know, we 1:52 should do some stuff together and like 1:54 work together after this." I was like, 1:55 "Oh, yeah." So it was my mate Dear Dree. 1:57 So me and Dear Dree, like my mate, Dear 1:59 Dree. So anyway, this girl comes along 2:03 and 2:05 she's like, "Hi, Dear Dree." And then 2:07 she was like, "You didn't tell me you 2:09 knew Dear Drew." I'm like, "Oh no, this 2:11 is my mate Dear just met tonight." And 2:12 she's like, "The Dear Dree." And I'm 2:15 like, "Okay, yeah, my mate Dear Dree." 2:17 She like, "Do you know who Dear Dree 2:18 is?" And I was like, "My mate Dear 2:20 Dree?" Turns out my new mate Dear Dree 2:23 is who they call the Olivia Pope of 2:26 Governance and she solves problems for 2:31 national and international government. 2:32 That's not one of the things that she 2:33 does. 2:34 >> One of the things. 2:36 >> Great. 2:37 >> Wow. 2:37 >> Yeah. 2:38 >> Nice stuff. 2:39 >> I know. And then from there, it just 2:42 just kept going. And then uh so we ended 2:46 the year November to November 2:48 on five awards. Two of those being 2:53 national from Wales 2:55 um in diversity and 2:59 the girl from West Brom who was never 3:01 going to become anything I think. 3:04 >> And there the story begins, does it not? 3:09 >> I'd say that's where the meaty part 3:11 begins. it, you know, 3:14 it's 3:17 it's interesting cuz it kind of 3:20 doveetails. So, we were talking about 3:21 prisons and 3:22 >> absolutely. Yeah. 3:23 >> What 3:25 I learned in prisons 3:28 and it was 3:30 such an interesting place 3:33 to be and to work. So as you know as a
Career path into specialist mental health nursing 3:37 medical professional 3:40 um you have specialisms but I happen to 3:43 specialize within my specialism. 3:46 So I qualified as a mental health nurse 3:51 or RMN. 3:53 I then got headunted for my first job. 3:55 So I didn't go into normal acute. I 3:58 actually went into perinatal psychiatry 4:00 which is mother and baby. 4:02 Um then whilst at mother and baby I did 4:08 uh neurossychiatry, deaf psychiatry, 4:10 eating disorder. 4:12 Then went into rapid assessment. So when 4:16 you're based at um a 4:20 >> and then worked for the team who 4:24 >> I suppose it's hard to describe to a 4:27 layman but you'll essentially manage the 4:30 risk of people coming in but then you 4:33 also like hold beds like you would for a 4:36 normal ward for people who are in the 4:40 community under a mental health team or 4:43 forensic team but come into hospital are 4:46 in hospital. So you manage their care 4:49 >> while they're there and then you'd 4:50 almost like discharge them back to their 4:52 team. 4:53 >> And then from then uh went into 4:58 forensic psychiatry although that had 5:01 always been a part since qualifying and 5:05 even before qualifying. So I did the 5:08 forensic community teams where you're 5:11 managing offenders out on license. It 5:15 could be like life license time license. 5:17 Um who have severe and enduring mental 5:21 health problems and then from working in 5:24 prisons from broad mort 5:27 uh managing 5:30 some quite notorious 5:32 >> offenders. So looking after their mental 5:35 health care. But what I found on those 5:42 wars, on those wings, was they taught me 5:46 the biggest lessons ever. The biggest. 5:50 And 5:51 >> yeah, I bet 5:52 >> people like to label them as monsters. 5:55 And you get the ones that you're just 5:57 like, you're a monster. 6:00 >> Yeah. You can't dress this one up. 6:02 >> Yeah. You can't like if it walks like a 6:04 duck and quacks like a duck, it's a 6:05 duck. Yes. 6:07 >> However, 6:10 the majority 6:12 of them something happened 6:16 >> and you have to say or my mom used to 6:19 say a little bit of love goes a long way 6:22 and you were like if you were just loved 6:24 a little bit more. 6:26 >> Yeah. If somebody just took the time out 6:29 to 6:31 nourish your hero or water to you, 6:37 what would have become of you? Because 6:41 we're all one step away, aren't we? 6:43 We're all one step away from making a 6:45 mistake that can be lifechanging and 6:49 lifealtering for us. 6:50 >> Yeah. 6:51 >> Or for somebody else. 6:53 >> Absolutely. We're entirely fallible 6:56 beings, aren't we? 6:57 >> Yeah. Yeah. And so mental health 7:02 has always been 7:06 a massive driver for me. And I never 7:09 ever thought I'd be a nurse. Never. Uh 7:12 not in a million years. And I remember 7:14 when I was nine, somebody said to me, 7:15 they like, "Do you know when you grow 7:17 up, you're going to be a nurse?" And I 7:20 went, 7:22 I'm not going to be somebody's skiibby. 7:25 And skipped off my skipping robe. This 7:28 woman was horrified cuz I was just like, 7:30 nurses, absolutely not. And then 7:32 someone's like, oh, and and your work 7:34 with children. And I was like, okay, 7:37 firstly, I don't want children. 7:39 Secondly, I don't want to work with 7:41 women. And thirdly, no, I'm not going to 7:43 be a nurse. Goodbye. 7:45 All food came true. 7:47 >> Yeah. perinatal. Yeah. 7:50 >> And when I end up in that ward, I was 7:52 like, "Fuck 7:55 >> women." 7:55 >> She'll be right back. 7:56 >> Yeah. Women, babies. And then 8:01 by that time, I'd had a child of my own. 8:04 Um even though I was like never going to 8:06 have children. 8:08 and that it's in the full circle now 8:12 because I truly believe that 8:16 we have to 8:19 when I'm in if that nursing home or as I 8:25 you know age and my career goes on you 8:29 have to know who's got your back and in 8:31 order to do that you have to be 8:34 mentoring the future 8:36 >> yes 8:36 >> and guiding them agree 8:39 I agree. I do look around sometimes and 8:42 think 8:45 heaven help us. 8:48 You know, I I need to just have some 8:51 time with you and give you what guidance 8:54 I can offer and hope that a lot of other 8:56 people do the same. 8:58 >> And you take the best from what each of 9:00 us offer. Yeah. 9:02 It's so scary to especially when we look 9:10 at the medical field, at the NHS, 9:13 um, and what a great institution it 9:16 started as and where we are now. And, 9:19 you know, we could get all political and 9:20 go to government and all the rest of it, 9:21 but we're not going to do that. But the 9:24 fact is, it is where it is. And we're 9:26 overworked and certainly underpaid. And
