The Missing Link In MCAS And Histamine Intolerance

Introduction and Allison Vicaryu2019s background 0:00

Welcome back to the reversing mast cell activation and histamine intolerance summit. I'm your host, Beth O'Hara of Mast cell 360 and I am really, really happy to have with us today Allison Vicary. This is somebody whose blog I followed and work for quite a number of years, and I'm delighted that she's going to share with us her method that she uses in her own practice and give us a whole nother perspective on mast cell activation syndrome and histamine intolerance. So let me tell you a little bit about her.

Allison's been working in the area of histamine intolerance and mast cell activation for ten years, and she was first diagnosed with histamine intolerance after being prescribed metformin. So this is a medication used for insulin resistance, but it blocks the histamine integrating enzyme DHA or diamine oxidase. Then a series of severe adverse reactions to other medications for her diagnosed with nasal activation syndrome. And she developed chronic fatigue and even acquired a brain injury from that medication.

She has trained extensively over the past ten years with some of the thought leaders in health restoration, and recovered her health, and the person whose influenced her the most is Doctor Clean Heart. She's. This is a r t testing and a practice along with functional health testing and tools, and she's also an advocate for prescribing better prescribing practices. And she appeared in a governmental Australian health inquiry. And her recommendations were adopted. And implemented. And she's really been instrumental in educating doctors on identifying medication errors.

Welcome, Alison. It's so wonderful to have you with us. Thank you so much. I can't believe we've not met before now. I've followed your work as well, so it's a real treat for me. And thank you for doing this summit because we need to be talking about these issues more. Solutely so yeah. Yeah. And we and we, we both have these personal stories with it where like, you know, at our own problems and health issues and who recover it. Yeah. And I, I sort of see it almost as an awakening actually. So, you know, the back story of my stories that I was working in a public company in incredibly stressful environments, you know, not looking after myself, not knowing how to look after myself.

And I really didn't know how to look after myself. And it took a series of adverse drug reactions, which actually took down my histamine system for me to become awakened. And there were two very precise moments that can probably explain a lot of what people are about to hear. The first is, I had the extremely good luck to meet a professor of immunology who was an expert in drug allergies, and he took one look at me and said, you're being poisoned. I mean, on his bright pink spots, about two minutes.

And, he said to me, you have to learn to keep yourself well without medication. And I could literally hear myself saying, what are you talking about? Oxy. Yet what I was doing was making me sick. And look, I'm not against medication, I use medication. But if that medication wasn't right for me, and the penny dropped that I really didn't know how to be healthy. So that was that, and I went, well, I've got to learn how to keep myself healthy. So I saw my house, and I appreciate not everyone can do this, but, by then I had a severe brain injury so I could do whatever I wanted.

I wasn't able to work, and I set my goal of getting myself healthy. And then about 5 or 6 years ago, I met, Doctor King Howard. He came out to Australia and a friend of mine, said, Alison, you've got to go down and, you know, do his course. And it literally took me about a month to reorganize my view of the world. So profound was his, approach. Now, just to put it in perspective, I use anything that works. So what I'm presenting, is very much teaching fairly hard. Pulling heart view of the world.

And he, I'm incredibly grateful for his generosity and sharing.

Health, self-mastery, and the five environmental layers 5:00

I can't claim to have thought of all of these, but it's certainly, what I've practiced for the last five or so years. So I'm not against, genetic analysis. I'm not against functional labs. I'm not against the way lots of people are working. But I just wanted to present a slightly different perspective, and I love that. Yeah. Yeah. So that's sort of my, my journey really. And you know what I hope to do in why I work is teach people how to take care of themselves. So self-mastery we, we all need that.

And this drives me. You know, I also had no clue how to take care of myself when I got sick. And I think I see that over and over. And that's a lot of what we do is show people, how do you love your body? How do you love yourself? How do you care for yourself in ways that not just we recover our health, but we can maintain our health going forward? Absolutely. Because what I realized in that moment is health is not a disease. And I was busy getting sick from busy getting better. And look, there are times where we have diseases.

I've had my gallbladder out. It needed to come out. But there's a lot that can happen before that that I can do to keep myself well. And, that was my big moment. Thanks to a, professor of immunology. Wonderful. Well, I'm excited to dig into what you're going to present, and I know that we have similar world views in terms of our big picture. And then we have some different applications. And that's what I'm going to have a lot of fun learning from you about what your applications are and what you're finding working in your clinic.

With the population that you work with and, seeing where we can even maybe dovetail some of these, these different worlds. So let's dive in. I know you've got some slides you're going to share with us and we'll get those pulled out. Yeah. So as I said, one of the key realizations I had is that health is not a disease. That doesn't mean that we can't get diseases. But certainly there's a lot that happens before that and a lot of healing possibilities. And the other realization I had was that health happens in an environment.

And so a lot of what I'm going to focus is on is the environment. And that doesn't mean that other things don't matter because they do. And anything that works works. But I think one of the key moments I had from Clean Cop was just the sheer importance of the environment. And as Klinghoffer puts it, and I'm giving him full credit for this. They're really five types of environmental stressors. And so often we're focused on the physical level. But in the remainder of this talk, I'm going to predominantly focus on the other two levels.

And so this is Klink Hart's view of the world, which is that there are five environments. And some of these may not mean very much at the moment, but hopefully as I go along, it will make more sense. So there's the physical body on which all the levels sit. It is very important, but it is highly influenced by the other levels. So there's the energy body. So I know you have people talking about the vagus nerve and how things communicate. So we can think of this as the wiring level. There's the mental body.

And by this I mean, thoughts and beliefs, or conscious of what is conscious to us. Then there's the intuitive body, which is really looking at things like our unconscious beliefs, our inherited beliefs, and archetypes and personality unconscious, of course. And the final level is the spiritual body. And, this is not my business. It is between the individual and the spirit. But I have seen blockages in my clients on all of these levels. You know, particularly, for example, the spiritual body. I've had a client whose father died and what brought her body back online was actually working on the spiritual body.

And for her that meant, amongst other things, mantras and chanting and really reengaging with the spiritual, see blockages on the intuitive body, in the mental body all the time and definitely the energy body, as we all say. I'm sure you've got lots of people talking, talking on the physical body. So I'm just going to give a bit of anecdotal, anecdotal, information on that level. So, those are the five layers. And so I am going to be focusing a lot on the second, third and fourth, which I think, will hopefully add some new information.

