When Baby-Making Takes A Toll On Your Sexuality

Introduction to Jessica Preston and Fertility Coaching 0:00

All right, everybody, welcome back to another episode of the Solving Sexual Dysfunction Summit. And this session,we're going to have Jessica Preston. Now, I'm really excited to tell you guys a little bit about Jessica. She's been in obstetrics and gynecology as a physician's assistant for over 20 years with a focus on fertility and functional medicine after her own fertility journey and helping couples conceive on a smaller scale within the clinic. She wanted to reach more couples on a larger scale.

She developed and opened a nationwide wellness coaching service focusing on areas that conventional medicine does not provide. It does not because they don't they don't get to this functional medicine stuff providing relief for those suffering with fertility issues in a supportive community. Her programs include nutrition, stress management and other lifestyle factors with a focus on relationships and becoming that become strained during fertility challenges. And so we're going to be talking about what baby making takes a toll.

Reignite passion while trying to conceive. So thank you so much, Jessica, for being with us today. Thank you so much for having me. It's my pleasure. This is actually this must be a fun a fun thing to work with couples on this. And I know we were talking the other day, your success rates are through the roof, which is absolutely amazing. So, you know, I was going to ask you what when you were starting with couples, where do you start with and how does that fertility stress impact what patients are going through when couples are going through?

So that. Yeah. Thank you for asking that specifically. As stress is, I know we do a lot with nutrition and stress and other lifestyle, but it is stress that is impactful on relationships specifically. And so when we if we think about the science behind it, when we are in stressful states or fight or flight, the way that that impacts impacts our physiology is we end up with an increase in cortisol and other stress hormones and other chemicals. And when that happens, that can impact our testosterone or estrogen.

Those can go down. So it actually can impact our fertility. But it also when those hormones of sex hormones decline, we see a decrease in libido in that space as well. You know, I remember years ago, I have two kids now that are they're in their teens. But I remember that whole fertility journey was a pain in the butt. You know, you go so many years in your life and you think, all right, well, I'm just going to go off birth control and it's just going to happen because I've tried so many years not to get pregnant and then all of a sudden it didn't happen.

It was like like stress became very like I said, this became very stressful. And like, those are the two things you don't want to have to go up there. So. Yes, exactly. So when that happens, I tell everybody we work with

How Fertility Stress Affects Libido and Relationships 3:08

that trying to get pregnant is fun for one month only because you're excited and you think you're going to get pregnant right away. Or you might not, but you think it's not a big deal until you end up getting your period when you think you've done everything right and we can't help it, even if we don't feel the stress level that's really high. It does impact us to say what went wrong here, and then we'll tell us a little story or we'll say, okay, we've told it takes it takes longer to conceive potentially.

Maybe it just wasn't this month, but after that, trying becomes trying. I remember when on my own fertility journey because we struggled with with conception and we did end up with with twins through some assistance. But I remember on one occasion in particular where my husband was more interested in doing the dishes than he was in doing his wife. And it really was impactful to me that I thought, wow, this is crazy, that that that could happen where the stress is so high that it completely distracted away from something that was so pleasurable historically.

And that really starts to affect our relationship, too. So now that starts to add on itself because all right, so sex now becomes a stressor and then that starts affecting the relationship. And then how do you kind of heal that to basically bring things back during the time of trying to get fertile and then also to kind of save that marriage or relationship forever going forward. Right. And I think that it's really important to be aware very early on that this is a normal thing. The sooner we can be aware of that, the sooner we can start speaking as a couple about how can we get get through this?

It's exactly right. What you're saying is exactly right. And the people that I work with and the things that go through your own head, especially people that have been challenged for a while with fertility, start looking at their partner and pointing fingers at each other and they can't help it because of the stress state. But that is insidious. It gets there slowly in the beginning. You can pull away from each other a little bit and just say, okay, I'm doing my part, you're doing your part. But then eventually there is a there's a little bit of a disconnect that can be more of a rift.

So the sooner we see, okay, this is going to be actually we're going to have to put some effort forth here to address the elephant in the room, talk about it early, and then if you need to get some help, get some help and just try to have an open conversation. You know, sometimes I wonder, even on that fertility journey, maybe it gets to a point where like one cop, one person in the couple maybe really wants that child. And the other one is like, Well, I'm just going along for the ride because this is what the partner wants.