Lessons from prison and forensic psychiatry 9:31 that's the reason why I left and became 9:33 a private contractor. 9:36 But when you look at case loads for 9:38 instance, so when I was in prison, 9:44 you it's crazy 9:48 having to have a case load of 40 men. 9:53 That sounds like a lot. 9:56 But it gets worse because 9:58 30% of them like 25 to 30% of that if 10:04 not more or not percent actually per 10:08 people. So So we've had 40 25 to 30 of 10:11 them would be severing. So they would be 10:14 the ones that would most likely end up 10:17 in coroner's court. 10:19 >> Right. So you'd come in every day and 10:22 you switch that computer on and you'd 10:25 pray that you could get into everybody's 10:27 notes. Oh, 10:29 >> cuz if those notes were blacked out, you 10:31 knew that that person had died during 10:33 the night. 10:33 >> Oh my goodness. 10:36 Okay, 10:38 that's a grim way to start your day 10:39 every day, 10:40 >> right? 10:42 That was and 10:45 that and and it happened to me. 10:46 >> Yeah, I'm sure. I mean, you you you 10:49 you're very charmed if you do if you go 10:51 through working 10:54 in forensic psychiatry like within 10:56 prisons and never have a death in 10:57 custody 10:58 >> like you're you lead a charmed life. 11:02 >> Yeah. 11:02 >> But the one thing that you do learn is 11:05 about nursing robustly. 11:08 >> Yeah. 11:09 >> Because your back is against the wall 11:12 and especially during COVID times. CO 11:14 times were just feral. That was just 11:17 a nightmare. And I remember 11:22 being 11:24 threatened a lot of the time with losing 11:26 my job 11:28 >> because they 11:30 So 11:32 what had happened is they started 11:34 putting phones in the cells, 11:36 >> right? 11:36 >> Which is fine. Um because you know you 11:39 had like all the the safety 11:44 stuff like you know two meters because 11:46 co new distance and all the rest of it 11:48 but you too [ __ ] ridiculous. If 11:51 you're inside this square you're going 11:53 to be safe. You're not going to catch 11:55 it. 11:55 >> Yeah. Of course that's how it works. And 11:58 then there was an expectation 12:01 that we would assess them 12:05 over the phone. I was like are you mad? 12:07 Are you mad? You think that I'm going to 12:11 >> using all those body language cues, 12:13 >> assess them, right? So, assess them over 12:15 the phone and when they string 12:16 themselves up, then you want me to stand 12:19 in coroner's call opposite their loved 12:21 one and say, "Your son's dead 12:25 because I missed the signs because I 12:30 assess them over the phone." That that's 12:32 that's what you want me to do. me and my 12:34 off limb's a little pin number that I've 12:36 taken that I've had for 25 years. You 12:39 want me to roll on down to that wing and 12:44 or not even go to the wing? And I was 12:46 just like, if you open that door and I 12:48 was like, don't worry about me. I'll 12:50 open the door. 12:52 >> Good for you. 12:54 Good for you. At med school, one of the 12:57 most favorite lecturers that we had 12:59 there who also did some pastoral stuff. 13:02 Um, and I spent some time with him as a 13:04 pastoral tutor. 13:05 >> Yeah. 13:06 >> Um, Dr. Steve Peters, and he was a 13:10 forensic psychiatrist, 13:12 >> and he worked out of Rampton, 13:15 >> um, which isn't a million miles away 13:17 from where we're sitting right now. 13:19 >> Yeah. Yeah. 13:20 >> Um, and obviously he didn't disclose any 13:23 details about anything, but, you know, 13:26 he used to say it was an an interesting 13:28 ride. Yes. Yes. You know, clearly he met 13:32 all sorts of people that were very 13:36 severely 13:38 and designated as as criminally mentally 13:41 ill. Yeah. 13:42 >> Because they'd committed crimes that 13:44 were designated down to their mental 13:45 health, rightly or wrongly, whatever the 13:47 reason. I'm not here to judge. That was 13:49 just 13:50 >> the way the system categorized them. And 13:52 then when I worked 13:54 um at the hospital here in Doncaster 13:57 >> Mhm. Um, as part of my training, I one 14:02 day had a a patient who came from 14:05 Rampton. 14:06 >> That was an interesting experience for 14:09 me as somebody who unlike you had never 14:12 worked in a prison. I'd not got any real 14:14 concept 14:16 of what it was actually like, really 14:18 like. So, seeing um an inmate, a 14:23 patient, don't know what the correct 14:24 terminology is. 14:25 >> Residents apparently. Oh, of residence. 14:27 My god, I don't think I'd have ever got 14:29 there. Um, 14:32 coming in for surgery. 14:34 >> Yeah. 14:34 >> And me going into the room where they 14:37 were and standing in the same room and 14:41 seeing them shackled. 14:42 >> Yeah. To the bed. 14:43 >> To the bed. And to guards. There was 14:45 about six. They were out. 14:47 >> Prison officers. 14:48 >> Yeah. They were out. 14:49 >> Call them guards. 14:50 >> Sorry. See what I mean? I am so unpy 14:53 with my language here. Um so but yeah 14:58 she was being looked after. 15:01 >> Yeah. 15:02 >> Um and then one of the people one of the 15:05 prison officers got changed into scrubs 15:08 and came into theater 15:11 >> at the same time. 15:12 >> Mhm. 15:13 >> Because once that person was under 15:16 anesthetic 15:18 >> there was the potential then that they 15:19 would need protection. 15:21 >> Yeah. 15:22 >> From the public. It was such an 15:23 eyeopener for me. 15:25 >> Yeah. Like people don't realize 15:29 what happened behind those walls. And I 15:32 say that because what we're talking 15:34 about now is you have somebody 15:36 non-medical coming into 15:40 the surgery, the surgery room. 15:44 >> Everything that we do behind those walls 15:49 is to keep them behind those walls. 15:52 So they do not to the point of when we 15:56 when we're talking about 16:00 um life support like the things that how 16:03 we're like we can we do everything up 16:06 until waiting for the ambulance to 16:10 arrive because of the paperwork because 16:13 of the security. 16:16 Like honestly to get just to get them 16:19 out safely and get them back in and the 16:23 risks to everybody. 16:26 >> Absolutely. Yeah. 16:27 >> And then people like, oh, how can you 16:30 work for those monsters? And it's just 16:31 like, 16:33 well, it's nice for you to be 16:34 privileged, but what we're doing is 16:37 we're keeping you safe. 16:41 >> Know that. 16:42 >> Yeah. 16:43 Yeah. And actually we're safer than you 16:46 are cuz at least I know who I'm walking 16:48 amongst. Do you? 16:50 >> Precisely. Yeah. 16:52 >> Because 16:54 like you were saying earlier people like 16:57 that who we can classify as monsters. 