And Alison, I think I just want to share that we see this a lot too. And I think just the, the Languaging is maybe just different ways of wording it. Yeah. But we absolutely see this and, and in some of the most sensitive people, when we've tried everything we normally try with what we have here is the energy body. And I have seen this in my studies and, medical yoga therapy. But, when we've tried working our way through these, we've had many people had the spiritual blocks and there was some really excited that you're going to talk about that, because it's not something that we're talking about enough.

And it's it's different than saying it's all in your head, which so many people have been told. It's not that. It's, it's a, a, a level of ourselves we could think, akin to biochemistry, but at a different. I it's hard to even find words for it. But there can be blockages. Just like you can have an enzyme blockage. You can have a spiritual blockage, you can have a mental block, an emotional block, and so on. And look, I think, just to emphasize, we're not talking about what religion you believe in.

This isn't about religion. It's about a connection to the grace and mystery of life and something bigger than yourself. And I think there's some really amazing work being done by people like Joe Dispenza with brain scans showing, how having a connection. And we're about to sort of traverse into poly vehicle theory, which we're definitely in on these levels 100%. You know, we'll link to Paul in Vehicle Theory shortly, showing the change in our chemistry as a result of having a spiritual life. For some people, it's walking in nature.

You know, for some it's, having a dialog with, with, you know, a spiritual body. For some it's, you know, even yoga, it's or it's, it's really meaningful. Meditation. I often find that teaching people awe and wonder, can be a portal through which you can access your spiritual connection. And so that's like a bit I'd like to throw out there and, I can I find that teaching people awe and wonder can really open up the understanding that we can change our lower levels through that level. Yeah. So, I, I find that often if things aren't working, we need to stand back both as people and practitioners.

And this is where working with the practitioner is really helpful, because a good practitioner will be lovingly observing what level is playing out. And ask, what level is is it is this really happening on bearing in mind that, as we will shortly say, the spiritual, intuitive and mental body slows down to the energy body, which I will show in a second and, and flows downwards. So one of the things I like to say to my clients, and it's not this is an oversimplified meditation. Oversimplifying it is there are five levels of healing and four of them, nonphysical and arguably have a, emotional component.

And we are emotional banks, you know, and to deny that is to do us an injustice, a grave injustice. It makes so much sense to me, Alison, and something that I've been trying to find ways to communicate is the ways that we live in the world now are not congruent with who we are as. Yeah, really, truly animals of nature where we walk on the earth, we're in connection with the earth. We're in connection with all of the beings and in living in rubber soled shoes and houses and having internet, as many wonderful things as that's brought.

We've lost pieces of ourselves, and a big part of what we're doing is in the healing is is regaining some of who we truly are, which is so much bigger than what we think. And I often ask people to, and, and we've talked about, forest bathing allows people to lie on the earth. Well, ask people to get back in connection with those rhythms. And there's something that happens with that that was essential for for us to be an optimal health and just the world we are parts. We're not separate. Yes. A part of something much bigger than ourselves.

Now, I'm a spiritual person. I'm not a religious person, but I absolutely know that to be true. Yes. And we talk about nature like it's this thing over there, like we're not part of it, but we are. We are nature. We're one with nature. And we we've done this twisting of it and we have that's part of it. In terms of this bigger scale of what's happening is chronic illnesses, is that it's not about what happened to me, it's about what's happening in the world that's shifting us. And then we have to get back to some of our our true nature.

And I've noticed again and again, Alice and the people that have this connection to something bigger themselves, however they frame it, they get through better and they heal faster. And it gives us the fortitude and the strength to make the journey. This is not an easy journey. It's not a journey for the faint of heart. So I first learned about the importance of the nonphysical levels from two clients a country the identical time who tested with the identical infections. You know, their artists couldn't have been more similar.

If a tribe one came to me saying, I've got this trauma in my life and I want to do work on it. And the other, actually the client was talking about before his father just died, and she wasn't yet really she was still grieving. She wasn't ready to do the deeper emotional work. The first client got better in half the time. I've got clients who we don't even go near the physical body to begin with. The, it's quite clear that there is a trauma walking them usually on them.

Autonomic nervous system, cell danger response, and blocked regulation 18:00

Well I often think the mental body and intuitive body go together because a lot of trauma and our response to it can be inherited. And I've seen people come alive before my eyes simply by doing, mental bodywork. I literally say, you know, they come to me, gray and lifeless, almost unburdened by their, their predicament. And I literally see them just come alive. So, you know, the moral of the story, particular for practitioners of really if clients can find a practitioner to work with, I'll cover the benefits of practitioner in my talk.

But, you know, lovingly observing someone and trying to work out which level is playing out before your eyes allows us to have the greatest service to our clients. And, it may not be on the physical body at all. In fact, I think I will show you some data on some of my clients I would suggest, but, you know, it's flowing down. So. Yes, Sara, relevant physical issues. But we need to love ourselves. The whole person. And, see, the whole person is sort of. You know, what I learned from playing God? Well, I continue to learn.

So, just moving on, just to put this in some context, what I'm about to speak about is very much so down to response territory. And I know you've got other people speaking on that, but I just want to really, say that what I'm about to talk about and what Clinger teaches is very much, in line with that theory. The sort of slight difference is that, I'm talking about, the autonomic nervous system as a whole, which is a slightly bigger, bigger, concept than the vagus nerve. But as we'll be about to say, the vagus nerve is integral.

And so I'll also talk shortly about supplements that I use from my selective ation when, when that's ready. And what you'll see is that is very much based on the so binary response, theory that never how it never can't say that not never you. Yeah. Oh my brain injuries like this. So, and what we're also going to see is the perforation of, parallel methylation, a set of defects and other things, which, for the record, are reversible. So yeah, absolutely. Response. So I just want to make that point that I'm totally on board with.

So going to response, I'll leave that to others to explain, but I want to put that in that context. And then just very briefly for people as a first time they've seen this, this is a groundbreaking model that redefined how we look at chronic illness on these various different levels. And we're looking at chronic illness develops when there's an overwhelm of, stressors, traumas. And it's described as pathogens, chemicals. And then the body goes shifts into the survival responsibilities, biochemical changes.

But we have to unwind it by feeling deeply safe all the way through the system, down to the cellular level. We're communicating that through the nervous system. And then there's a whole talk by Eric Gordon on cell danger response. If you want to dive more deeply into the biochemistry of what this says. Beautiful. Yeah. And I really recommend people to look at that. And I think, you know, one of the main takeaways is that our body is doing its very best to protect us and keep us safe. And one of the other sort of really important points just as we move off this slide, is that the immune function is under the control of the autonomic nervous system.