And then that even becomes this relationship like rift. You know, it can be I find that it's not as much that a lot of the time, I mean, there's there might be one driving person. But once fertility becomes a struggle, both seem to be more in. If one person is out, there's a reason usually. And it's usually fear or shame. To be honest, it can very much be. I think this is my fault, so I'm just not going to want it as much fear that this might not happen. So I'm going to pull back out of the situation and that causes a rift as well.

When the other person is saying, we can do it, we can do it, we've got this, let's let's make this happen. And so addressing those parts are really important as well. And in a nice conversation, we do a lot of work. I do a lot of work with something called Imago Dialog. We recommend nonviolent communication. These are Marshall Rosenberg's work. This is how you can have a conversation and address an open openly with your partner, such as? I'm feeling a certain kind of way. Are you open to having a conversation with me about it?

You know, and that's actually it seems like it comes down to really is with any relationship whether you're trying to conceive or you're just maybe having stress or stressors when it comes to libido in general, it seems the key answer to all this is communication. Very much so. Absolutely. And so I'm a big fan of love languages. I don't you know, where you learn what your partner's love language is and then try to go apply it. We can't respond to our partner in the way we want to be loved. We need to love them in the way that they need to be loved.

And so I think it's important, whether it's fertility or otherwise, how are we going to nurture our our partner so that they can feel safe and loved and secure, so that we can have these conversations and openly communicate? And then when does sex. I remember there was one time when we were trying to have kids and it was I was ovulating. You do that ovulation predictor test and you just kind of looked over at each other over like tonight, like, I don't know, I don't feel like this. Like, but it was this whole, like, pressure, like, oh, my God, if we don't do this tonight, it's going to be another whole month.

But the reason I bring that up, too, is, you know, when when sex starts to become a chore, how are there other other ways to connect? Yeah. Without. Yes, absolutely. And so there are a number of things. First of all. No, it's a chore. No, it's for a purpose. So we've gone from play to purpose in our sex life at that point. And so play seems to back burner, remember, play, introduce new things, explore

Keeping Intimacy Alive During Trying to Conceive 8:40

new areas and dove into that if you're willing. And some couples are more adventurous in that space and some are less adventurous and everything is acceptable. And I think that's something that everyone needs to know. Whatever your sex life is for you is completely normal and completely acceptable. And so find a way. LAUGHTER is really key. Trying to find a way to connect and know that you're in this together and really bond in that space. And also remember that when we have touch, even just physical touch, spend one.

I recommend if you can go out on a date per week and I know everyone's busy and maybe you can't but find a way to snuggle on the couch or cuddle in the mornings or on Saturdays because just a physical touch, you don't even have to be intimate in any any more than physical touch increases oxytocin and when we increase oxytocin. Studies have demonstrated that an increase in oxytocin will actually decrease your cortisol. So cortisol is that stress hormone that we were talking about prior to now when we were saying cortisol, when that is up, it's our in our fight or flight.

And that's one of our major stressors that impacts our sex hormones. So even just the oxytocin from physical touch is going to help, you know, actually know that that physical connection is going to make a difference for you and find ways to fit that in. Watch a movie together, make it light, make it light, make it fun and just enjoy each other's company and on those days, just like you mentioned, we had the same we had the same of earth today and every other day during this time period. And you have to work early and I have to work late.

And how are we going to make that? We've got 15 minutes, you know, and performance. What is that going to be like? Make it the best. The best that you can. And I would say play with it and try to have some fun. And if you can't make it through and here's the part that nobody wants to think about. Having the baby is the easy part. Once the baby is here, you're going to be plenty challenged with trying to figure out when you're going to have sex. And so you might as well practice now. Prep while there's no baby around.

How are we going to make this work then? And just use this as practice and so find ways that are going to work for you. That is actually really, really key because once the kids come, it's a whole different story. You don't even know things. You know, I was thinking about, too, with this kind of forgot what I was going to say about what you're talking about. I kind of forgot the the question, but I guess, what other specific techniques can you recommend that to help bridge that gap and create a more fulfilling connection with with a couple, especially when we're under stress?

And I know what was I was going to talk about, you know, this role of stress and I'm always talking about stress and sex don't exist at the same time. And you see this time and time again with couples that can't get pregnant, can't get pregnant, and then they give up or they adopt. And now that stress was taken off and now all of a sudden they get pregnant. Doesn't that now there is another stressor? Yes, that chronic stressor. And you don't even. So whenever we have that shadow of infertility over our over our heads, it doesn't list.