17:00 Rightly or wrongly, but we do. 17:02 >> Yeah. Yeah. 17:03 >> Um 17:04 they're the visible 17:06 >> Yeah. 17:06 >> monsters. It's the monster within the 17:10 ordinary person on the street that is 17:13 potentially 17:15 >> more dangerous because it's the unknown, 17:16 isn't it? 17:17 >> 100%. And we miss 17:22 we miss the trauma, the things that have 17:25 happened along the way to 17:29 cause that for them. So I never forget 17:34 the one day and I was far from home 17:39 because I used to it and there was like 17:44 a local so I had my local cat be 17:48 and I did that for a little bit but when 17:50 when you're going shopping so you know 17:52 like as you get older you have that 17:54 memory thing where you know you know 17:55 people and you don't know where they're 17:57 from and you can't quite remember 18:01 used to go shopping and they like, "Hi, 18:03 miss." And I'd be like, "Hia." And then 18:05 I'd be like, "Oh, 18:07 shit." 18:09 >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, I thought, "Right, 18:11 we're going to we're going to move away 18:14 a little bit, change our work area, and 18:17 I I was far away from home." And during 18:22 lunchtimes 18:23 the staff can use the prison gym. 18:29 So I love Olympic weightlifting. Got my 18:32 lifting shoes. Lifting shoes about £200 18:35 and I'd left them at the gym and I was 18:38 like they are not going to a prisoner 18:40 cell. That is not what's happening 18:42 today. 18:44 So I went down to the gym and as I 18:47 walked in, closed the gate behind me, 18:51 there was a higher miss and I was just I 18:53 ain't got no time for this nonsense. So 18:55 I carried on, got my shoes, came out and 19:00 as I was leaving, you're not going to 19:02 talk to me then, miss. And I was like, 19:04 do you know what? Let me give you an 19:05 IEP. Like just booking. So I was just 19:07 like, you're getting like pretty chipsy 19:08 and like I ain't got time for this. And 19:11 as I turned around, 19:14 I saw my childhood friend. So we had 19:17 gone from 19:20 infant school all the way to high school 19:24 together. 19:29 >> And I was like, 19:31 "What you doing here?" And he said, "I'm 19:34 serving life 19:36 >> for a gangland murder." Oh, wow. Gosh. 19:42 >> And I went home that night and I cried. 19:46 >> Yeah.
Trauma, childhood, and the impact of teachers 19:48 >> Because we were two people who grew up 19:54 in the same environment and we were on 19:56 different sides of the bars. 19:58 >> Yeah. 20:00 And when he told me, and he didn't have 20:04 to, um, cuz I wasn't going to ask him, 20:07 but when he told me the story behind it, 20:10 it was like, wow, who look at who 20:13 nourished his monster, 20:16 but to him it looked at the time they 20:19 were nourishing his hero cuz he went 20:22 through some trauma, then went to the 20:24 gang from belonging, and now 20:28 countless lives. lives have been lost, 20:30 including his own. 20:31 >> Yeah. 20:32 >> Because 20:35 I might have been 40 then. So, you know, 20:40 he was like never had uh 20:44 a proper girlfriend, haven't got any 20:46 children, 20:48 >> losses 20:49 the majority of his life. 20:52 >> Yeah. Yeah. Would never have the 20:53 experiences we take for granted. It's 20:55 normal. 20:56 >> Yeah. And I just thought, "Oh my god." 21:00 And seeing stories 21:04 or hearing stories like that, seeing 21:07 things that had happened to people when 21:12 them to end up where they are and doing 21:15 those sorts of things. I will for always 21:19 for always be grateful 21:22 for 21:25 my experience of prison nursing and and 21:29 working in the queue and work 21:31 working in um inner city communities. 21:35 I'm grateful for doing it and I'm 21:36 grateful for leaving with my life. 21:39 Yeah. 21:41 >> Yeah. Yeah. Oh my god. That's just 21:43 popped something an image right into my 21:45 head. So, as a medical student, you 21:48 obviously do a psychiatry rotation. 21:50 >> Yeah. 21:51 >> And we went out into the community. Um, 21:55 and I remember pulling up with, you 21:58 know, whoever it was I was with. I 22:00 wasn't going on my own, obviously. 22:02 >> And there was um 22:06 a I'm going to call them a patient. 22:08 There was a patient waiting outside 22:10 their house, 22:12 crouched on all fours like an animal 22:15 ready to spring. And I'm like, and I'm 22:17 willingly walking into their house. 22:19 >> It's a normal day. 22:20 >> Am I insane? 22:22 And then another time going, it might 22:26 even have been the same day. I don't 22:27 know. I can't remember. 22:28 >> It will be, it would have been the same 22:29 day. 22:30 >> The same day. um going into another 22:33 person's patient's home 22:36 and 22:39 um without disclosing anything, they 22:41 were displaying a lot of the attributes 22:43 of what I learned were reasonably 22:45 typical for schizophrenia. 22:47 >> Oh, okay. Yeah. 22:48 >> In that they had a lot of silver foil 22:50 around things. 22:51 >> Oh, that's old school schizophrenia. 22:54 >> Yeah. Um they had 22:57 um 23:00 toys for their child. Anything that had 23:03 anything electronic in there that voices 23:05 could come through 23:08 were outside in a box in the hallway of 23:11 the flat complex. 23:14 >> Um and machetes and things on the wall, 23:17 which is apparently something that used 23:19 to be really common that they would 23:21 >> Yes. like that kind of and beautiful old 23:25 samurai swords as well. But I'm sitting 23:28 in this room. One of the rules that was 23:30 hammered into us was always make sure 23:32 you're closest to the door. 23:33 >> Amen. 23:35 >> The only door I was closest to was out 23:39 onto a balcony and we were three stories 23:41 up. 23:42 >> How did you end up that far into the 23:43 room? because it was a rectangular 23:46 shaped room and the only way in 23:50 you couldn't stop in the first bit and 23:53 I'm like well this person that I'm with 23:55 knows this particular patient and 23:57 they've been seeing them for a long time 23:59 so I'm relying on them to do the risk 24:02 assessment and know that we are actually 24:04 safe to be here. I was like, 24:07 okay, I can't say I was comfortable 24:09 during that encounter. Let's put it that 24:11 way. 24:13 So, I knew that mental health 24:16 >> was not for you 24:16 >> as a career passion was not for me. 24:19 >> But I found it so interesting. 24:22 >> Yeah. 24:23 >> And it made me think, and this is 24:25 something you've touched on a few times 24:26 now, and I really want to dig into 24:28 because it can happen to any single one 24:30 of us. 24:31 >> Yeah. 24:32 how incidents of trauma, 24:35 >> yeah, 24:36 >> bring out the worst in us, if you like. 24:38 And when we're talking trauma, we're not 24:40 necessarily talking huge things. We're 24:42 talking about belittlement. We're 24:44 talking about shaming. We're talking 24:46 about 24:47 >> all those kind of things, aren't we? 24:50 >> We'll come back to that. And it just 24:52 because I've got to tell you this story 24:53 because I still find it hilarious 24:55 talking about being the community and 24:58 patients, service users, however you 25:00 want to call them. 25:02 >> I'm bound to call it wrong. 