Full Transcript Introduction to the Gut-Brain Connection 0:00 So if you were on a really restrictive diet for a long period of time, you know, just call out carnivore diet as an example, 0:06 You're not going to have had a lot of different fibers and eventually they'll die off. 0:10 I mean, they're just like humans. 0:11 You stop feeding a human, it's going die. 0:13 Same with these back here. 0:14 They're a living organism. 0:15 If you stop giving them what they eat, They will die And so variety is the spice of life in the context of the gut and supporting these new microbes that 0:26 we've transplanted. 0:26 So our goal always, and this is something we educate on, is expanding the diet to include at least 50 different foods. 0:33 And this will be another resource we can share in, in The Notes is like helping people to expand their diet. 0:38 This is good news, regardless of a transplant. 0:41 You want to do this regardless, of transplant by shifting your diet within 24 hours, you can see a positive effect on your microbiome. 0:51 Everything is connected and I'm here to tell you how. 0:55 I am Dr. 0:55 Laura Hanson with Connect My Brain. 0:58 This podcast is for moms who are concerned about their child's development. 1:04 The brain impacts our mind, body and overall health. 1:08 I explain how your brain is wired, what happens when it's out of balance, and how early childhood development not only impacts your child but can affect 1:20 you as an adult years later. 1:22 Want to know how to improve your life? 1:24 Join me and learn about your amazing brain and what it can do for you. 1:34 Hey everybody, it's Dr. 1:36 Laura with Connect My Child's Brain. 1:38 We are so excited that you are tuning in and I have had some wonderful conversations with many different fabulous providers in so many places and this 1:52 one is not going to be any exception to that. 1:55 Tonight, we are talking about poop, and that's right, poop. 1:59 And we're going to enjoy it, okay? 2:02 So I have Jason Klopp with me and he does a fabulous therapy and I'm just going let him take it away. 2:10 So Jason, thank you so much for being on the podcast. 2:14 We welcome you to Connect My Child's Brain. 2:18 Great. 2:18 Well, I'm excited to be here and I hope anybody listening can learn something new. 2:23 Yes, we'll be talking in part about poop, but there's a lot more in poop that most people aren't even familiar with. 2:29 And the power that it has to heal is pretty transformative and just on the topic of connecting your child's mind. 2:36 I mean, so much of the mind is also connected to the gut, right? 2:41 We talk about the Gut-Brain connection and the importance of that. 2:46 there's this whole web of connections that all stems from our microbiome. 2:50 And so people often talk about the gut brain connection and how the got is somehow the second brain. 2:56 But I'm more and more convinced daily that the guy actually controls more than we think, and may have more to do with how we operate cognitively, 3:05 mentally and so on and forth, then we're really giving it credit for so. 3:09 Yeah, as far as a little background, I first got licensed as an atropathic doctor in 2015 and began seeing patients in the gut health space. 3:18 So chronic IBS and SIBO, some IBD, and that was just where I got my start and was doing a lot of that for several years and had patients from all around 3:28 the world doing telemedicine and so on and forth. 3:31 And then in 2017, was confronted with someone who was inquiring to become a patient of mine.
FMT Origins and Autism Research 3:38 and lovely woman. 3:39 So we had an initial introductory call just to decide like is the program is a work that we offer to help or benefit to her and then we would take it from there. 3:49 And so in the course of this discussion this woman was telling me about all the serious issues she was confronted with and her husband got so desperate 3:58 that they actually ended up selling their home They bought a new organic plot of land, built a totally environmentally sustainable home, 4:07 grew all of their own organic food. 4:09 And despite all that, in addition to prior to all this, trying everything from seeing Cleveland Clinic doctors, Mayo Clinic Doctors, 4:17 all the integrative functional stuff, homeopathy, supplements, you name it, she had basically done and tried it all. 4:25 Yet she was still suffering so significantly. 4:27 And towards the end of our conversation, I said, look, i'm really sorry, but I don't think there's anything that I offer that's different, 4:34 better, more innovative than all of the different things you've already done and tried. 4:38 However, given your medical history, that you would really benefit from FMT. 4:43 And for those new to the concept, FMT stands for Fecal Microbiota Transplant. 4:48 And we'll get into a little bit of what that actually is. 4:51 But she was like, oh my gosh, Dr. 4:52 Klopp, like this is something that I would love to do, but there's just nowhere for me to access this within North America. 4:59 I'd have to travel overseas. 5:01 At this point, there was some stuff happening in the UK, some staff going on in Asia and different places. 5:06 So that just wasn't feasible for her given her health. 5:09 She wouldn't be able to And so she essentially begged for me to find a way to make it accessible here in North America. 5:17 And that started the journey in January of 2018. I began in partnership with another naturopathic doctor treating patients using FMT. 5:26 And we really started out treating just a lot of the chronic disease mystery illness type people, neurological diseases, 5:33 MS, Parkinson's and so on. 5:34 It really just grew from there to the point where we were treating at multiple locations around the world. 