Radical Remission: How Healing From Cancer is Possible Without Conventional Medicine

Introduction to Radical Remission 0:00

Hey, it's Nathan Crane, director of the Health and Healing Club and host of the Conquering Cancers Summit. And today, I am honored and excited to welcome you to a very special interview. Kelly Turner is a PhD. Is the New York Times bestselling author of radical Hope and Radical Remission. Now Radical Admissions and 22 languages, which summarizes her research into radical remissions. Basically radical remission, meaning when someone hills from cancer or other serious diseases without conventional medicine or after conventional medicine has failed.

As you know, there are a lot of experts, integrative doctors and so forth who are part of this symposium who work a lot with integrative medicine, natural, holistic, and some of the more advanced modern medicine to support you on your healing journey. Whether you're choosing conventional, you're choosing holistic or only natural or an integrative approach. The key here is that you are informed with the best solutions for yourself. And so if you are choosing a conventional approach, knowing what you can do to even support you along that journey is key.

A lot of the interviews, covered that subject. And what's really inspiring about today is you're going to learn, that there are 1500 over 1500 cases of radical remission that we know of so far, and more growing. Kelly's just told me, and she'll talk about with you, every month and every year, documented cases of people who are reversing cancer, healing from cancer outside of conventional medicine. And that's pretty exciting. So she is a frequent guest on the Doctor of Show and holds a BA from Harvard University and a PhD from the University of California, Berkeley.

She also recently directed a ten episode docu series on radical Remission, and you can learn more about all of her great work and pick up her books at radical remission.com. Kelly, thank you so much for joining us. Thanks for having me on. Nathan, I'm really excited. I love I love all the all the summits you do. And I'm especially honored to be a part of this symposium. So thanks so much. Thank you for being with us. Thank you for the great work you've done, and for compiling all this information and helping distribute it to so many people.

So over the past 15 years, you've analyzed over 1500 cases of radical remission. Again, I just wanted to find that right. You define radical remission as someone who heals from cancer or other serious diseases without conventional medicine or after conventional medicine has failed. So I want to ask you, what are like some of the most astounding cases that stick out to you?

Three Categories of Radical Remission 2:50

Some things that might just blow our minds and say, I didn't even know that was possible. Well, I think any case of radical admission is astounding, and I will say that I've tweak the definition over the years. It's always been defined in the medical community as a statistically unlikely remission. And typically that means, you know, in the absence of conventional medicine or in the presence of conventional medicine that is considered inadequate in adequate time to produce the, the results in remission.

So what I, I have three categories of radical remission that I study. So again, these are statistically unlikely remissions. Remissions that according to the doctors were not supposed to happen. Category one is people who from the beginning say okay, thank you for the diagnosis, but I'm just going to make a personal choice not to use convention medicine. I'm going to see how that goes. So they kind of postpone conventional medicine. You know, put it in their back pocket and they end up never needing it.

So that's that's option number one. Option number two are people, like Shane Triana, who is someone featured in my docu series and my first book, who's actually I always have to give him credit because he's the reason I'm here studying this. 15 years later, he was the first case of radical omission that I read about. And he will blow your socks off because he did all of the conventional medicine. He had stage four kidney cancer, 35 years ago. And he did surgery, had a kidney removed, did lots of chemotherapy and, and really the maximum amount of radiation that they wanted to give him.

And still unfortunately, it didn't work. And he ended up, going home basically on the equivalent of what? Back then in Japan with hospice care. So he was sent home in a wheelchair, in a feeding tube and told he had, you know, 1 to 3 months to live. He started intuitively, just making these little changes in his lifestyle. Started off that first night with asking for filtered water because the tap water tasted really disgusting to him after all that radiation. And then, just like little baby step changes where he went to the roof every morning to watch the sunrise, you know, express his gratitude for another day to be with his wife and children, that led to daily meditation, daily mantra practice.

He eventually started a macrobiotic diet. And then suddenly, three months later, he's still around and he's still watching the sunset and listening to the birds. And six months later, he's still there. And then three years later, he's still there. So he just started, you know, incorporating what in my research has turned out to be these ten key healing factors. And he just sort of did it by intuition. And anyway, long story short, three years later, he got a scan. No evidence of cancer whatsoever in his body.

And 35 years later, he recently celebrated his 50th wedding anniversary with his wife. They have something like seven grandchildren, and he is, honest to God, the happiest man I've ever met. If you get a chance to meet him. His smile will just, you know, radiate on you like sunlight. So that's the second category. Someone who tries conventional medicine to its fullest but unfortunately doesn't work. So then they turn to other options. The third category, which is really important for all of your listeners to know, is a statistically unlikely cancer remission in which someone combines conventional and alternative medicine at the same time.