So absolutely. And what you said is so important because I know when I was extremely ill, I felt like my body betrayed me. And I hear that again and again and again from other people as well. And it was learning that, oh, my body did not betray me. It was protecting me. And and if I hadn't had those two responses, honestly, I probably wouldn't have survived. Yeah, I absolutely know that our body is working hard to protect us. And, you know, that's probably another talk. But, you know, I do get clients that have maybe been to some of the leading researchers and doctors being diagnosed with the syndrome.

When you run this thing, tests, you know, they're reacting to everything. But like I, I really believe that my body is doing this for a reason. And they that's a really good starting point. And that's another place of safety. It keeps coming back to this deep sense of safety that we're talking about on this whole summit. If I see my body as an enemy, that's not a safe place to be in. If I see my body is protecting me, and. And then then there's this whole other layer of seeing my body not as separate but as me.

Yeah. And so it's really I'm protecting myself. That Devin is telling me about it. There's a shift in to safety with that. Yeah, it's a really important point. I absolutely know that my body is working hard to protect me, and I absolutely know that my body has the most enormous capacity to heal and regenerate itself. I mean, we spoke about the brain injury, at the moment, when that first happened, I couldn't speak in a full sentence. I couldn't remember where I parked my car. And look at me. I'm sitting here speaking to you.

My working memory is affected, which, as I used to be a finance director, adding up numbers, kind of head up numbers anymore. I'm not really upset about it, to be honest. But, you know, and yet my body has had this tremendous capacity to heal. And, I absolutely know that to be true. And one of the things I really try to do with clients is get that experience pretty quickly of them realizing that the body has the capacity to change, even if it is changing. Our brain state with or in one dies something or self-compassion is something I often start with.

And then the minute a client has had that experience, it's very easy to move forward from there. Lovely. Yeah. So a lot of working in the environment is about shifting approach from trying to control biochemical reactions to restoring balance. So I believe that symptoms or even syndromes or extreme symptoms, just the boat rocking, trying to restore balance, and what I absolutely know is that if you start removing stressors, including stress, the boat can return to a place of balance and be healthy.

So I just see symptoms or even syndromes as the boat or the body can still restore balance. It's just strong struggling under strong winds or rough seas to correct itself. Disease is when the soul stops functioning completely. That is not what mast cell activation is. So it's all about balance. And this really speaks to that. We, you know, people get so stuck into I have this CVS mutation I can't have I'll never be able to do sulfur or my muscle. And I have these four variants I can't do I can't methylation and I hear that all the time.

But we see these amazing epigenetic changes that have when as people are healing. And I have, for example, pretty significant variants in my heme pathway that caused acute intermittent porphyria for me. Yeah. And or that contributed you know, the played a role, but I don't have it anymore. I don't have those attacks and and the only thing I ever noticed is if I'm at altitude for a while, I need a little more carbs and that's it. And I have severe attacks on a daily basis. It's frightening. So it's that I just love that we're we're bringing a lot more emphasis and attention to these areas that have been inoculated enough not to totally agree with you, because I've had people that come to me with all their genetics wrong.

But the question is why? Like sometimes that's coming. What? What often goes wrong and I will cover this shortly is fear based approaches, which do not help. And they're subtle. Something's wrong with me is the underlying belief something is wrong with me genetically. Something is wrong with me. So I need a medication now. Maybe, though I'm not saying that. Don't. Because the disease, when you know if you have a disease, then that is where the medical model belongs. But, you know, I think it's really important to understand that may be the unconscious thing playing out here is something's really wrong with me.

And I absolutely know that the environment pulls the trigger. Yeah. I've seen spirals, roles reversed. I've seen, a friend of mine falls the most amazing story. He, he's, trained as well about a child. Not I will not being able to talk and doing emotional work. And the child stopped talking. So you know, we've always got to asking what is pulling the trigger here? Not what the downstream effects are, which might be genetic issues, but why? And why is, something's wrong with me. Yeah, we're on the exact same page.

And I think of the genetics as being just a blueprint that when we start to get these domino effects, it's going to highlight certain things will be highlighted. And that's where we get these different expressions of symptoms. But other than we have those super rare true genetic diseases and those do exist. But what we're talking about in functional genetics is all really about the expression level. And what we don't talk about enough either is that these genetic variants, variants, we we look a lot at the downside of them.

But there's a lot of upsides as well. They can be protective like I have a few T2 variants. Well sure. That effects that can affect gut lining. And I have only in my life ever had a stomach flu. Maybe twice. I it's very protective against stomach flu for whatever reason. But but you know, it's not like they're all negative. It's just different genetic. Well and and you know we need to come back to why did these, you know, why did our genes alter and you know, it was always for some sort of additional protective mechanism.

But I could not agree more that, you know, so I'll give you quite a personal example, which is I ran an ice test on myself, and I had almost genetic levels of mutation. I mean, I know it's tests one way. It's pretty good to work out whether it's genetic or or it's, you know, it's environmental. So you had some of those really extremely high markers. Yeah. So it's we're looking at like genetic things always to me extreme, you know, extreme cholesterol. Most cholesterol is not genetic. Extreme mitochondrial dysfunction functions, extreme presentations of things.

And I've completely restored my mitochondria. So if you know extreme things, I think for me, if I'm confident it is genetic, I'll definitely go down that pathway. But my, my approach, failing that is to at least start with the least invasive. Let's see what's happening in the environment. Why is this happening? And move, move forward from now. And there's this whole model of just a recap that it's not that there's something wrong with me, it's what what's happened in this survival, in this protection of myself.

And then how are we going to restore the balance? Absolutely. Yeah. What is my why is my body? What is my body trying to protect me from? Is the question and and, you know, small changes. It's not big things. We don't need to completely reorganize our life. We use this very say that one more time. Just I that was such an important question. What say. And then I can't remember. What are we trying to protect? What are you trying to protect me from? Yes. The body is always working hard to protect us.

It is not doing. It is doing this from a position of wisdom and love for us. You know, and just to sort of reinforce, it's often small, subtle changes is all that's needed. We're not talking about massive things. It might be simply, you know, it's usually simple things that can make a big difference and bring genetics on, on board the. That's my experience. Anyway. So I think, we need a robust autonomic nervous system, which, you know, vagus nerve is part of that. In order to be healthy. And, I just wanted to sort of share a few insights because I thought this might be sort of broadly helpful.