5:40 And eventually, you know, early on actually that partnership was discontinued and then I led the charge from then and expanded. 5:48 Then it was really in 2018 actually there was a study that came out of Arizona State University If anyone's familiar, it's Dr. 5:57 James Adam. 5:57 He's done some really pioneering work around FMT and autism. 6:02 And we can get more into the nitty gritty of the study if there's any interest. 6:05 You're always welcome to hyperlink and include those things in the notes. 6:08 But I started getting reach outs from parents saying, well, wait a minute, you know, there was a study that came out of Arizona State University, 6:15 showed up really you know, two-year follow-up study, great outcomes data, safety profile really high. 6:21 We're lowering the sores and severity of the autism symptoms, we're improving the GI symptoms. 6:26 So these mothers and some fathers started reaching out to me and saying, hey, well, you're out in Mexico doing this, but you haven't been doing it for 6:33 children with autism. 6:34 Would you be willing to sort of amend your protocol to follow what was being done out of Arizona State? 6:40 So we did that. 6:41 And that was in sort sometime I believe in 2019. And so we started doing that in 2018 and then we had just started seeing more and more of these families 6:53 and it grew to us expanding to several other clinic locations around the world. 6:58 We just treated hundreds of kids with autism and a smattering of other chronic diseases along the way. 7:04 Again, we can drill down on any of that that interests you. 7:07 Let's drill on the study. 7:10 What did the studies actually say? 7:12 Yeah, so they were treating kids between, I believe the age of like 5 to 18 was the, the AIDS range. 7:19 And what they observed was, is that through an eight week course of FMT, So there was some pre-treatment, they're using antibiotic, 7:26 and then they did the FMt. 7:28 There was a version of a loading dose portion, And then a maintenance dose, portion over an 8 week period. 7:34 And what they saw is they a pretty significant improvement in their digestive symptoms. 7:39 So about an 80% improvement at the eight-week follow-up, like at follow up time from the initial study. 7:44 I think it was 18 weeks, so 10 weeks after they completed the FMT program. 7:49 And they also saw 80 percent improvement. 7:50 You think of constipation, bloating, abdominal pain, diarrhea, that type of thing. 7:55 Then they roughly saw 25% in improvement of their neurological symptoms, which would include their behaviors. 8:02 stimming and tics and anxiety and depression and aggression and so on. 8:06 So again, pretty dramatic, right? 8:08 80% improvement of digestion. 8:09 Was there a follow-up to that? 8:11 Yeah, so that was the initial. 8:13 They then followed up at two years later and the 80 percent improvement in digestive symptoms maintained and then neurological improvements improved from 25 8:23 percent to 50 percent, which was again pretty traumatic. 8:28 What's really important is that yes, it's great if we can see like a temporary improvement. 8:32 That's awesome. 8:33 But what happens two years later, right? 8:35 What happens five years? 8:36 And so that's, really, you know, was a landmark study. 8:39 Everyone was like, wow, this is just unreal. 8:41 And at this point and still today, to my knowledge, there's no approved and we're talking more like drugs, but there's no proved treatment for the core 8:52 symptoms of autism. 8:53 You know, it's like, here's a little bit of an anti-anxiety. 8:55 Here's the laxative. 8:56 There's nothing to address the course symptoms. 8:58 And so this study just really sort of turned everybody's heads. 9:03 It's just like what is this whole microbiome piece? 9:05 What is the connection between the microbiomes and some of these core systems of Autism? 9:11 Why don't you go into what the microbiome is? 9:15 I mean, I love the micro biome, but from your work, let's really get the audience to know what is the Yeah, I mean I think we're still scratching the surface 9:26 on our knowledge of what it truly is and anybody who considers themselves an absolute expert on the topic is clearly indicating that they are not because 9:34 there's just so much more that we don't know than that. 9:36 We do know that what we do is that it consists of trillions of microbes that doesn't include just bacteria that does of course include bacteria, 9:43 but also viruses, parasites, fungi, and it can be healthy in the sense that there's a lot of these and there are a lots of different ones. 9:52 And it could be unhealthy if there is not a variety and not diversity and a not enough quantity of certain microbes. 10:00 Then, of course, it's going to be unhealthy if it is pathogenic. 10:02 So sometimes there can microbes there that are like candida, as an example. 10:06 It's normal, healthy to have candidas, just when you have too much. 10:10 same with E. 10:11 coli and there's versions of E colii and Clostridium and other microbes that can be pathogenic and bad and create symptoms. 10:19 That's where FMT has been approved for is in the context of Closterium difficile when you start to get too much becomes toxic and creates problems and 10:28 people still die of it and with a single FMT treatment, there's like a 90% cure rate. 10:32 And so yeah, it's this whole living ecosystem that all interplays with each other and all of the other organ systems within our body. 10:42 So basically anywhere there is like, a moist area, including your ears, your nose, you mouth, like all these systems have a microbiome. 10:51 And so we're connected from our mouth all the way to our rectum and it's teeming with microbes, most of them in our large intestine and colon, 10:59 but there's still millions in all these other areas and they all integrate and talk and work together much like you'd imagine the ecosystem of a Amazon rainforest, 11:10 right? 11:10 It's not just trees, it is the whole living breathing biosphere. 11:14 The same thing is very true of our microbiome and it's a huge part of life and why we live and It's being damaged just like the Amazon rainforest,