25:03 >> And um No, I'm just saying whatever 25:05 because it it is probably changed again. 25:09 But I never forget we so I don't know 25:13 where to to compare it to, but it's like 25:17 in the city of Birmingham. Anybody from 25:19 Birmingham will know where the main 25:20 mosque is in Birmingham, rough around 25:23 there. And you've got lots of um 25:27 tower blocks. 25:29 And so we were going to see a patient 25:30 and the patient on the 10th floor, not 25:32 the first time seen this uh patient 25:36 and they were having a depo. So a depo 25:39 injection is for 25:42 usually used for somebody who's um 25:44 non-compliant with their medication or 25:47 non-concordant. 25:49 but normally not compliant. We're not 25:51 having it. So, and they've normally got 25:53 syringe or in mental health 25:56 like schizophrenia, bipolar. 25:59 And as we were walking to the building, 26:01 my colleague got a call cuz you go in 26:03 twos. 26:04 >> And I said, "Take this call." Cuz they 26:07 were on an old fashion depot, so it's 26:09 really oily, takes long to draw up. 26:12 Normally you'll place it between your 26:14 legs some up or put it in your boobs in 26:16 a glove people before people start 26:18 losing their mind. Um but didn't have 26:20 time to do that. So I was like it's 26:22 going to take me time to warm it up. 26:23 Take the call. Meet me up there. Fine. 26:27 >> So get there lift's not working. I'm 26:30 like okay. So I walk up 10 flights of 26:32 stairs knock on the door. He's like hi 26:34 Nicola. Hia. He's like coming. I'm like 26:38 yeah you know such and such is just 26:40 coming. So leave the door knock. They're 26:41 like yeah cool. No problem. Nicolai, he 26:44 said, "You want a cup of tea?" I was 26:45 like, "Oh, do you know what? I'd love a 26:46 cup of tea." And he said, "Let me just 26:48 clear off the table for you." I was 26:50 like, "Okay, then." 26:52 So, he clears off his crackpipe and his 26:55 firearm 26:57 before. So, we So, so we've got a nice 27:00 little space to draw up my depot. And I 27:02 was like, "Okay." And he said, "I went 27:06 to the kitchen to put the kettle on to 27:10 make that cup of tea. And let me tell 27:11 you, by the time he had filled that 27:13 kettle up, switched it on and came out 27:16 the kitchen, that depot was drawn up. 27:19 >> I bet it wasn't. 27:20 >> And he was like, "Are you Yep." Gave it 27:23 to him. And then he was like, "Are you 27:25 not?" Nope. Got to go. Going to fly 27:28 laterers came out. And as I got five 27:30 down, a colleague met me and was like, 27:32 "Where are you? Where are you going?" 27:34 And I was like, "Let's roll. Let's talk 27:36 about that a little bit later." Wow. 27:42 That polarized your thinking rather, 27:44 didn't it? 27:45 >> I was just like 27:47 just like, "Oh, let me be so helpful and 27:49 and clear my firearm, my crackpipe off 27:51 so you can 27:53 so you can I was like, wow." 27:56 >> Yeah. Yeah. Wasn't expecting that. Today 27:59 today's I mean today I mean that's 28:02 probably not one of the worst things 28:03 that's happened but 28:05 >> it's and just to 28:10 to say that that that's the reason why I 28:12 ended up 28:15 coming out and doing more of what I do 28:17 now which we're going to later because 28:20 the one time I I finished a shift at 28:22 prison and I was going 28:26 going home and it's about 10 minutes 28:28 from 28:30 the prison to the motorway 28:33 and then curious taxi driver and he 28:36 said, "Oh, what's the worst thing you've 28:39 ever seen?" 28:41 >> And it took from the time I got in the 28:43 taxi 28:44 to the time I got to the motorway for me 28:48 to think about the worst thing that I'd 28:51 ever seen cuz there was that many to 28:53 choose from. And I just thought, "Oh 28:56 god." So 28:59 for anybody, 29:03 one of those things would have been 29:04 enough. Like so it wasn't the time when 29:06 you cut somebody down or it wasn't the 29:08 time when you're 29:12 giving somebody CPR who's aspirated, 29:14 who's dead, but you got to because 29:16 you're waiting for that time. It's not 29:18 the time that you stand and watch them 29:22 carry a body out of that prison that 29:25 should have been leaving two days later 29:29 >> or the time when you've got to make that 29:31 phone call 29:34 >> desperately hard to tell. Do you know 29:36 what I mean? And I was just like, how 29:38 have we normalized 29:42 or not we but we have to normalize those 29:45 things. 29:46 >> Yeah. So when we talk about trauma, 29:47 which I'm back around to now, and we 29:50 have 29:53 blue light professionals, medical 29:55 professionals, prison officers taking 29:58 their life 30:00 because that's what they do every day. 30:02 And then when we circle back round to 30:06 training, the support that's given, 30:10 least said about that, the better. 30:13 And when you look at if we just take 30:18 prison officers and they got rid of all 30:22 the people with the knowledge, with the 30:25 experience, with the respect, political 30:28 stuff, all to do pensions and all the 30:29 rest of it. We all know this. Same as 30:31 the NHS. 30:33 And look what becomes of them. 30:38 >> Look what becomes of them. 30:39 >> Yeah. And then when we look at trauma 30:42 and people always think that trauma's 30:44 you know it's got to be a big thing like 30:46 domestic sexual 30:50 but our brain waves between the ages of 30:55 naugh to five 30:57 any change in those cuz normal at the 31:00 more like relaxed brain waves any change 31:04 of those 31:07 that can cause trauma. traumas hidden. 31:10 So it can be it can be anything 31:14 can be your it can be you remembering 31:19 you know your mom leaving 31:22 not coming back something happened I 31:23 mean she came back but something 31:24 happened and that's it stuck. 31:27 >> Yeah.