So I say histamine intolerance and mast cell activation on, on the continuum. And, I do have, free course that it goes into this in a bit more explanation, and I don't want to get bogged down in it, but, because I do have a lot more detail and I want to focus on the environmental aspects, but it broadly, you know, comes down to having a leaky gut, having autoimmunity or having something called blocked regulation, which is all about the body's ability to bear the stresses. So let's look at product regulation.

Now, this is something clean cut does, which I think is really, just helpful because it certainly points me as to what I need to focus on.

Trauma, inherited patterns, and emotional influences on illness 35:00

And I've just done analysis of my last 40 clients. I got sick of doing analysis, so I'll stop there. I was hoping to get to 5050 something like that number. But anyway, just for people who may not be familiar with this word regulation, we're talking about blocked nervous system regulation. So kind. That's show up in ways like people having trouble adapting to stress, feeling revved up and then having trouble coming back down, can be temperature control issues where you're cold all the time, you're hot all the time, where you go back and forth.

So these are some exam sleep issues, anxiety, but also idiosyncratic symptoms. So I've got some examples of where we will come to where, which I'll talk through. But they include things like clients having infections down one side of their body but not the other, and not being able to clear it. Clients taking supplements and starting to cry profusely or eyes watering profusely. There is a regulation communication. It's about the the autonomic nervous system is obviously about the brain communicating with the nervous system and then communicate being to the organs migraines, neuropathy.

All sorts of things. And I will go through what I say the most. We're talking about symptoms of often being far removed from the underlying cause and sort of electrical wiring issues is the way I say it, just sort of known as pot, these types of things. Absolutely. Yeah. So in histamine tolerance, well, we often talk about the bucket, you know, the bucket the the bucket getting full. And so we can think of blocked regulation also as the bucket bank for you know, there's lots of other things happening.

But what is this salt that is too great for the autonomic nervous system to adapt to. Okay. So anything that exceeds the capacity of our body to regulate in that moment, can block the whole communication. I'm not sure if that's clear. It is a fairly unique concept, but it's very valuable because it also points me often to where we need to stop in order to start to have the body communicating, including the immune system, in an appropriate manner. And so of, look, you know, my clients are whoever found me, I, I'm not suggesting is representative of the muscle community or whatever.

Most of my clients are now in the muscle area. Histamine intolerances significantly easier. So 37.5 of them, although they had a lot of stressors that were activating their immune system, were not in blocked regulation. So toxicity, which we'll see how that comes about. Extreme inflammatory events to the cell. So I see both Covid and retroviruses in that same picture. It's an extreme cellular inflammatory event. And then really the leaky gut small intestine and lime and Co we're now very much in the vagus nerve territory, or at least that's where I see these.

We know that certain alignment kind of hanging out the vagus nerve and both the small intestine infections of which it could be anything, could be parasites, bacteria, fungus could be anything. And changing, you know, the gut brain communication. Scream vagus nerve tort issues. So does that make sense? And yeah, and so often the very first thing I do, when I'm starting to work on the physical level and with supplements and it may not be the first thing I do is try and get them out of blocked regulation so I can get their immune system more in the game, if that makes sense.

And if this is somebody's first video that they're watching the summit and we talk about this over and over and over. But the the mast cells, the immune system is interwoven with the nervous system. We shouldn't even really be talking about them as separate systems. And mast cells are the interface between the nervous system, the immune system, and they line every nerve sheath, every nerve ending. There's continual crosstalk. So if you want to call those muscles down, you've gotta enter some point for for people complex cases, maybe these are really easy.

They don't have to do this. But most people both of us work with, we've got to enter through the nervous system. Absolutely. And that is, you know, the gift, for example, of clean heart, of emphasizing that the missing link here is, you know, that health does not happen without an ordinary nervous system, which is very much run by, you know, those upper levels that we're talking about, what we think, what we believe, you know, and so on. And we're back to communicating safety. Our nightmare system is going to be monitoring safety or danger.

Safety or danger. Yeah. And and you know, an interesting thing which will come on to you shortly is that our nervous system is scanning for even perceived stress, you know, in a difference between what we're thinking, like, something's really wrong with me. Something's wrong with me. I'm nervous system is going to go, oh, my God, I better send out the troops just in case where they need it. The the. And this is. I know you're we've this in with trauma, but when we're telling the trauma story. Yeah. It's just like it's happening again.

Yeah. Exactly. So this is just a quick look at what my clients, what resonances of things they had and whether it was causing an autoimmune reaction or just an immune reaction. And I don't want to linger on this unless you have questions, but, Oh, look at that Gordon Allen number. I mean, I am seeing an epidemic of Bartonella. You right. The relevance of that is you have the leak is leaky, has gotten brain. It hangs out in the vagus nerve. You can have real boulders in, in your lymphatics. But the noise, underdiagnosed things that I say, Bartonella and retroviruses, and the the importance of that is you can do all the gut work you like, but you won't clear Bob Miller until that's treated.

Okay. Often, I find if you know, people come to me with Sibo and you do all the relevant treatments, but it doesn't clear and the reason it doesn't clear, I've had people it's actually gone up rather than down. And then you check retroviruses and bingo. Viruses and then you can treat so interesting. And I think this is where we, we probably have a little bit of, being on different sides of the world. We see a ton of Bartonella and we see a huge amount of mycotoxins. And I think we have major building issues here.

And so those are our top two. But it's quite interesting to see what you're seeing there in Australia with, you know, different population, different environment. Yeah. I mean, I think, I mean, obviously a lot of what's happening here is, the Bartonella is driving a lot of the gut stuff, at least in my population. I mean, if you've got a leaky gut, you're going to have bacteria. Biofilms is a huge issue, often overlooked. And you're going to have parasites. You can have Candida, you've got heavy metals, got lots of heavy metals for reasons we're about to see.

So of course you're going to have Candida. Yeah. So I think, I think that sort of really what sort of the driving point that, that, you know, and of course, some clients come to us, it's easy, you know, they've that they're just in that leaky gut category where it's an environment causing leaky gut. But most of my clients at least, coming in the autoimmune or blocked regulation, phase. But yeah. So sort of two key takeaways. Bartonella and retroviruses are just at least epidemic. Also just something worth pointing out is that, I get a lot of clients that, you know, they call it an intolerant that haven't excluded gluten.