It's always there. We just make it through the days, but it doesn't change our neurochemistry. So we still end up in this phase where our cortisol is higher and our hormones are impacted and also our mood is impacted. When our mood is impacted, that impacts our serotonin, our dopamine as well. And so that has a cascade effect as well. And so we feel a little less a little less light, you know, and when we have that and it becomes normal now normal can then just feel consistently the same. But it doesn't mean that the hormones normalize.

They're still high. So when you then adopt and now you're distracted from that and you're not thinking about it every day and you have a baby, you know, we all those of us that have struggled with fertility, want to kick someone in the face nicely if they say, just relax and it'll happen. But the truth is, is once we then are no longer in that stressful state related to our fertility, then those hormones can actually regulate. And then it's not relaxing. It's it's that the fight or flight state has now alleviated itself.

Our cortisol is in a different space. Our estrogen and testosterone can rise. Our our serotonin. Dopamine can be better. And then we can we can be in that space where we can conceive. I think people don't really realize the science behind it, actually. When our when we have those stressors, the stressors change our chemistry. The chemistry causes us to not conceive. So that's what we have to be really aware of. So we become a parent. And then there is all of that that goes with being a parent. When you adopt, right? Your oxytocin does go up.

We're snuggling with our baby. All of our hormones say, I'm a mom, you are a dad. And so we get into that actual chemical state where that is what we are. We accept it holistically with our whole body and then we can conceive. And I love that for that brain body connection. So when you're when you're working with couples and because of this stress level and this pressure and like know it's almost like you put this internal deadline on things, especially for women. It's unfortunate. Like as we get older, we start getting labels like advanced maternal age, you know, like you feel like this.

There's this ticking time bomb. What, what other things can you recommend to couples to kind of just like, step back and reduce that level of stress. And knowing that you're a team having good communication, it is number one. So the first thing that we need to do as an individual is accept that we're on this journey and we can conceive. So we actually work with people, with we're helping them with their nervous system regulation so we get their body out of fight or flight, get them into rest and digest and procreate, and then we help them with baby blocks.

We do a very mild, gentle form of hypnotherapy that helps couples, and we have them do this work together. So things that you can do together with the understanding that we need some time alone as well is really important. Great communication. You know, babe, I love you and I really need this time with you to spend with you. But I need a little bit of time by myself just to just to collect myself and being an okay spot and come right back to you and give an end that what that means to me is right.

So I just need an hour. And then how about at 9:00? We get together and we can watch the next episode of Fill In the Blank and Snuggle on the couch. How does that sound? And really having that communication back and forth, not just an open ended on both sides, not just an open ended. I need some time to myself because now your partners feeling like you're separate, even more so saying I need a little time to myself. When are we going to touch base again? And having that plan is a very safe, nervous system thing for both parties, for both partners.

So really saying this is where I need to be right now. Let's connect at this time. Is that how does that sound for you? Get an agreement and stick to it? I think that's a very important. Another thing that we do a lot of work with is we teach introductory tantra ideas and thoughts because tantra, a lot of people think that this is crazy sex or whatever. Do whatever you want. As I said, your life is normal. Your sex life is normal as long as it's yours and in agreement. But tantra is really intimacy.

So we teach eye gazing and we and you can have a couple that's been together for 15 years and they can't stare in each other's eyes. And they're just like, I was, I was they were staring at a pimple on my face or I swear, they were just thinking what I was thinking. You know, they were thinking I was thinking terrible thing. But you get people doing this regularly and it really does increase intimacy. You can watch them visibly relax as a partner, as partners, as a couple, and then it allows them that space to have more communication,

Nervous System Regulation, Trauma, and Communication Tools 16:58

let their guard down more and have more open communication. You know, that's what I wanted to ask you to do. This is this is so fascinating. What about like levels do you run into levels of trauma and not necessarily like big trauma, but like maybe like hidden traumas or generational traumas and yeah. So I need to just make a disclaimer that we aren't trauma therapy. That's just we're not, but we do. Of course things come up. I mean, trauma is a different level and it's a big buzz word right now.

Trauma, right. So traumas at different levels for different people. So you can have you can have people that had major trauma in childhood and then you can have people that had had little blips of it. But one way or the other, we have we have the need to feel accepted and loved and safe. And the way that trauma comes in, at whatever level people come in, that is basically a feeling of being unsafe. And so we will refer out if someone needs true trauma therapy, but we do talk about safety a lot. I have a somatic coach, so we're a team of coaches.