What the Microbiome Is and Why It Matters 11:25 you know, so the antibiotics damage. 11:27 Yeah, tell us that one. 11:28 Yes The foods we eat, the air we breathe, water we drink, antibiotics, it all has, in many cases, a damaging effect on the microbiome. 11:38 And then that microbiomes is passed down generationally, right? 11:42 Through the mother. 11:42 When we're born, we are getting the micro biome of our mother And then, you know, it's through our life. 11:49 It's maintained and it has grown and expanded based on the way that we live and what we eat and all of those factors. 11:56 And so, the delivery method is a really important one. 12:00 If you're born C-section, your coming out is essentially sterile. 12:03 And so that's not great. 12:05 And then breastfed, that has a really important role in, again, exposing the child to some of these keystone species that really play a role and the overall 12:15 health and wellbeing, both at present and later on in life. 12:19 Wow, I mean, it's just an orchestra, right? 12:22 And everything we do plays an integral part. 12:27 I have two things I'd love for you to touch on is we kind of get that idea if we take an antibiotic or we eat a food, what it does to the gut microbiome. 12:38 But you said even earlier, how you think it's got a much more far-reaching impact. 12:46 So let's talk about the brain. 12:48 What is this that the microbiome, how does it communicate to the brains? 12:54 And when it is disturbed, what does that look like in somebody's brain? 13:00 Right. 13:00 Yeah. 13:01 I mean, I think there's a lot going on here, especially in the context of children. 13:05 There's certain triggers that need to take place to get neurological development. 13:11 And the gut plays an important role in creating those sort of triggers for development and sometimes if the guy isn't developing appropriately, 13:21 because the got develops as well, right? 13:23 It shifts over the course of life and it becomes more adult-like as the child gets, you know, three, four, five, it becomes more, 13:31 adult like, but it's shifting all along. 13:34 And so all of these different systems in our body that create development and neurodevelopment all need to be in sync in order so that they work together 13:44 and they create the next trigger for the phase of neurological development. 13:48 So that's the first part of it. 13:50 If the gut microbiome isn't healthy and isn' developing as it should and getting the inputs that it It will affect neurological development. 13:59 You'll see that in kids, right? 14:00 Like they miss the speech development, like what happened there? 14:04 They missed the development of the neuromotor and being able to walk properly or crawl properly, or be able do things like scootering or swinging, 14:14 biking, things that just require some neurological pathways to develop that didn't or didn' completely develop. 14:20 And so that's a whole big area. 14:23 The other part is if the gut is unhealthy, you create inflammation in the got that then affects the brain. 14:31 Now, how exactly the microbiome communicates with all these different organ systems? 14:36 we're not totally sure. 14:37 We do think there's something definitely between the vagus nerve and the gut and microbes, and so there is crosstalk between organ systems. 14:45 But how does the got in the bone? 14:47 How does it got into the ear? 14:50 We know it's all happening, we just don't know clearly how. 14:53 And so that's, who knows? 14:54 Hopefully one day we get some more clarity around that. 14:57 What happens though is if you have a lot of inflammation in your gut, First, you're not creating the right chemical signals to go throughout the body. 15:05 You're now producing all of the neurotransmitters and all the building. 15:08 Everything comes from the gut, right? 15:10 I mean you eat food, break it down and then it goes off to do its own thing as needed. 15:15 And so if you have enough inflammation for long enough, You start to damage the integrity of gut lining. 15:22 The lining of the gut between the rest of body is very similar to the lining up the blood-brain barrier and the body. 15:29 So, inflammation in the guts creates a degradation, a breakdown of a leaky gut. 15:35 That then also can create what we loosely term as a Leaky Brain. 15:40 So now you're starting to get stuff that's not supposed to be going into the brain, going INTO the BRAIN, creating inflammation in the Brain. 15:48 Inflammation just damages stuff, right? 15:49 Like you think of osteoarthritis or anything aidos-related. 15:53 Aidos creates damage and creates breakdown, you've got enough osteosthritis in a joint for long enough, it just totally eats the joint away. 16:02 Now, short term, very necessary, a very healthy immune response is required. 16:07 It's when it's chronic inflammation over a long enough period. 