And I mean, you know, they're not they've done home order, but they're eating chips from a fast food place and getting, you know, gluten sprayed in the same fryer. I even, I'm extremely careful. But I retested my antibodies after being off of gluten for many years and they were still sky high. And I realized I was going to a Thai place and getting rice noodles, and they finally figured out they were boiling at the same point as the wheat noodles. Yeah, yeah. And it was keeping inflamed. So it's sort of interesting to me, that, yes, foods can be inflammatory, but the one that I say sort of cause model immunity or blocking people is gluten.

So and I think some of that, maybe some of it's so high in glyphosate. Yeah. Yeah. Well I would say it's a huge problem in Australia. Yeah. And is here too. Crazy. So, one of the things we noticed was that, quite a few people were in blocked regulation because of toxins. And one of the key, things is really that, most of my clients, at least 87.5%, have detoxification defects. Now, this isn't the full, you know, if there may be other things blocking it, but these are just the ones I say. So, 44.5% had parents, which we know is linked to mast cell issues.

But just a bit of, it's probably higher than that because I haven't been testing parallels. If people have Covid and what I'm increasingly seeing now is lots of people having Covid infections, whether they know it or not, with minor symptoms, acetylation pathway defects is a big, bigger issue than methylation. But I guess one of the real takeaways is also that if you as a practitioner and noticed noticing detoxification defects even on a blood test, we need to be thinking about liver flukes. And, you know, so in the clinic world and I will shortly bring up a slide the reinforces this, the infections are moving in to the place of where the toxins or accumulation usually are, the the lungs or something we're breathing in or but much more commonly in the liver and Botox and then moving there to adsorb toxins.

But in doing so preventing, you know, bile from flowing and things from happening now, obviously, they're more active around New moon and full moon. And I treat the liver floats and lung flukes with the same, same, you know, same protocols. So it doesn't really matter, which. So particularly if people, losing a lot of sleep around New Moon and full moon and waking up in that liver time have had a history of detoxification defects, then we really need to be thinking about liver flukes and on foot clicks.

And just for people who aren't familiar with the parasites, there is, strong relationship with activity with New Moon and full moon. And that's what you're talking about with this increase in symptoms. And it's interesting, is again, population differences. We don't see a lot of that. But I'm hearing no no no but but you do. Yeah. Half my clients are American. Oh interesting. Okay. Yeah I mean I work with people all over the world, but I it is not it is not an exception. It's a rule. Something to actively consider interest.

Yeah. And so it's difficult, you know, without testing we can pick it up. Quite often if people have, have had ultrasounds, they may be told there's something, you know, and, and the medical world don't think about this phenomena. But, I, as I said, with people who are poor, detoxifies, you know, rates lower back to liver with May. You know, it is a rule, not an exception. It at least that's what I say. Yeah. And, clink, Hunt and Scott, better health. I've written a really good paper on pyro and how it changes.

It's totally reversible. The paper is written in the context of Lyme disease, but it is not specific to Lyme disease, emotional trauma, any trauma physically, structurally, emotionally can cause, parallels. And that's part of that. So danger adaptation and a lot of the nutrients. So the parallels for those who are listening is simply, very simply, that we need much more, zinc and B6 than the average person to end up with the same amount. And the importance of that is that it's crucial. Those nutrients are crucial for detoxification.

They're crucial for, enzymes. They are crucial for just about every cell in the body. And, Clean Heart has observed that it is needed for muscle stabilization. And we see a lot of parallels as well. Yeah. It's highly underdiagnosed in people that, looking out for it. Okay. So now let's talk about the elephant in the room. So as you can see, 95% of my client base, have something that I would, consider extreme trauma. And, on top of this is often, you know, things that I haven't resolved that still have, you know, degree of emotional charge for them.

And the only two people that didn't were actually children of clients that were born with in utero infections. So I just count them. So, you know, as we can say, violence towards the person witnessing violence. Emotional abuse, you know, lots of personality disorder type stuff, being the parents, being alcoholics or other things like war, death. You know, pretty, you know, extreme events. And I see it not only as unresolved in their lifetime, but, intergenerational shortly, you know, so, you know, even if we think about the Holocaust, I mean, I think most of us hopefully know someone who's Jewish, who's family have been greatly affected, intergenerational.

And it's not just the Holocaust. It's, something called, like vanishing twins, where you're one of the twin and the twin, the other twin was lost. Stillbirths, all sorts of things. Anything that the ancestors have not resolved can be unconsciously inherited. And beautifully resolved in our lifetime, making us a healer not only of ourselves, but future generations.

Physical triggers: infections, gut issues, toxins, and genetics 53:00

Absolutely. And this has been well documented. This isn't blue stuff. This is, so in the the study that I did get my masters in, in this area and, my research was in the psycho neuro immunology, the study after study after study showing these genetic expression changes, but also mitochondrial function changes that can be tracked. And here we see a lot with, civil war, generational trauma being passed down. So many immigrants and those same there. And, you know, you're working globally and, Trail of Tears and the Native Americans, we live in this traumatized society.

We live in a traumatized world. And then we think about these last two years. We have this huge, massive global trauma from that. Absolutely. And look, just to to reinforce this beautiful, just on two levels is a beautiful study. And, it was of, twins who, genetically identical twins, one of both of whom are 40s, one of whom had had a lot of trauma in her life and looked dramatically older, and one who hadn't had the same traumatic events. But I guess, more importantly, and to reinforce your point, because this might sound like a lot of woo hoo, and you don't even have to believe me.

You just need to deal with what's happening in your life. But, I actually had a detailed conversation with one of Australia's top, forensic psychologists, a psychiatrist, about does the medical profession currently believe that you can inherit in utero trauma? Yes. Now, this is someone who is so far into the medical system, he's not into the alternative world. And for those that are really interested in, exploring this further, I always recommend people start exploring themselves first. But, there's a really good book called it.

You can start with me or. Okay. Yeah. That gives lots of stories. But I've had the privilege of working with someone who's German and someone who's Norwegian, both traumatized by war and saying, and they can see the patterns and how that's played out in future generations. And they've made a decision that it will, you know, they will be the healers within their, their family and for future generations. Yeah. Which is a beautiful work in itself to do that, that we all can do. And there's also very well documented research that in people with chronic illness, there's a much higher incidence of trauma than the general population.

We see that in our clinic. You you've got the numbers right here. It's it's rare for me to have anybody come through who doesn't have trauma. Absolutely. And I think for the clinicians, you know, that maybe listening to this, I include that in my intake. And I'm shocked at how many people have never had that discussion and actually welcome it. Now obviously if people aren't prepared to go there they're not going to be my client. But I have lots of climate clients that have had things happen to them that have never had a discussion with anyone about it.