From EDI work to public recognition 31:29 Yeah. 31:31 >> It doesn't have to be what we think it 31:34 has to be. 31:35 >> Yeah. That is very true. And I think 31:37 every well I I can think I could put my 31:40 hand on my heart and say I know every 31:42 single one of us 31:44 >> carries multiple instances of those 31:47 many traumas if you like just to 31:48 differentiate them for the purpose of 31:50 this conversation 31:52 >> around. Some of them we've dealt with, 31:54 some of them we haven't. 31:55 >> Yeah. 31:56 >> It could just be a teacher at school 31:59 humiliating you. 32:02 >> Had plenty of those. Do you want to go 32:04 first? 32:06 Yeah, we've all got them, haven't we? 32:08 >> Yeah. I um we have teachers humiliators 32:12 and we have also have teachers who are 32:15 heroes. So, I'm just thinking 32:17 >> absolutely. Do I do a [ __ ] sandwich? 32:21 >> Yeah, let's do a [ __ ] sandwich. 32:23 >> Go for it. So, 32:26 >> go Oh god, it's like this is like it's 32:29 like a spider's web. This is so weaving 32:31 back to the childhood friend who 32:35 committed that murder. 32:37 There was he was our head of Yeah. He 32:40 was called Mr. Wear. I don't think he's 32:42 with us anymore, but if any of his 32:45 family ever see this or ever watch this 32:47 episode, the guy was a legend. So, he's 32:51 a Welsh guy. Typical like rugby player 32:54 build. He had these brown cow eyes and 32:58 he was just like as Welsh as you could 32:59 get. 33:00 And the one day, so he was a DT teacher, 33:05 like woodwork and all the rest of it. 33:07 And they have like their office would be 33:09 in the classroom, don't they? 33:10 >> So come into the office and he said, 33:14 "Have you seen such and such 33:17 today?" And I said, "No, not at school." 33:22 He said, "I have." I said, "Oh." Said, 33:26 "Yeah, he was robbing 33:29 a petrol station 33:32 just a mile up from the school." 33:34 >> Oh my goodness. 33:35 >> So, of course, that's part of how it all 33:38 started for him with the gangs. And I 33:42 was like, "Oh, right." 33:45 And he said, "I want you to promise me 33:48 something." I was like, "Right." 33:51 And he said, "When you 33:54 as soon as you can when you finish 33:56 school, I want you to leave West Bromage 34:00 and never want you to come back. And I 34:02 was like, West Brom, the epicenter of 34:06 the you what is wrong with you? What? He 34:10 goes, you got the Carter's Green Chippy, 34:12 you've got nickelbees, you've got um 34:15 Busies, this this club, bar pub, like it 34:19 was horrendous. 34:22 And I was like, 34:24 and I remember laughing 34:26 and walking out and just being like, 34:29 "Okay, 34:31 wow." 34:32 >> Yeah. They had your best interest at 34:33 heart, didn't they? 34:34 >> And I have. I have. And I can see 34:37 because now West Brom is and always has 34:41 been, but it was one of the most 34:45 deprived areas within the UK. And within 34:50 my cohort of 34:53 say 200, two 300 just within that cohort 34:56 alone when we talk about trauma and 35:00 nourishing monsters or heroes. 35:06 There was a boy who committed murder 35:09 with his dad and tried to shove the body 35:12 down a manhole. Oh, there was a boy who 35:17 was Jehovah's Witness and went to London 35:19 and became 35:21 a famous sex worker and wrote a book 35:23 about it or rent boy. There were victims 35:27 of pedophile rings. 35:30 It's like 200 kids like just in a in a 35:33 local area. And then there was me who 35:38 was told by a teacher that 35:42 I would be nothing. 35:45 I wouldn't amount to anything. I'd be 35:47 pregnant by the time I was 18 and I'd be 35:50 a lady of the night, which I found out 35:53 later was a prostitute. 35:55 And that was his response 35:58 to me saying, "I've taken some GCSEs a 36:01 year early and I've passed them." And he 36:05 lost his mind. So, who was I 36:10 to be a young black intelligent girl? 36:15 Who was I? 36:16 >> How very dare you? 36:17 >> How very dare you? 36:18 >> So, all you're good is to be slept with. 36:23 That's all you're good for. That's 36:25 exactly what he said. So when we 36:30 grow up in those areas 36:33 when 36:35 and it's not just minority but 36:38 for a large extent it is 36:41 when you're from a marginalized or 36:45 otherred community. 36:47 The expectations are low. We were never 36:51 supposed to make it out alive. We were 36:55 never supposed to be anything. 36:58 They decided what our fate would be 37:02 before we could even spell our own name. 37:05 Those words formed the bars of a cage 37:09 that we were never arts to be put in. 37:13 >> And yet me and my friend, so we got we 37:15 laugh because I do what I do now. and 37:20 she is 37:23 an emergency planner for the NHS. So 37:26 when things happen like at the 37:27 Manchester Arena. 37:28 >> Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 37:30 >> She's responsible for the planning of 37:31 that and we was like [ __ ] hell. Two 37:35 girls from West Brom 37:37 >> doing really significant important work 37:40 and making an impact and changing the 37:43 world. 37:43 >> Yeah. 37:45 You go girl. 37:46 >> Thanks. 37:48 So that was the hero. We was talking 37:51 about the monster. And then another 37:54 hero, 37:56 she was a drama teacher and she gave me 38:01 Mal Malcolm um Martin Luther King's book 38:06 with like all these sermons in 38:08 >> a 38:09 >> And I bet you treasured that. Oh well, I 38:12 did until 38:14 horrible story. 38:16 Got uh I didn't lose it 38:20 in the NHS. I I was off sick. It was in 38:23 my locker. They got rid of lockers and 38:25 the book went 38:27 >> I know 38:29 >> that's awful. 38:30 >> That's awful. But I still remember that 38:32 book 38:33 >> to this day. And so there are people out 38:37 there who want to nourish the good side 38:40 and 38:43 we can make the choice as well. One 38:45 thing that we have to do is take 100% 38:49 responsibility. 38:51 [ __ ] things happen to good people all 38:54 the time. 38:55 >> Yeah, they do. And this is 38:59 this is something and this is why I tell 39:01 my story 39:04 quite frequently. Probably not as often 39:05 as I think I do, but definitely when I 39:08 speak because it doesn't have to mean 39:12 the end. Like words are spells and 39:16 people speak them over you, but it 39:18 doesn't mean that you have to accept it. 39:22 >> It really doesn't. And to know 39:26 Oh, it's just like how awful. How when I 39:30 think back now or look back with my 39:33 adult eyes to that teacher, I just like 39:37 that was wild. 39:41 Who does that? Who says things like 39:44 that? 39:45 >> But now, and I'll name and shame him, 39:47 Mr. Stevenson. 39:49 Hope you're [ __ ] watching now. 39:51 >> Yeah. Yeah. Look at me. 39:55 Yeah. Yeah. Okay. My [ __ ] sandwich. Um, 40:01 senior school music teacher. Oh, Mr. 40:04 Biggin. What a delightful man. How 40:09 lovely was he? Young guy 40:14 was like skateboards became a thing when 40:17 I was at school. 