16:10 And so, an imbalance of the microbes in the gut creates dysbiosis, or imbalance, of microbes. 16:18 Dysbiosis then fuels inflammation and you don't have all the building blocks to counter the inflammatory response. 16:25 And over a long enough period of time, you start to have an effect on your immune system and all of the other immune systems in the body. 16:32 So now you got this hyper ramped up immune response, You start reacting to foods, more inflammation. 16:38 I mean, and this just keeps cascading and over enough time can create permanent lasting damage that can't be undone. 16:45 unless you do something like an FMT, a fecal transplant. 16:49 Yeah, and see when this happens, when the kid's window of development is open, it's literally, correct me if I'm wrong, but it is literally becoming like 17:03 a role model for how that system is actually going to grow up. 17:09 And that's what creates these children that are not developing correctly. 17:17 And gosh, we just have so many. 17:19 It boggles my mind how common this really is. 17:25 So what do you think about pathological biofilms. 17:30 Yeah, I mean, there's definitely something there and that's essentially connected to this whole picture of dysbiosis, right? 17:37 You have bugs that, you know, are maybe normal to be there. 17:43 but there's also pathogenic bugs. 17:45 And, you know, the whole goal of life in general is to try to sustain life, right? 17:51 Like we're all going about our day trying to sustainable our life. 17:53 We're eating, we are breathing, or drinking, and we try and avoid just running into a street. 17:57 You know? 17:58 We are all doing things to keep ourselves alive. 18:01 Bacteria are the very same thing. 18:04 Viruses, they all want to live. 18:07 And so they want to evade detection from the immune system so that the system doesn't go after them and try to kill them, 18:14 and eliminate them. 18:15 And what do they do? 18:16 They go into a biofilm where they become undetectable.
How Gut Health Affects Brain Development 18:19 Then when the host, us, becomes weak, they can come out and have an effect. 18:24 They can go create havoc, multiply, create more damage, lower the health of the hosts but not too low. 18:32 We don't want to kill the host because the hosts is feeding us every day. 18:35 It's giving us blood supply, it's given us nutrition, and it is giving everything. 18:39 So yeah, biofilms can be a real challenge, especially in people with really chronic diseases. 18:45 When I was still actively treating patients, we weren't doing it of biofilm stuff but I generally find in younger kids the biofilms stuff isn't as severe 18:56 or significant as say to someone who's an adult and been really chronically ill for a long period of time maybe dealing with Lyme and other things. 19:05 Okay. 19:06 All right. 19:07 So now let's really get into the nitty gritty of FMT and explain like a procedure. 19:16 And where do you get the poop? 19:19 Sure. 19:20 Yeah. 19:20 No, that's an important part, right? 19:22 One of the most important parts. 19:23 So, you know, FMT, the general concept of it is like, we have a patient, they are sick. 19:29 They have some disease. 19:30 That disease usually comes with GI problems, digestive problems. 19:35 Right? 19:35 It could be IBS and they've got constipation, bloating, gas. 19:39 Could be, Parkinson's disease, And they also have GI issues and neurological diseases, or it could be autism, and they've got all of those things as well. 19:47 And so patient, sick, microbiome issues, dysbiosis. 19:52 Now we have a donor who's healthy, doesn't have long history of antibiotics. 19:56 We could go talk for an hour just about the donors and the donor screening, but ultimately we want to make sure they're younger. 20:01 So our donors are between the ages of 10 and 30. We want to make sure they're breastfed. 20:06 We wanna make that they are eating a broad, omnivorous diet, that their physically active and fit, they don't have any mental health issues or challenges. 20:13 They've got a healthy BMI. 20:15 And then we look at their medical history. 20:21 any kind of diseases that might affect microbiome health. 20:26 And then we put them through a whole litany of questionnaires. 20:30 We look at their blood, stool, urine for anything pathogenic infectious. 20:34 we've put him through all physical exam and it's a very exhaustive process. 20:38 With like a basic questionnaire that people fill out less than 1% of people who like apply to become a donor actually make it into the program, 20:47 which just goes to show you that it actually very hard to find very healthy people. 20:52 Wow, wow. 20:54 Yes. 20:54 So all those things we talked about before that damage the gut microbiome, we want to make sure that those are happening with our donors, 21:01 right? 21:01 So we wanna make they're vaginally born. 21:04 We wanna be sure they've been breastfed. 21:10 It's just such a critical piece to make sure that the health of the microbiome is there. 21:14 So let's say we've got this very healthy, let us call them a super donor. 21:18 We take their stool, which is full of millions, billions of microbes. 21:24 Every time you're having a bowel movement, you are passing billions of microbes and that's just normal. 21:29 It's not just a normal part of the way that the system works, but there's more and more there and they keep reproducing and maintaining this healthy balance 21:37 in a healthy person. 21:39 And so we want to make sure the person's healthy so that their microbiome is healthy. 