Yeah. And and it's not difficult to resolve because, you know, for me, trauma is not about the story. It is about what your body's made, about where it's storing it, how it's affecting your autonomic nervous system. And fortunately, that's easy to resolve in somatic based therapy. And the best way to resolve it was talk therapy is not to be effective. Only way to resolve it. I've seen great, great things with HFT in the hands of the highly experienced practitioner. I love maternal family systems.

I think great results with that. I love family constellations. I have someone who actually trained with the founder and has got 25 years experience, and he's just, you know, so you can resolve these things in one session. It's and it's not there's no tissues or Kleenex involved. It's it's quite a visceral, somatic resolution. And there's lots of ways of working like just work based on practitioners that have the experience. So the importance of and the relationship between emotions and trauma and, illness and really seeing ourselves as whole people is that we know, throughout history and that emotions target specific organs so they interfere with their organ functions.

So anything that we unconsciously don't process, which we all do, let's face it. Can go to a specific organ and I will give you some examples shortly. And that thing can cause detoxification effects. So heavy metals can accumulate, infections accumulate where the heavy metals, and then the detoxification organs become overwhelmed. So we've got this stacking of, you know, underneath the infections that are there to be helpful or maybe not helpful, the toxins and underneath the toxins can be blocked.

Emotions. Not always, but we need to consider that as an option. You know, and this is a whole body approach. This is saying what's really going on here. And I will give some example shortly. So, you know, I really drive an individualized approach. I may or may not be working on the physical level. I may not even go to the physical level for three months, and that person may dramatically improve. One of the other things I'm trying to do is addressing as many stressors at once. I could be thinking about trying to resolve balance.

We're trying to remove as many stressors as we can. Now, that doesn't mean we're addressing everything at once, but we're certainly addressing as much as we can. So when I did my functional training, you know, you start with minerals as you then, you know, do the, you do this, you do that and you do it in a sequence that may or may not work or be in the best interests of the client. So, you know, the concept of the autonomic nervous system is working on every thing as much as the body will bear.

If the body doesn't bear, it's not a priority for the body. I mean, it should listen to that. Okay, so let's get to the dressing environment so very much. My view of the world is that the top three levels fit with the polar vehicles here. And I'm not sure if you've got someone talking on that, but, yeah. So this fits within the poly vehicle. Modality. And, and both the mental intuitive and spiritual level, we know that as, as, trauma, trauma can interfere with those connections with ourselves, with others, the world around us and the spiritual.

And as we resolve that trauma, we sort of almost spiral up. And our emotions, our behavior, our relationships can just change by virtue of, addressing and addressing that stress. So very much the mental, intuitive and spiritual level have a very heavy poly vagal trauma, approach. And I'm sure we've all had experiences where we're in the flow of things, we feel happy things are fantastic. We are enjoying the company of others and other times where we want to be left alone. And, and the only difference between those in my world is, trauma or an unconscious belief rocking those levels.

I'm not sure if that makes sense, but that's the way I see those levels with trauma. You know, working on that mental, intuitive and spiritual level, being okay and resolving any trauma and trauma for me is simply an unconscious, unconscious belief or unprocessed trauma that is blocking our body from functioning. So something I think is really important just to focus on is because we're working on an autonomic nervous system level is fear based interventions make things worse. You know, I've had clients who when Covid started, they started googling, you know, all sorts of statistics, had a huge, increase in their symptoms through and a whole bunch of supplements.

Nothing worked. And the only prescription I gave them was to flood their brain with pleasure. And so I think particularly as, clinicians, the therapeutic relationship is key. My role with the client is not so much instructional, but anchoring them in their parasympathetic system, modulate, helping them modulate role modeling, storytelling, anything to help move them back and anchor them in their autonomic nervous system. And I had a beautiful example of this. Just share very quickly because I'm conscious of time.

I've got a client who is, autonomic nervous system dysfunction. He said to me, was in bed all day before we had our group session, and I just didn't realize how important connection was to me and to anchoring myself. Yeah. So as clinicians, we need to really take our role as not being the experts. But really, you know, fostering and and actively working that therapeutic relationship when we're social beings. So that's again a sense of safety is connection. Yeah. So you know, quite a few of my colleagues, you know, judge people if they haven't done something or set harsh goals.

This is not what we're talking about here. My client's highly motivated to get better, and they need, judgment free loving observe. That is gently guiding them. What I find also just in just quickly is, I am not bringing up things I am saying until that client is bringing them up with me. There's no judgment here. But there is a sort of a shepherding role. So we as clinicians need to be clear that if our role is to restore the autonomic nervous system, we are part of that dynamic. So, I'm just going to I've really gone over this in some detail.

But, you know, the poly vagal theory explains very much how trauma can interfere with the autonomic nervous system. But I want to and and this is a really clear example of, you know, a which is a beautiful example of I had a client that had long term issues with elimination organs with being constipated and bile flow and everything else. And she had this weird thing where whenever she used binders or tried to even put in at one dose, but now she started having, idiosyncratic reactions. Specifically, she started her eyes, started watering profusely, not just a little bit, a lot.

And the client was very, observed. It was influenced by emotional stress. And we ended up identified that it was unresolved guilt that she actually inherited from her mother that was affecting her kidneys and adrenals. So this is an example of how unresolved issues can affect people. And when we've got these idiosyncratic reactions, it's always warring. So it's warring. It's never the client is always warring. Everything is connected from the nervous by the nervous system, all the organs, everything.

Yeah. So mix makes perfect sense. And so we've discussed trauma in some detail, but I just wanted to discuss other things that can interfere. There's lots of other things that can interfere with how the body communicates. And what these things I say quite frequently, but, dental that 20% of my clients had dental issues affecting with the nerve nerve flow. It can be infections. It can be just scratching the mouth or TMJ. Anything infected here is, you know, tonsils, sinus, teeth is likely interfering with regulation.

Scars. Not all scars. I don't see this all the time, but I do see it, because our skin is is has sympathetic nerves all over us. And, you know, I have seen scars that can cause limbic kindling. And obviously, just very quickly, more the vagus nerve territory where we saw this blocking right from the start, where small intestinal infections, vagus nerve infections, of which Bartonella is infamous and leaky gut and brain can all bring about that sort of disconnection. So I just want to, you know, emphasize that it's not just trauma.