40:19 >> They were brand new. 40:22 and he designed the end of year, you 40:26 know, musical thing, you know, that 40:28 every school used to put on at the end 40:30 of every year 40:32 and got the school hall decked out so 40:35 that kids were coming in and doing 40:36 stunts on skateboards and he built like 40:38 ramps and everything in the school hall 40:41 and composed all the songs 40:44 about skateboards and whatever else the 40:46 story was. I can't remember much more 40:48 about it. and then came on at the end 40:50 when everybody was cheering 40:53 and applauding him, wearing a skateboard 40:55 helmet and some shades because he was 40:57 just balling his eyes out. He was there 41:00 for everybody. He He had his finger on 41:03 the pulse of the young people there. He 41:05 was just an absolute diamond. 41:08 Two mini shits in the middle, one at 41:11 school and one at college. The one at 41:13 school, um, you know, you go to your 41:16 careers lessons and things like that. 41:17 And I mean I was brought up in semi- 41:19 detached suburbia. 41:21 >> Yeah. Yeah. So the theory goes from my 41:24 narrative that I was going to become, 41:26 you know, some sort of high office, low 41:29 professional kind of that was my sort of 41:32 band if you like that I was expected to 41:34 perform in. And they were basically 41:36 saying that I wasn't performing in that 41:37 and said you you'll be in a typing pool. 41:40 Wow. I mean you you that's what that's 41:42 what you'll do. That's your thing. Um, 41:46 at college 41:48 I went on what was called the pre- 41:50 nursing course for 2 years. 41:52 I hope it's improved now because the 41:54 course then was so dire that they took 41:56 two cohorts in at the beginning of year 41:59 one. By the end of year one, they had to 42:01 take it down to one cohort cuz so many 42:03 people left. 42:06 Most people left without saying anything 42:10 >> to this poor lecturer or I I changed my 42:13 opinion of it that day, 42:15 >> you know, and so I made the decision 42:18 that I was going to stay on and do a 42:20 couple of modules including my Alevel 42:22 biology in the second year. 42:23 >> Yeah. 42:24 >> But I really wasn't interested in 42:25 continuing with the bulk of the course. 42:27 And we had a tutorial. I remember it 42:29 well. Friday morning. So I walked up to 42:32 the front of the class and said to her, 42:34 you know, I'm just want to let you know 42:36 that I'm not going to be continuing on 42:38 into year two and you know, I'd like to 42:40 do this A level blah blah blah that I've 42:42 already started. 42:43 She absolutely lost her [ __ ] with me. 42:46 And I'm like, 42:48 I don't understand. 42:51 You've been saying every Friday for the 42:53 past six months, does anybody know where 42:55 so and so is? We haven't seen them. we 42:59 believe they've left and they haven't 43:00 had the decency to tell us. So, I 43:02 thought I'd done the right thing and had 43:04 the decency to go and say to her 43:06 >> and you know like when your mates are 43:08 chattering at the back of the class 43:09 trying to keep up cuz she was raising 43:11 her voice and in the end they had to 43:13 quieten down and I left the classroom in 43:15 tears. I was so humiliated and so upset 43:18 and I just didn't understand 43:20 and she compounded it later on when I 43:23 started applying for work for nursing 43:26 courses. 43:27 >> Mhm. never even got invited 43:30 for interviews and all my friends were 43:31 getting interviews and job offers and 43:33 I'm like, "What's going on?" And she was 43:35 one of the teachers on the biology 43:37 course as well. So, I went to the other 43:38 lady, this is the nice part of the 43:40 sandwich, 43:42 and said, "I don't understand what's 43:44 going on. Here's what's happened. Could 43:47 I ask you to write me a reference 43:48 instead?" And she says, "Yes, of course. 43:51 I got the first job I applied for as an 43:53 operating department practitioner. 43:58 H. So, 44:01 >> and what was the first job you applied 44:02 for? 44:03 >> Um, so I was applying for nursing and 44:05 getting nothing. This was operating 44:07 department personnel or practitioner. It 44:10 was called back then. Oh, yeah. ODA. It 44:12 was our current operating department 44:14 assistant. Basically, an assistant to an 44:16 anotist, which is part of the reason I 44:18 ended up doing what I do in the NHS at 44:21 the moment. Mhm. 44:22 >> But yeah, as soon as I changed my 44:25 referee to her, 44:28 I got the first job. 44:30 So yeah, lovely people 44:34 that were nurturing, as you call them, 44:36 the hero in me and supporting me and 44:39 others that 44:41 >> for whatever reason, the coach training 44:44 that I have, so they were servicing 44:45 their own needs. They were meeting their 44:47 own needs at the time and they were 44:49 couldn't look beyond that. 44:52 But they were trashing me. 44:54 >> Wow. 44:55 >> At the same time. So, we've all got 44:56 them, haven't we? 44:58 >> We have. Unfortunately, do more damage 45:01 than others. 45:02 >> Yeah. 45:03 >> Yeah. 45:04 >> So, 45:05 you don't still work in the prison 45:07 system anymore. 45:09 >> I don't for one moment. I've got to fix 45:11 my hair. 45:14 Cut that out. 45:16 Um, 45:19 so no, I don't work in the prison system 45:23 anymore. So I still hold my PIN number. 45:27 However, now I sit at the intersection 45:32 of mental health, 45:35 EDI, and leadership. 45:38 And I never saw 45:40 that's the one that I never saw coming. 45:43 For those of us that don't know, what's 45:44 EDI? 45:45 >> Sorry. Equality, diversity, and 45:48 inclusion. 45:49 >> Wonderful. That's a good place to be. 45:51 >> Uh, it is. I I 45:54 never 45:56 never saw 45:58 myself there. The signs were always 46:01 there. 46:04 And as I went through my career, 46:10 I was either 46:14 the only person of color in a room a lot 46:20 of the times apart from the mother and 46:22 baby unit. There was there was that was 46:26 and maybe that was because it was inner 46:29 city Birmingham as well. Was that inner 46:30 city? It was it was in Birmingham. Um, 46:34 there was it was diverse, 46:37 but normally I'd be either the only 46:39 person of color in the room and then to 46:41 double down the only woman of color in a 46:44 room. And so, of course, you're 46:47 aggressive. Of course you're over 46:50 opinionated. 46:52 Uh you have a lot to save. The just 46:55 everything the you know the micro 46:57 aggressions that get thrown at you. The 47:03 not wanting to accept your lived 47:08 experience. 