21:42 We then take that stool and there, again, we could talk for another couple hours just about how we convert that product into the finished end product. 21:50 And I've got a few demos here so that you can see. 21:54 So it ends up being a couple of different product types. 21:57 This is a capsule. 21:58 It just looks like a probiotic. 22:00 Essentially, it's a powder. 22:02 Makes it easy to ship, makes it easier to store. 22:04 Its double encapsulated and terracotta, which means that when you take it, you don't have to worry about the stomach acid killing the bacteria. 22:11 Then this is the product that a patient would take. 22:14 I didn't realize you could do this orally. 22:17 Yeah. 22:18 Yeah, that's like most common way today of treating is oral. 22:21 Oh my gosh, it's so much easier. 22:24 Well, there's this, which is the enema. 22:26 So still being in, this is obviously empty and not labeled, but the anem, This is 60 ml. 22:31 And so you can still take it rectally. 22:34 Gastroenterologists were doing FMT via colonoscopy would go this route and they would apply it at the time of colonocopy, 22:41 But it is just not a super common of doing it anymore. 22:43 We still make it because it isn't an approach some people take. 22:46 And if there's a lot of distal inflammation, we may suggest starting out with an enema, like someone who's got a proctitis or an ulcerative colitis distil 22:55 in the colon, We may consider going that approach. 22:58 But yeah, so this is a capsule and as a lab, So we're based in Canada, but we are licensed by Health Canada with what's called a drug establishment license. 23:06 So that means we have a GMP licensed lab similar to the manufacturer of any other drug or medication. 23:16 I won't bore you with all of those details. 23:18 So this is the capsules, one of the product types. 23:21 The enema, another product type. 23:23 But the other one that's really interesting in the context of kids and pediatrics is actually we developed, this an oral powder. 23:29 It comes in like a small vial and so it's substantially colorless, odorless and tasteless. 23:37 And you would just take it out of the small vial, mix it with a little water or juice or milk, whatever a parent would normally give with their kid. 23:45 And they would take an oral because, you know, again, a lot of kids can't swallow capsules. 23:50 That was going to be my question. 23:51 What do you do with the kid that can swallow a pill? 23:55 Yeah, the only distinction is that with the oral powder, we suggest going on a proton pump inhibitor to lower the stomach acid so that more of the microbes 24:05 can get through and have a positive effect. 24:07 Now, when we were treating patients, We actually compared the two groups, capsule group and oral power group, and we didn't have any distinction in the outcome. 24:17 whether they did a capsule or powder. 24:19 Now, when they do the oral powder, they would always start with the rectal enema and then they'd go to the oral powder Most clinics today that are still 24:27 treating pediatrics and kids with autism are not doing the Rectal Enema. 24:31 They're just relying on the Oral Powder and they'll do a loading dose with Orals Powder, and a continued maintenance dose thereafter. 24:39 Wow, that is absolutely fascinating. 24:43 I can remember, it was probably three or four years ago, I may have run across that study which really got me thinking about it for some of my patients 24:54 and I was really encouraging patients or parents with children that had just either low functioning, developmental delay,
Biofilms and Chronic Dysbiosis 25:04 autism, whatever the case may be. 25:06 Let's dive in. 25:08 But it was very costly. 25:10 Of course, they had to travel. 25:13 Can you talk a little bit about what kind of investment are you looking at? 25:18 Sure. 25:19 Yeah. 25:19 I mean, so at the stage, and we didn't get to this part of the story, but I spent several years treating, you know, hundreds of patients. 25:26 And we had clinics in different countries around the world. 25:29 Then we decided in roughly 2023, early part We decided to discontinue the patient treatment side. 25:37 Remember, this whole story started with that person who was trying to get access to FMT. 25:43 And in the few years of treating, we learned how to solve some of the hard things. 25:46 One, how do make the product, find donors and actually have something to deliver. 25:51 Two was the protocols that we developed to treat the patients that worked with. 25:56 So once we sort of cracked those two codes, the next phase of expanding access was to actually educate practitioners and get the product into more hands 26:06 of more doctors so that people didn't have to travel to other clinics, countries, locations. 26:12 And so where we are today is we just supply product to different clinics doctors, research groups around the world for whatever indications that they have 26:23 regulatory approval for and that that can access it for. 26:26 And so cost-wise, I mean, that really depends on the length of the protocol, right? 26:31 So in a case of C. 26:32 diff, where it's a very acute condition, you could get away with like as little as 12 capsules. 26:39 But in the context of something more severe like an autism, we were treating for four months. 26:44 We see clinics treating now between two, three, four, months, just depending. 26:49 So it could range as low as a few thousand bucks up to eight or $10,000, depending on the length of the overall protocol and how much total product is 27:00 being used for that protocol. 