We just need to be always asking why, particularly when there's idiosyncratic things happening. You know, it's a wiring issue. So just very quickly, 20% of my clients have dental issues contributing. And I have a client that had infections down one whole side of her body that just went clearing, and we identified a TMJ issue. And this was addressed with, assignment. And we use dentists that does kinesiology testing to make sure it's got the balance right. And I think that's always a good, good guide when you're working with the autonomic nervous system.

And also did some cranial cycles and all infections cleared. So this is just a really quick example of of you know, when things aren't just working. You know we've got to think about, you know, what is interfering with our bodies in night. Ability. Here is another, tonsils. So clients have had their tonsils out but clearly had a scabbing lab tests. This is the new Zuma. I believe in America showed a strep infection in the brain, triggered by dairy, which we know. Strep. There's a dairy connection.

There was no symptoms of tonsillitis. Rather, they were mostly brain based. So it is insomnia. And it was resolved with treatment for strict. So sometimes we can have things interfering

Supportive tools: supplements, binders, peptides, and energy therapies 1:10:00

that the body's failed to resolve. And it's almost, you know, shut down trying to fix and going on to other things. And this is an example where lab testing and pulling the whole picture together can be helpful. Okay. I don't necessarily say these things all the time, but just if people get stuck, some things to think about neuropathy and pain, and migraines for that matter. And, you know, like always wiring issues in my client base. So I had a client that had neuropathy and I was aggravated by food intolerances.

So I think there was some funding involved. So gluten and dairy, she had a knee replacement and fortunately she wasn't allergic to the metals, but it had altered who regulation of her and nervous system. And we used life waif patches and cranial sacral to eliminate the pain and reconnect the nervous system. After removing, the food intolerances. And I didn't mention but there's a lot of emotional blocked emotional work here as well. So, I'm not going to talk very much on the physical level. I just felt that people would want some informations like this is more just, because they'll be questions.

The physical level is very important and body is very energy intensive. It has high nutrient demands. In no way am I minimizing that work. I've just chosen to focus on different things. But I thought this might be interesting because this is an analysis of 24 clients. It's not the same clients actions, because I did it some time ago. And what I've observed is that food intolerances are linked to what's happening in the gut and the degree of gut damage. I believe that, it's based on lectins, and I actually think, the plant paradox has got it right.

I do adjust for banana and oxalates, but I usually find that I can resolve some, like Fodmap issues quickly, that I don't have to eliminate foods. So, you know what we can say here? And I'm not going to go through this in general, but what we can say is, you know, leptin by screens, in particular, the dairy on there should be there. So grains, go back, come back with gut repair. Dairy is not on here, but it should be. And, fruit often goes with, candied, and often I cut to, seafoam without fruits going as free environment.

Just, I focus on inflammatory foods, still for, for fuel. So, you know, gluten, cows, dairy and sugar. I, you know, don't need to eliminate everything, but at least eliminate these. I'm working on balancing macronutrients. So quite often, food symptoms are due to people not eating enough protein or carbs. So even if someone's got three foods, you can still reduce the symptoms by getting the fuel to the cell. You know, optimize for that individual balancing blood glucose, promoting metabolic flexibility.

So I'm not a fan of carnivore or k keto diets. I am a fan of promoting the ability to use whole foods and building beautiful light, which signals, the cells to repair. So one of the reasons I try not to remove FODMAPs is for the butyrate. Yeah. Butyrate, the ability. And just a general observation, we've got five levels. So a cascade of eliminated foods. We need to really consider whether the issue is happening on a nonphysical level. Just moving very quickly through some of these medications. Many can interfere with histamine mechanisms or, toxic to the cell causing cell danger response.

I use medication. I'm not against medication. I use medication. I can't describe it, but we do find some medications work best for people, but for people that are interested. I do have this blog post, which was a by, a world expert. So, that will give you some things to consider. And I just want to encourage people to find that, because that's been a tremendous resource for me. And I have used that so much. It's a wonderful, wonderful resource. Thank you. Yeah. And even if you need to use a medication, you can go about it with a low dose immunotherapy approach.

So we shouldn't be scared of it when we need it. We need it. But just as someone that got histamine intolerance from metformin, please rate it. And this is a great way to inform yourself. It helps think it helps people make choices make make good choices. That's right. Yeah. Next is supplements. And look, I actively supplements and I don't want people to be scared of them. The this is actually a client of mine that had, Covid vaccine damage. And look, all of these, in theory, make a lot of logical sense.

But from my perspective, what sort of really happened is it's sort of trying to control inflammation and biochemical reactions without actually addressing Covid, and supporting the cell danger response. So, and what was actually happening and what I say quite a bit, and I'm sure you see this is one thing hasn't quite worked. So another thing is editing and another thing. So we end up with this prescribing cascade now as we'll shortly say, I do use things to, you know, reduce inflammation and all the bits and pieces.

But the main point is none of these were actually addressing what was stressing him, if that makes sense. Yeah. And we need to know what we're when when we have to know what we're doing with the supplements. But to, I like, reach them out. They're being used as if medicine and medicine is there to suppress symptoms, not address what's underlying. If we really want to get out of histamine intolerance, mast cell activation syndrome, which I see people recover from. I know you see people recover from amazing recoveries.

Absolutely. Like we're not going to do it with this. Supplements have their place and I find that they've been very, very important who kind of get at what is underneath. And that's the whole premise of what we're talking about. We've got to get these that, these triggers and restore that balance and harmony. Absolutely. And so the key ways that I use supplements, and I am coming on to, to what supplements I use, to support the so danger response and to remove infections and help with detoxification.

Simplistically what is rocking the boat? What is rocking the autonomic nervous system. And that may not be anything to do with supplements, but I do like to support. So danger response is a minimum. So just a few quick things don't make up for imbalanced diets with exercise environments. Everything health happens in an environment, can be a stressor. So, you know, if you are having symptoms after taking a supplement, we shouldn't assume that the supplements, you know, the problem. It only addresses the physical level, and the focus is on rebalancing the autonomic nervous system, not chasing, you know, antioxidants or other bits and pieces.

And a cascade of supplements always suggests to me that the issues happening on a nonphysical level, we need to keep that in mind. And okay, we just add in. We've missed triggers. We've missed triggers. Yeah. So, let's talk products. Even though, and don't even start with this. So one of the things I try to do is bind up the reactions whilst I'm working on the underlying issue. And three products I use, zeolite and I use toxic prevent, it's readily available in Australia. I also use the, Pure Zeo Bond.