We have somebody in every area and we're all there for everyone. So we have a somatic coach who talks about the feeling in your body and how you can let that go through you and really give some good examples. So we do a lot, a lot with that. But yes, most definitely trauma is the infertility itself is a little ti, right? I mean, it's a I thought I could have this this is my dream. Since I was a child, I wanted a family. What does this mean? And then the story stops and then we don't know what to do with this story.

And we're lost and we are isolated and we are alone and we are afraid because our community around us, they've gotten pregnant. Our sister got pregnant. Our best friend got pregnant. And now here we are where everyone's saying, Are you pregnant? They see you're not drinking your glass of wine. How about now? You know, and you don't want to go to anything? We're running into the holiday season here shortly, and we we end up where we're having a lot of conversation in our community about how do we address when people bring things up, how do we prepare ourselves before going into a conversation?

How do we prepare ourselves before going to a family dinner or a holiday party? And it's really important that we get that reserve and we can build some resilience. It is slow and steady, but it is absolutely we every day we see it every day. And then, you know, sometimes even within the couples, because if we're starting to get into that fight or flight, even just like the simplest touch control is making jumpy and like here we are. We're supposed to be, you know, calming that nervous system, but you almost get like defensive in that situation.

Any tips to kind of like in the moment, decrease that nervous system so that you can, you know, get that connection with the partner, get the act done. So if someone can't be physically touched, I recommend sitting eye gazing, looking into each other's eyes, not speaking and breathing in synchrony. And that really helps soothe people in their nervous systems. So then they can actually find themselves to be on the same page a little bit more. Now, if you're down to 15 minutes, that might not actually work for you.

And I will be very honest, if you are feeling like you cannot be touched and you are 15 minutes and you're going to absolutely detest it, skip the month, skip the month. Worse things have happened than skipping a month. Try again next month. Give yourself a full 30 days and then really focus on how can we connect better so that next month is easier as frequently one person is, as we said, you know, go getter, let's do it, let's do it. And the other one is, I need time. And we feel like teenagers all over again. Oh, my gosh.

You know, he's going to take me to the movies. Is he going to want to kiss me? You know, if that's where we get and we're 35 or 40 or 45 and we're thinking, why is this happening? But it's normal. I just want to keep saying over and over again, this is so normal. We all get here and we are confused and we're scared and we don't know what to do. And just slowly take the steps. Know your partner. This is the person you chose to spend the rest of your life with. Just nurture each other and love each other through it.

And you can get there. And it's this is great because a lot of the techniques that you're teaching, I'm sure the couples don't don't see this as a gift when they're in that moment. But I almost feel like they're the lucky ones because they're learning these techniques versus someone who just got pregnant and now has to deal with these like similar issues of intimacy later on in the relationship as opposed to like, okay, we're learning that. We're learning the skills now and this is going to help us going forward.

Yeah, we've we've actually surprised ourselves. I'll be very honest with you. We're we're completely in love with our system because we see exactly that. And we have gotten to the part of saying getting pregnant is the easy part. The rest of it is developing the communication styles and having these this connectivity with our partner that you never would have expected the amount of love and intimacy. And we teach intimacy and eroticism. So we teach both extremes of that because when you get to you don't want to be best friend, you want to be best friends, but you don't want to be just friends.

And so we need to make sure that we're still in that space of how do we keep this going. And it's incredible watching these couples adore each other and that's the right word. Just the look in their eyes of adoration for each other. And this process is is everything. And I can't wait to see how these families grow and even more and have more babies and how those relationship and communication styles can increase all of that love and intimacy that we have in the world. You know, that brings up a good point.

So I have to ask you, what is the difference between that that intimacy and eroticism? Because especially once the kids come and I'm don't want to scare away people who haven't had kids. Yeah, but once the kids come, you can fall into that roommate situation where it's like, say, roommate. That's exactly right. So I'm so glad. That's why I gave that warning early on when we were talking of Just Start now, find the way to have the fun and and do everything now. So intimacy is closeness. It's a connection in a way that it makes us feel incredibly safe eroticism.