27:02 The cost really varies a lot. 27:04 And it just comes down to the length of the protocol and that ultimately comes to how chronic and severe. 27:10 We've developed a lot of protocols based on the research and we do share all of those and predominantly we're sharing those to actual physicians and providers. 27:19 But happy to share that with you as well for your review and you're welcome to it. 27:24 It's more pertinent to physicians of course. 27:27 Wow, this is absolutely fascinating. 27:30 So do you have providers in the United States? 27:33 Yeah, all across the US we have doctors. 27:35 Oh wow. 27:36 Okay, well we're definitely going to need some resource to be able to know where those are. 27:41 Right, and a lot of that comes down to, you know, we are happy to connect people depending on what it is they're dealing with. 27:48 Like if it's an autism thing, Probably we're going to connect them to one person who's doing this via telemedicine and does stem cells alongside of it. 27:55 If it's someone who is treating like say, you know, a patient with a lot of Lyme or something, we might connect him to someone's treating a little Lyne. 28:01 So it combines, so you're bringing the best of the two worlds together. 28:06 We're happy to be a resource for that. 28:07 As someone wants to just go to our website, reach out via the contact form, or happy, to make introductions. 28:13 we don't just have like a broad list of all of doctors. 28:16 It's just more of a one-off depending on what's needed. 28:19 Well, yeah, we will definitely we want to make sure that we have all of your information in the show notes, and I definitely want To connect further with 28:30 you because I really do see this as a way for parents to really understand what's going on.
How FMT Is Done and Donor Screening 28:39 And I can tell you, I've been doing my work for 30 years, and there isn't one child in 30 that I have not said, we've got to start with the gut. 28:52 Everything does start out with a gut, but I couldn't agree more. 28:56 And you've got parents that are having their child basically live on Merillax to go to the bathroom. 29:05 You have children that they're not eating well. 29:08 We have school lunches that aren't terrible. 29:11 The idea of how they are made. 29:15 And I always say, we've got these grocery stores here that say 10 for 10. I won't name them out so I don't get in trouble. 29:23 But you go and there's a cardboard box with, you can get 10 small packages of goldfish. 29:31 And parents, it's hard to pay for everything. 29:35 you know, try to feed your kid and then you got a picky eater. 29:39 And so you just think that all you can do is feed them and they got to have something. 29:44 Some pediatricians say it really doesn't matter what you give them. 29:48 I mean, so as a parent, I just feel like you're hit with so many things that you don't know what to do. 29:55 But I would support this approach. 29:59 for almost every person in this practice because the gut is such an issue. 30:06 Food is the hardest thing to try to get people to change. 30:11 But I really believe in, Jason, you tell me if you agree with this or not. 30:15 If we restore that microbiome and we brought improvement of health, wouldn't the drive of what you eat change? 30:25 Absolutely. 30:26 I'm glad you got to this natural point because I would be remiss if I didn't include the importance of it. 30:32 It's one thing to do a transplant, but if you keep living the same lifestyle that you were pre-transplant, you're going to end up back in this literal 30:41 similar situation in a matter of time. 30:44 The way that the microbiome works and the reason we have bacteria in our gut to begin with is because we aren't able to digest fiber. 30:51 Like, we don't have a mechanism for that, right? 30:52 Like if it's a protein, say a piece of beef or chicken, you eat that there's stomach acid and proteolytic enzymes and all the things that help to break 31:00 it down to small components that we can utilize to build hormones and neurotransmitters and muscle and bone and other stuff. 31:07 Fiber, We can't do that with. 31:08 And so we have bacteria to break down the fiber and get all of the great benefits from it. 31:14 The bacteria then spin off their own metabolites like short chain fatty acids, including butyrate as an example. 31:20 Buty rate is all these wonderful benefits of healing, being a fuel source for the gut lining as anti-inflammatory. 31:27 This is again, just a sliver of all the different things that happen within the microbiome, including producing some B vitamins and then just the list 31:35 goes on. 31:35 And so the role then of the diet is that these different fibers from different foods feed different bacteria. 31:43 So we have different bacterial in our gut to break down and ferment different fiber. 31:47 But if we're only eating a few foods, we don't have much variety of fiber. 31:52 And so we only feed a subsection of the microbes that should exist in our gut. 31:57 So if you were on a really restrictive diet for a long period of time, just call out carnivore diet as an example, you're not going to have had a lot of 32:06 different fibers, and eventually they'll die off. 32:08 I mean, they're just like humans. 32:08 You stop feeding a human, it's going die. 32:11 Same with these back here. 32:12 They're a living organism. 32:13 If you stop giving them what they eat, And so variety is the spice of life in the context of the gut and supporting these new microbes that we've transplanted. 32:24 So our goal always, and this is something we educate on, is expanding the diet to include at least 50 different foods. 