I always make sure that the product has been tested, that it binds to histamine, and that it has a really high silica to aluminum ratio. So I don't just use any zeolite. I do not like the intracellular ones. You don't know what you're introducing to the cell. I also use in terrestrial particularly where there's a high fungal Candida sort of aspect. And if people can afford it, the Rolls-Royce is pissy. It can't Aqaba. So often when there's a huge inflammatory reaction, this bond I can also, adsorb immune reactions.

It's expensive. Oh what's everyone on it? But yeah. So my approach is rather than chasing the histamine reaction, can I bind it up and deal with the underlying issue, reduce some of the load and we'll we'll have these listed on our summit resources page. So you don't have to take notes. We'll have them listed for you. And that's at mass three 60.com/summit. Also we're using these are some of the things I commonly use to reduce inflammation. Really the omega un balm gut support is, is also a bit of a binder.

So I use a lot of CBD, particularly where there's retroviruses driving things. The iron palm gut support I'm using where there's leaky gut, but in really high doses, if there's, leaky gut and brain, I'm often using the BBC 157. I like this. Integrated peptides is also another one in Europe that test quite well, which I can add on to the list, but I find this really helpful, particularly with mold, illness and anything I've got brain related. And then the this product, which is a different peptide, often test with people with, structural type inflammation and we do a whole talk on peptides.

So people want to learn more about those that can them grab that one. They're often really good. And look I've seen they say repair, super leaky gut and brain in about two weeks. So then let's talk about danger response products. I am actively using even in the most, mast cell types, the Zeno balancer, or Aqua X if they don't have a gallbladder or have problem digesting fats. Very good for membranes with mult in particular. I have clients home, have advanced Lyme, lots of neurological symptoms, lots of muscle symptoms.

Tolerating these oil. Yes. It's fish oil has polyphenols in it and it has a little bit of vitamin D, but it is stable. And a lot of the problems with a lot of the fish oils weight testing is that not stable. And this. So then there's a whole range of mitochondrial products. So this is Kano Main in the U.S., I think it is called. And I'll give you the link, mitochondrial rescue is it's just distributed in the US. In Australia it's available from Ethics Med or I sell it on my website. These products are all activated.

This one crosses the brain barrier. And this one we use, highly successfully to stabilize that that cell. It can also chew, like, metals and light stuff out of there. And these are the products that we use to restore, mitochondria that were almost genetically damaged. We use them all the time, you know, and even with people that say, have metal. But I had someone with titanium metal implants that they couldn't get out and they were allergic to the titanium. And what we were left with was the supporting the cell with these products.

So I've tried all sorts of mitochondrial products. These are activated. And in my experience, okay. So that's part of the if you like. So danger response. Then if we're looking at the energy level, I'm using life wave patches with tremendous results. Simplistically, they work with acupuncture points. Acupuncture is incredibly helpful for the autonomic nervous system. But to be effective, it needs to be really done every day. And I've got clients resolving, you know, repairing muscles that are pretty much torn, all sorts of things using acupuncture combined with, sort of also like red light therapy to regulate that autonomic nervous system.

I'm getting far better results with these than machine based.

Closing thoughts on individualized healing and recovery 1:25:00

They want to control it. Thank. You know, we also do tapping on organ points to bring, energy and vitality to the, that organ. So, and I can probably give you the handout to, to link, but, you know, so there are certain points, relevant to gallbladder and other bits and pieces. This is really important to restoring the would not autonomic nervous system. And, just about all of my online clients, tests for needing to stimulate the vagus nerve with life left patches on these acupuncture points. But, you know, I can raise glutathione in the body by 300% with one patch.

So for people that don't want to swallow things or be nervous about that, people would want to get their, nervous system into parasympathetic mode. I've seen people put brain caps on with the patches and completely, you know, lose Parkinson's symptoms. So this is a pain free way that, I just I'm increasingly working with, that works on that energy, autonomic nervous system, body. Then if we this really isn't the metal mental body, but it's more just the energetic body. But the. So danger response has, swarming product.

And, we actively use a very successfully, the there's this one's blocked by a pure and there is another one available. Available in the US. And I will provide you with that link as well. This goes with the mitochondrial products, and I use this extensively. Typically tests extremely well. Obviously homeopathy. So, you know, it's really training the immune system in what to do, and I use it extensively. I've just had someone I've, tested that wasn't included in those numbers. Who's in a war zone and needs, four muscle stabilizers, one medication, needs this and a couple of home, homeopathy products.

So we use homeopathy a lot for allergies, tumult, and other bits and pieces and, of course, low dose and, you know, therapy, sort of fits within this realm. But I guess the main product I wanted to emphasize is the so danger response documented product. I just want to mention I don't use these a lot, but I'm increasingly playing with them, is, on the intuitive level, using and for cereals, which are really just energy based products might maybe, two out there for some people, but just for the sake of complaints.

And so for me, everything is about the autonomic nervous system being how healthy we've discussed broadly three groups. You can learn more about this on my, my website. I do have a free course that goes into more detail about it in the mouse. So community we need to be thinking about histamine intolerance and mast cell activation. Being on a spectrum with leaky gut driving a lot of histamine intolerance, not a license, but, autoimmunity, which is the immune system starting to struggle and blocked regulation, which is a confused autonomic nervous system.

And I've really touched in this presentation on six sort of guiding principles, which is health is not a disease. Health happens in an environment. There are five types of environmental stressors. All approaches need to be individualized for that person's environment. Addressing as many stressors as once has the greatest effect. And as practitioners, the therapeutic relationship is absolutely key to this whole process. And that's my view of the world. So there's your website Alison victory.com. I want to encourage people to check it out.

It's a wonderful resource for lots of information. And you've been in this area a long time. Thank you so much for your really generous sharing. And also what you offer to the world, the hope that you bring the the support that you bring for people who who've just struggled and struggled and struggled. And now you work with really sensitive people like we are. And it takes these kinds of different approaches. And coming at it from, this type of philosophy that's much bigger than just biochemistry.

So yeah. Thank you so much for joining. Thank you for having me. I love talking about this topic, and I'm really grateful that you've pulled this summit together. I mean, to think that there's some of would is five and ten years ago is unimaginable. So I'm really grateful for you getting this information out into the world. And I'd just like to, conclude by saying that if I can get better, anyone can. And, you know, if you look at my journey, I absolutely know that with regardless of where people are in their journey, great healing is possible.

Absolutely.