We enjoy it as mystery. So when we're incredibly safe and connected and intimate with someone, mystery seems to be gone. So it's really important. There are some skills and that. And Esther Perel, I don't know if you or anybody yet follows her. She's amazing with intimacy and eroticism. You know, what can we do to keep the erotic? And a lot of it is observe your partner out in the wild, right? So when you're out at go to a holiday party or whatever it might be and observe how dynamic they are out and speaking with other people and having some mystery.

And I don't mean secrecy, nothing that makes people feel unsafe. And humor is great sarcasm for those who can. I'm not a sarcastic person and I don't tolerate it. Well, to be honest, I it doesn't hit me right. But for some people, it really does help with the eroticism piece. And then once again, in your sexuality, you can find places in that space where you can figure out what where would where's everything acceptable and safe, where can you push the line a little bit, you know, where it's comfortable for both of you and make sure you have that open communication.

Recommend having that open communication established first. But and also the other thing that is a little an interesting conversation, but I think it's important to bring up because all of it for people that are starting families is that there is a concept and this is I would like you to think of this from an observer lens. So not from us being in a relationship, but from observing outside of the relationship, there's always the potential that someone can interfere in your marriage and your relationship.

Hit it head on. How are you going to deal with that? Because that's a safety piece. So it's not it's not erotic when you're feeling when you feel like your relationship is being threatened, it's a safety piece. But have that conversation. These conversations were really putting it out in front of us. And when we're having fertility struggles, women frequently say, Why would my husband stay with me? Someone he could get someone else pregnant. And we do a number on ourselves and we get in a toxic spiral with that.

And we need to not have that happen because what will happen, we will pull back from our husband or we will be angry with our husband because of our own thoughts and they can do the same. You know, 40% of fertility struggles have a male factor, so men are frequently emasculated in this space. So we do a lot of work with men in men's work and men supporting men in this space. And for them to know that my wife loves me, they're emasculated. They feel like they are less of a provider, less of that strong masculine.

And so it's really important that we have these conversations when they come up in our minds, even if they this I heard this on this summit that I was listening to and they said they brought this up. Communication should happen.

Imago Dialogue, Erotic Connection, and Closing Resources 26:48

We should have the conversation that there can always be the thought that someone else might be in your life. There's no one in mind, but I worry that you might find somebody else more appealing and that you could have a baby with somebody else because I thought, I feel like I'm falling short here in that area and I would like to really talk about that. Are you open? And I love that. I'd like to talk about that. Are you open? There's no acute accusation here. I'm not saying you went and slept with you are fill in the blank or whatever.

I'm just saying this is how I'm feeling with my security space. How are you feeling about this space? Can we can we say, what are we going to do if we feel this way? How are we going to communicate? And it can be a it can be just a like the safe word or a key word. You know, I'm going to say, you know, orange monkeys, whenever I'm feeling insecure about some woman in your office and you're going to know and I don't have to have this conversation. And then that means tonight you can just bring me a little extra love.

I love that. And, you know, and I love I think that's amazing. For. The fertility space. But I'm also thinking like, this is something we could all be carrying forward and taking tips from this because that is so. I know. I actually you made me start thinking I'm a I've been married for 20 years. I don't think I've ever had that conversation. So which is actually great because you could use this some everyone as an excuse because if you, you know, just come out of nowhere, it might be a little weird, but, you know, that's how I'm going to plan on doing.

I'm going to be like, Hey, I was interviewing somebody for the summit. You guys can all say you were watching the summit and this came up like, let's talk about this. So I love that's a great tip is there anything that I didn't ask you that you can think of that you think is really important for us to know? And I think, you know, the one thing I wanted to make sure everyone knew is that the that your sex life is still going to suffer once babies come along and find ways and be creative and no, I mean, this is more libido summit I would definitely recommend as do parole for libido starts with communication, it starts with connection and it starts with intimacy and everything else.

I mean, we started with libido when we first started dating and everything was hot and fantasy stick and then life gets in the way schedule that you have to prioritize for it. You have to understand that you're both going to be going through phases where there's going to be a lower libido. And it's not personal. It is never personal. So have the conversations and and just keep the communication open, develop deep intimacy and then play with the erotic Esther Perel Gottman Institute. They they've gone into the Gottman huge amounts of information there where you can start learning about conversation.

Learning about imago dialog is huge. You can print out and print out a little imago dialog. I can even get you some some imago dialog handouts, sit on the couch and practice together like you're reading a script. Nonviolent communication is really very good and loving each other. I think that's a. That is that is beautiful. And before we go, I just want to can you do a couple more examples of the all Imago dialog just becauseI just want to highlight that one. So that's really good. Yeah. Okay. So I will tell you.