32:31 And this will be another resource we can share. 32:33 In the notes is like helping people to expand their diet. 32:36 This is good news, regardless of a transplant. 32:38 You want to do this regardless, of transplant by shifting your diet within 24 hours, you can see a positive effect on your microbiome. 32:46 just by shifting your diet. 32:47 It's the simplest thing to change your microbiome. 32:50 With or without FMT, the best thing you can do is expand your diets, include more diversity. 32:54 Of course, avoid antibiotics and try to sleep well and avoid stress. 32:58 There's all these other things, but there's nothing single-handedly that works better and faster. 33:03 and simply shifting your microbiome via what you eat. 33:07 And so, a big part of during and following the FMT protocol is that you begin shifting you diet to one that includes more diversity. 33:16 The focus is just on eating different foods, right? 33:19 And, so you know, like wheat is wheat, if it's in a pancake or a muffin, it just wheat. 33:24 So you want to try to expand and we share a whole list of different foods that you can choose from to help you get more diversity in your diet. 33:32 And you'll probably appreciate this Dr. 33:33 Hansen. 33:34 So we had parents in our treatment group years ago, we were still treating patients and they'd say, well, if the goal is 50 and that's good, 33:41 I'm going for 100. that they would hit a hundred. 33:44 I mean, it was so impressive. 33:46 And I'm like, man, can you be my cook? 33:48 In a week, they'd eat a 100 different foods. 33:50 Now they had to put a lot of effort in. 33:52 They were freezing things and they were batch-packing. 33:55 There's a lotta effort that goes into hitting 50, never mind 100. But the average American's eating like maybe 10 to 15 different food, 34:04 period. 34:05 And that's not great. 34:06 And a lot of those foods are processed and full of colors and dyes and other chemicals and crap. 34:12 So yeah, it's a challenge to do that, especially if you've got a child who's, you know, not neurotypical, neurodiverse.
Costs, Access, and Provider Network 34:20 It can be very challenging. 34:21 I've had kids come to me, they're eating like one, two different foods. 34:24 That's it. 34:25 And so, you know, but the good news is once their microbiome starts improving, they become less sensitive and the story improves from there. 34:32 So yeah, the diet is like such an important piece, of course, to be canned organic. 34:37 But like, let's not make that the focus. 34:38 Let's make the focused trying to expand the. 34:41 Later on, one thing at a time. 34:43 Yeah. 34:44 Well, and the other thing that really gets to me, I'm in Atlanta, Georgia and I'll go to the grocery store, another one that I won't mention their name 34:55 so I don't get in trouble. 34:56 But you go in there and everything in the produce area, just I would say probably 80% of it, is all from California. 35:06 And I am in Georgia. 35:08 Where the sun shines the same and can easily be grown there. 35:12 We got farmers here. 35:14 And when you think about what they have to do to get it to market so that it looks good, not only, you know, let's have everything every season, 35:27 but they're picking it before it's ready and we're changing. 35:32 I mean, there's so many things that work against individuals trying to and I'll be happy to say the name of this one. 35:42 I get my groceries from a local farming group called Fresh Harvest, and they literally deliver it to my door. 35:51 It's Thursday today, so I got my grocery. 35:54 And it's coming right from the farms, And I've got fresh duck eggs and Vidalia onions and romaine lettuce and whatever else I picked, 36:06 you know? 36:07 So there are other ways that We can make a shift. 36:11 I like what you said. 36:12 Let's just make it shift Look at what your eating and start trying to expand it when that gets comfortable Maybe think about the resource just one little 36:25 step at a time But you're right if food is everything for the human being There's no getting around that And here's another fun one. 36:34 This is something I usually kind of make a light joke about, but to go hug a tree. 36:38 I mean, the earth is the original microbiome, right? 36:41 I means, that's where we got our microbiomes from. 36:44 The microbes were in the soil and wherever else. 36:46 And then over time, we ingested them and then it started creating its own life inside of us. 36:52 Beautiful. 36:53 I love it. 36:54 Yeah, I think it's important. 36:55 Like there's so many benefits. 36:56 We know all the benefits so you can read all of the studies on the importance of fresh air and sitting outside and walking on a lawn and you name it, 37:02 right? 37:02 Kids who spend more time outdoors and have a pet and all these things are generally better off. 37:08 Now, why don't we spin ourselves, you know, like go out in nature, literally go hug a tree, go swim in a lake, roll around on the beach. 37:15 That's the microbiome. 37:17 It's teeming around us. 37:19 Let's get it. 37:20 Don't be so paranoid about cleaning everything other than maybe something that's in a hospital, you know, to be cautious about, 37:26 but like in nature, I remember when I was a kid, and I don't rinse off one thing that I get. 37:33 I eat it just like that because I'm getting the diversity from the dirt. 37:38 i'm Getting it from where it's been. 37:41 And yeah, that's how you build diversity in your gut. 37:45 Now you might want to rinse of the stuff that comes from stores that you can't name.