47:12 One thing I found really interesting 47:15 about lockdown was 47:19 do you know Dr. Bnee Brown? Mhm. So she 47:23 spoke on this subject really really well 47:26 and it's the fact of people owning their 47:29 stories. So when it comes to 47:32 marginalized communities and them 47:34 talking about their lived experience and 47:37 their stories, 47:39 people not from the marginalized 47:41 community will become very offended if 47:45 you want to talk about or can become 47:47 very offended if you want to talk about 47:50 history or you want to talk about how 47:53 what how things have or how things have 47:56 become the way they've become. And it's 47:59 like 48:01 we're not asking you to pay for your 48:04 ancestors, but what we are saying is 48:06 when you start owning the story, then 48:09 you can create change. 48:10 >> Yeah. 48:11 >> You can create impact and you can move 48:13 forward. 48:15 And what I really started to realize was 48:18 actually 48:20 I'm here to create change and I'm here 48:22 to create impact. 48:25 And then when we had the nonsense with 48:28 the flags, I wrote a post which I 48:33 thought uh you know maybe 48:38 uh 60 70 people might like it. 48:42 Over 100,000 48:45 people engaged with that post. It was 48:48 shared nearly 600 times 48:52 and it just blew up. 48:56 And now it started a movement and a body 48:59 of work called the libraries open and 49:02 that sits exactly at the intersection of 49:06 mental health leadership and EDI 49:09 and it gives people a place to be able 49:11 to put their hand up and ask questions 49:15 >> a space for them to be vulnerable for 49:18 them to say I don't know everything 49:21 but I want to talk. 49:22 >> Yeah. The stories that came out from 49:24 that, stories from parents 49:28 with special educational needs, children 49:32 to people who were grieving to people 49:34 going through divorce, people talking 49:37 about their lived experience of being 49:38 from marginalized communities. 49:42 And I was like, "Oh god, I really am 49:46 sitting in the kind of leadership se, 49:47 oh, you know, you're a leader." And I 49:49 was like, "No, I'm not. No, I'm not. I'm 49:51 I'm a nurse who's got a bit fancy, but 49:55 with a bit, you know, we put a bit of 49:56 therapy in there as well, but I'm 49:59 definitely not. And then as I started to 50:01 look back at the conversations I was 50:04 having, the things I was talking about, 50:06 I was like, "Oh my god." 50:09 And then 50:11 I went to
Legacy, awards, and inspiring others 50:16 the a diversity conference in Wales 50:22 run by Bernie Davis. 50:25 Why the name escaped me? Oh, that is 50:28 ridiculous. That's that's my age. 50:31 Anyway, and 50:36 it was a wonderful day. There was lots 50:39 of dignitaries, um, lots of people with 50:42 honors that were involved. 50:46 And then at the end she's like, "Oh, 50:47 we've got our rewards coming up." And I 50:49 thought, "Oh my god, that'd be cool to 50:50 come down like this day 50:53 and if anybody can ever go master in 50:55 diversity. Yes, come back to me." So 50:58 master diversity conference and they had 51:00 the master diversity awards. 51:02 Uh, and they had like loads of people 51:05 involved like Lee Day solicitors. If 51:06 anybody does like Lee Day, they're like 51:08 the bad boys of solicitors, like just 51:10 crazy. All these people involved like uh 51:15 Welsh sport, ambulance, all the rest of 51:17 it. 51:19 And there were all these rooms and you 51:21 could go and you could talk and learn 51:24 lots of stuff and listen to panels. Then 51:26 they said they had these awards and I 51:27 was like, "Oh, that'd be good to come 51:29 back down." 51:31 And then somebody said, "Are you 51:32 applying for the awards?" And I was 51:34 like, "A girl from the UK? don't think 51:36 so. Like what I'm applying for the 51:38 awards for? No. And then the next day 51:41 somebody said to me, are you going to 51:43 apply for awards? I was like, I don't 51:44 think I can. I'm I'm not Welsh. 51:49 Spoke to Bernie. She was like, you need 51:50 to apply for the awards. I thought, okay 51:52 then. So I was like, okay, well, I'll 51:54 apply for 51:55 representation cuz I'm big on 51:57 representation 51:59 um and gender equality. And I was like, 52:01 yeah, child here. 52:05 went to the awards on my own 52:08 and 52:10 representation was up first 52:13 and they did kind of all the memeritus 52:14 awards and then I got bronze and I was 52:17 like okay well that's me done for the 52:20 day cool got a bronze wonderful 52:23 >> nice well done 52:24 >> and then the gender equality came off 52:27 and 52:29 they were reading out names so they went 52:30 past all the meritus and my name was 52:33 read out and I was like oh well you know 52:34 I got a bronze then they read 52:38 bronze out and I was like oh that makes 52:41 sense know of that person they read 52:44 silver out and I was like that makes 52:46 perfect sense 52:48 and then 52:50 my video flashed up on the screen and I 52:53 was like what what is happening and like 52:56 you've won and I was like 53:00 I have come to Wales and I've just won 53:05 a national diversity awards in gender 53:09 equality. I thought, what is happening? 53:15 And part of my video was saying I'm only 53:17 just getting started and it's about the 53:20 change I'm making from working with 53:24 Amazon EMA. So that's Amazon globally 53:27 working with the female black employee 53:30 network, the female sub sector of it. 53:33 working with people at HR Dutch of 53:34 Cornwall which I have done this year. 53:38 I'm due to work with Deote 53:42 and I'm back at Amazon again 53:46 and I truly believe if you cannot see 53:49 it, you cannot be it. 53:52 And we need to be in those rooms. It's 53:55 no longer acceptable to say that we are 53:58 not welcome in the rooms. And I know 54:01 that we have to go back into rooms that 54:04 have traumatized us. 54:06 >> I know we do. And it's hard. I know we 54:09 shouldn't be expected to. But here's the 54:11 thing. If we are not at that table, our 54:14 voices cannot be heard in policies. They 54:18 can't be in the story. We are cut out of 54:21 a whole sub sector of things and our 54:24 faces cannot be seen. And there are 54:27 little black 54:30 and brown boys and girls that are 54:33 waiting for us to take up the mantle. 54:36 Like it is our job to kick those doors 54:39 in and then hold them open for others to 54:42 walk through. 54:43 >> Huge congratulations. 54:45 >> Thank you. 54:47 >> Yeah, very worthy 54:51 and necessary. 54:53 >> Yeah, it really is. So, back to M. 54:55 STEVENSON. 