So I have a team of eight coaches and I have two rock stars at Imago and I am not one of them. And whenever we practice a logo with our couples, I'm the first one to raise my hand and say, I'm going to be the one that you're going to watch. That doesn't do this well. But I have some but I'm very I give myself a lot of grace and kindness to be able to have the communication. So we had a sample. I'll give you an example when we were practicing as a team before for our coaches practice together and I had one of my coaches had to come up with an idea.

These are two people who speak very well, fluently in Imago. And she said pretending it was her husband. She said it. I always feel like I'm the I am I have a concern and I'd like to talk with you about it. And you always say what it's about. Don't leave someone hanging. I want to talk. Don't say at breakfast. I want to talk with you about something else tonight. They're going to think about it all day. Oh, I want to. I have something I need to speak with you about. Are you open? Do we have some time tonight that we could speak about this?

And what I'd like to talk about is or is you can either say what it's about, which I would probably do, and what might be better is there's nothing wrong. There's something that I'm not angry about, anything. I'm just stuck on that. The fact that the toilet paper can't ever be put on the toilet paper roll and I don't know. I don't know why it's bothering so much of it. Are you open to having a conversation and then the response was, Yes, I can absolutely have that conversation. So in Imargo, it's actually one person bringing forth a concern and the other person only hearing it, not not giving anything else.

So I'm I'm Mike Butcher this a little bit because I'm not the pro on this but basically she said something along the lines of you know, the toilet paper is right there. I'm not sure why I'm always the person who has to put the toilet paper and the toilet paper roll. And the partner said, okay, so what I'm hearing is that you're frustrated because you're the only person putting the toilet paper on the toilet paper roll. She said, Yes. He said, Is there more? And she said, Well, you know, actually, I'm not sure what it is about that, but it just seems like when I sit down, it just makes me feel so upset and I feel like I'm asking such a simple task that I feel like you could do it.

And then he said, okay, so what I'm hearing is mirror back. Is there more? And you say, Is there more until there isn't anymore mirror back? And then say, I can see how you would be upset with me about that. You have mentioned it a number of times and I haven't done it. So maybe if we put a roll of toilet paper on the back of the toilet, so it was really conveniently there then maybe that that's a way that I could remember to put the toilet paper on the toilet paper roll. How would that, how does that sound?

And she says, yes, I think that would work. And so that's an example. But what was beautiful about this with two people who were not partners, but we were just practicing that she basically at the end and this was a real scenario in her own home, she said, what I realized was in in him not putting the toilet paper on the toilet paper roll, I'm feeling like I'm not being loved. And it was just such a simple act of love that isn't thought of by your partner. So we really, in this communication style, we're not triggering each other, we're not defensive.

We are learning our other, we're learning our partners communication style, and we are learning their needs. And remember a while ago I said, learn how your partner needs to be loved, not how you want to love them. So she is loving him by putting the toilet paper roll on. But that's he's not seeing it. He doesn't see that part. What he's seeing is what what his love languages and messages are. So in learning Imago we really get to be curious. And curiosity is one of my favorite words. We get to be curious about our partner.

We get to learn all of those pieces of them that are just subtle that they need. And when we meet those needs, we see them light up. And when we see them light up like that, we absolutely can see all of that intimacy really connecting. You become a couple, a team, you work together, and then it's more fun, more playful. You can easily then have a deeper conversation about Where do we want to take this sex life of ours? What might be a little bit different that we want to introduce to be able to spice it up and add the eroticism?

It's a beautiful cycle. That is that is that was a great example. That was absolutely amazing. Where can people find out more about you and within the work that you do? Okay. So we're at Denovo Fertility So Denovo means to start a new. So we were starting a new and a fresh with all of our couples and we're at denovofertility.com and you can find us there. If you have questions about us, you can send an email to Hello@denovofertility.com and feel free to reach out. We do discovery calls. If you do a discovery call, you will get one of our coaches.

So you're not going to get a sales force or a sales call. You're going to be able to speak to one of our coaches directly and ask any questions that you might have. That is great. Thank you so, Jessica, for taking the time to talk to us. This has been absolutely amazing. Thank you so much for having me. It was all my pleasure. And I hope it was really helpful. All right, everybody, make sure you go check out Denovo Fertility. and stick around because we got more great sessions coming up.