Diet Diversity, Nature, and Closing Advice 37:49 Exactly. 37:50 Now that I would totally agree with, but when it comes right from the farm, and I can really understand that woman who decided to sell everything and go 38:01 start her organic lifestyle. 38:03 There's such a part of me, I'm like ready, just go build a farm. 38:07 Get a couple of goats, some ducks, Well, then invite your patients to come and hang out with you there. 38:14 Exactly. 38:15 Never mind doing consultations in a clinic room. 38:17 Have them on the farm. 38:19 Wouldn't that be great? 38:20 One of my friends told me to do it that way, too. 38:23 So you never know. 38:24 Whatever God has in store, I just open the door and make it happen. 38:28 Well you've already gotten a few little, you know, pushes here. 38:31 I'm one of them. 38:31 Yeah. 38:36 Well, Jason, this has been just so wonderful. 38:39 I am so excited that I got to meet you and have this conversation. 38:44 And I look forward to really bridging a connection because I'm really a big supporter of your work. 38:52 And I think it could really change some lives. 38:55 So thank you so much for being on the podcast. 38:58 Now, tell everybody, how do they find you? 39:02 And if you had one little pearl to leave us with, what would that be? 39:06 Oh, yeah. 39:07 Well, our website is just novelbiome.com, N-O-V-E-L-B-I- O-M- E. 39:13 On all of the social things, it's similar. 39:15 It's at NovelBiome. 39:17 So you can always check us out there. 39:18 But the website would be the great resource if you wanted to be connected to a provider or someone and or just ask us questions. 39:25 Then if your health care provider listening to this, you could definitely reach out and we'd be more than happy to have our conversation and go over what 39:32 we do, how we things the way we operate and how you might be able to offer this to your patient population if it is of interest. 39:39 And the microbiome is just such a key part of our life. 39:42 and it's something we should respect, cherish, take care of, be grateful for when it is healthy and really do our best to turn around if it isn't. 39:50 FMT isn' t for everybody. 39:52 Not everybody needs it. 39:53 Most people can get away with cleaning up their diet, avoiding things that we know kill it, spending more time in nature, 39:58 eating more diversity. 40:00 That will fix most people's problems. 40:04 the disease, the inflammation is just gone too far. 40:08 Or the starting point in the life, they just missed it. 40:11 Not being born vaginally, not being breastfed, early use of antibiotics, restrictive diets, environmental challenges or toxicities, 40:20 those people may need it and would very likely benefit. 40:23 But there's a lot that people can do just with the things that are around them that aren't expensive, that our accessible. 40:29 And so, yeah, I would just say, don't give up hope. 40:33 keep fighting for a better future for yourself, for your kids, and for our greater world around us. 40:37 Yeah, God really has given us everything we need, hasn't He? 40:40 Pretty magical, including in our poop to bring it all the way to 16. Exactly. 40:46 See, and I got a lot of boys in my office and they love to talk about poop. 40:50 And I'm always asking them, did you poop today? 40:52 And they loved to have that kind of conversation. 40:57 Kids, they are just so awesome. 40:59 I love it. 41:00 They really are. 41:01 Well, thank you again and thank everyone for tuning in. 41:04 We really enjoy bringing you this information, and remember, check out our website, connectmybrain.com. 41:11 We have a couple events coming up in June, depending upon when you hear this. 41:16 You might hear it before the last event that we're offering, which is the Babysitter's Club. 41:24 We are asking grandparents, young people, if you take care of somebody, we want you to come to the Babysitter Club last Saturday in June 12 to 1, complimentary. 41:37 We want to help moms and dads get out on a date night. 41:41 Now, if by chance you missed it, it's okay. 41:43 Be sure and check out our resource tab. 41:46 We offer events. 41:47 It will probably be very light in July, just because it is a big travel month. 41:52 But get ready in August, we have a lot of new things coming your way. 41:56 Now this was a really important podcast tonight. 42:00 So if you heard something in there and it made you say, you know what, I need to check this out, be sure and share the podcast and subscribe and we'll 42:11 make sure we have all kinds of great information about Jason in our show notes. 42:16 And as always, thanks for tuning in and be blessed. 42:20 Thanks for listening. 42:22 I hope today's lesson will help you or someone you love. 42:26 Do you have a question or just really want to talk to somebody about brains? 42:30 Connect with me over on Facebook or Instagram at Connect My Brain. 42:35 Looking to understand and optimize your particular brain? 42:39 Check out connectmybrain.com for course information and resources. 42:45 See you next class. 42:49 you
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