55:00 >> YEAH, take that. 55:01 >> Take that. You know, you little EDI 55:03 queen over here, which I just 55:06 >> genuinely like this time like even this 55:10 time last you said that to me. I've been 55:11 like, he's smoking crack. Look, behave 55:14 yourself. I I do I do therapy and I have 55:18 a background in mental health. That is 55:22 it. That is where we're going. We're not 55:24 leaving anybody. We're not having any 55:25 big conversations. We are just 55:29 we're just here. And 55:33 to know now that I am creating impact 55:39 but not just impact 55:42 within the UK 55:45 that has rippled across the world 55:51 genuinely blows my mind. 55:54 And to sit here and like hear myself say 55:56 that I like what is 55:59 what is happening? What is happen to the 56:01 girl in West who was just, you know, 56:05 you're stepping into you? You're being 56:07 the authentic you, my darling. 56:09 >> Yeah, 56:11 you can see it when you're talking. It 56:13 shines out of every pore. It's 56:14 wonderful. It's lovely to see. 56:17 >> Thank you. But it's uh it's been 56:23 I think I said it on one of my videos 56:25 after. So I stood on stage and cried. 56:28 Honestly, when I got that award, I 56:30 sobbed. 56:31 >> I just sobbed. And I was like, I'm not 56:34 going to cry. And then I just stood 56:36 there and sobbed. And after they 56:38 interviewed me, they was like, "So 56:40 what's the journey been like?" I was 56:41 like, "It's been a thing." Cuz I was 56:43 like, "It's been a thing." And when I 56:45 look back 56:48 on those wards 56:51 prisoners on wings, I did chase them and 56:54 they were like, "You are crazy." And I'm 56:55 like, "You don't even know the half of 56:56 it." 56:59 It's it's been a it's been a journey. 57:01 And 57:03 the one thing that I cannot thank enough 57:07 is all the people that made it. And that 57:08 includes the patients, that includes the 57:12 prisoners. 57:12 >> Yeah. That includes this I had this um 57:16 one nurse 57:18 and I need to like shout her out. Jill 57:21 Hart. So Jill Hart 57:23 nurse she's retired now. Um 57:27 she gave me as much anxiety as she did 57:31 knowledge. I mean Jill was like Jill. 57:34 But what she did she's old school right? 57:37 Proper old school 57:39 manic as well. But what she did teach me 57:43 was 57:45 how to be clinically defensible and 57:49 robust nursing. 57:51 >> Important. 57:53 >> Really, really, really important. 57:55 >> I would imagine especially so in the 57:57 fields you were working in. 57:59 >> Yeah. So, I met Jill in prison nursing 58:02 and 58:04 she's character. But Jill was a 58:06 character, 58:08 but she's one of the people 58:12 that genuinely made my career. And a 58:16 lady called Sharonetta, who I believe 58:19 she probably does, she still she came 58:21 out of prisons and then she went into 58:27 Oh god, it's it escapes me now. But 58:30 anyway, 58:32 formidable, formidable characters and 58:36 again people I mean and don't get me 58:39 wrong like you'll put a lot of pressure 58:40 on you as well like for real for real. 58:43 >> However, 58:45 the things that I was taught by them 58:49 both the way that I 58:53 know specialist nursing inside and out 58:56 because of them. 58:57 >> Yeah. 58:59 the way that I could walk on a prison 59:03 wing now and and still now and just know 59:06 that I can hold myself and the way and I 59:10 will give this to Jill as well that I 59:12 had a death in custody and everybody 59:15 else was called to interview except for 59:18 me cuz you'd done your recordeping 59:21 right. 59:23 >> Yeah. 59:23 >> Yeah. 59:25 Never went in front of the coroner. Mhm. 59:27 >> Never interviewed by the independent 59:30 commissioners for the prisons. Nobody. 59:35 >> And that genuiness and authenticity is 59:38 what's going to carry you through this 59:40 next stage, isn't it? 59:42 >> Well, let's hope so, cuz I don't know. I 59:44 don't know where that's going that 59:45 that's that's the scary part now. Uh 59:51 because it's it's 59:54 where next. It's 59:57 well I can't say where next. I know a 59:59 few of the things that potentially are 1:00:01 coming up, 1:00:04 but it is about now 1:00:07 really bedding down and making that 1:00:10 impact and making that change and about 1:00:14 legacy. I never thought I'd be talking 1:00:16 about legacy, 1:00:18 >> but making that legacy for people who 1:00:21 are coming through for nurses, for 1:00:23 therapists, 1:00:25 for people like me who 1:00:30 never saw themselves in rooms 1:00:33 that 1:00:35 I step that I've stepped in. I I won 1:00:40 woman who so a woman who award last May 1:00:44 and I did a lot of speaking about 1:00:46 representation and people being in rooms 1:00:47 and yada yada yada 1:00:51 then I was a keynote speaker at so 1:00:53 Sandra Garlic runs womanh who and 1:00:55 solarpreneur woman who's in May 1:00:57 solarreneurs normally in October I end 1:01:01 up being a keynote speaker 1:01:03 and a lady that I that we know each 1:01:07 other from online and we follow each 1:01:08 other. She's a lady of color. She was in 1:01:09 the room. I was like, "Oh my god, what 1:01:11 are you doing here?" Like really 1:01:12 surprised. Never seen you in these 1:01:14 circles. 1:01:15 And she said, "I'm here because of you. 1:01:18 I saw you do it and I knew I could." 1:01:21 >> Amazing. 1:01:24 How wonderful. That must have warmed 1:01:26 your heart. 1:01:27 >> Do you know what? It did make me want to 1:01:28 cry. I was like, "Oh my god." I was 1:01:30 like, "It's working." because I 1:01:33 genuinely think that still nobody knows 1:01:35 who I am and nobody's watching and 1:01:39 nobody sees what I'm doing or what I'm 1:01:43 up to. Like, who cares about me? 1:01:46 >> And then you hear things from time to 1:01:48 time 1:01:49 >> and I'm like, "Oh my god." that I had 1:01:53 just after I won the last award and 1:01:54 between that and Christmas, 1:01:57 people that I worked within uh who I 1:02:00 went to school with and that I worked 1:02:01 with within in the prison service, men, 1:02:05 mostly men, had messaged me 1:02:09 and was like, I've been watching you, 1:02:11 not in a creepy way, sounds so creepy, 1:02:15 >> and thank you for what you're doing 1:02:17 because my daughter gets to 1:02:20 see what you can do, what what what you 1:02:23 what can be achieved, what can be done, 1:02:26 and that's that's what it's about. 1:02:29 >> Yeah. 1:02:32 >> You carry on doing that, my darling, and 1:02:34 thank you so much. 1:02:36 >> Oh, and sharing. 1:02:38 >> Thanks. Thanks for having me. It's been 1:02:40 it's been lovely. Do 1:02:42 >> you know what? It's been um it's been 1:02:44 really cathartic, hasn't it? 1:02:47 >> Oh, I thoroughly enjoyed it. 1:02:51 Me too. How mad. Oh, 1:02:55 thank you. 1:02:56 >> You're welcome.
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