So what that means for researchers like me is it's a little tricky, right? Because we can't figure out what led to their remission. Was it the conventional medicine only and all that other stuff was just, you know, expensive vitamins going out in your urine? Or was it the, you know, alternative things and the, the conventional stuff actually didn't contribute to the remission or did they work synergistically? Now, from my perspective, in that third category, I'm only looking at people who combine, conventional and alternative in order to heal a statistically dire prognosis.

So that for me means a less than 25% five year survival rate. So that's someone who's healing from pancreatic cancer, right? Or stage four lung cancer. Really? Anyone who is given very few months to live if they heal. I want to study them. And so that's why I created that third category. So again, radical permission is statistically unlikely cancer mission. And Shin is a great example of that. I have so many more I could tell you that. Nathan, I could tell you stories all day. Another woman, brave young woman that I've had the honor of meeting.

She was. She's in my second book, radical Hope, and she has agreed to be filmed for the docu series is Bailey O'Brien. She actually just leaves lives 45 minutes from me. So, It's great. She's local, and we can go to farmers markets together. But what's interesting about Bailey is that she was really young when she was diagnosed with melanoma. She was 18. She was a freshman at college, so her life was just beginning. She was on the diving team. She, ironically, was majoring in nutritional sciences to try to learn how to eat better and to learn about the power of food.

And she felt like, you know, like on her temple. And she was like, oh, that's weird. Where did that lump come from? Well, they got it biopsied and it was melanoma. And she was a big believer in medicine and, as as I am as well, I'm a big believer in statistically, proven medical treatments, ones that are likely to help you. And so she did everything her doctors recommended. Unfortunately, a year or two later came back when she was a junior in college. And now she has stage four melanoma, which has definitely less than a 25% five year survival rate.

And the doctor said, we don't really have any great options for you. You know, we could try to get you on a clinical trial, but we've done all the chemo, we've done all the surgery that's indicated for you. And that was the moment where she, and with the help of her mother, decided to take a chance. And instead of, you know, enrolling and waiting for these clinical trials, they got on a plane and went to a clinic in Mexico that had had seeming success in treating advanced melanoma cases. And so, I won't mention the name of that hospital because I'm not here to endorse any particular place.

But I will say what they did, which was for her. They did the Gerson therapy, as well as injections of Coley's toxins, which is a way to stimulate the immune system by giving yourself, an injection of some toxins, some things that your body can fight. But your body has to kind of wake up to fight them a lot,

Mindset, Healing Factors, and the Science Behind Them 9:20

like a flu vaccine, right? We get ourselves the dead flu vaccine because it teaches our immune system how to fight it and what to do with it. Coley's toxins is a little more aggressive than that because you're getting live viruses and toxins injected into you. But again, the idea of this clinic that she went to in Mexico was to wake up the immune system, wake it up with a major diet change with daily colonics with these Coley's toxins. And then, of course, you get a bunch of emotional and spiritual work as well.

I'm happy to report that just six weeks later, she got a scan and that was clear. So six weeks of treatment was all it took for her. And she had to continue that very aggressive diet for years, years to come. And, she still does it to this day. She doesn't do quite as many coffee ademas de or quite as many juices as she did when she was, you know, acutely stage four. But she's alive. Well and, you know, has a wonderful life now in her late 20s and has her whole life ahead of her. So there's just some really amazing stories with radical remissions of people who were really told that there was nothing more that could be done, and then they turned it around.

So that's those are the people I study, and they bring me lots of inspiration, and I'm happy to answer any questions you have about them. Yeah. That's exciting. I mean, just hearing those stories, you know, when I interview people, who have similar stories that are, you know, they were told, you have four months left to live, and I'm interviewing them 25 years later and I'm like, how did you do it? You know, and you start to find these commonalities which which we'll get into, but it's inspiring.

It gives you hope. And, you know, I don't believe there's anything is set. You know, some people say, oh, don't give, don't give the patient false hope. It's like hope is one of the most important things I think people need. But they also need a good game plan. They need good education. They need to be dedicated and inspired and understand all these things that, that correlate to health and healing. As you said, this clinic in Mexico, I know which one you're talking about. You know, they're stimulating the immune system.

Well, we know the immune system. You know, a fully functioning immune system is one of the most important aspects to, helping our bodies heal from cancer. You know, our immune system literally design, you know, creates cells that kill cancer cells and then remove them from our body. Our immune system's not functioning fully. We're not going to, you know, be able to remove those cancer cells fast enough, and then you end up having a cancer diagnosis. Right? So I want to say, you know, I love that you categorize these three categories.

And it was interesting how you said, you know, they don't the science, they're not really clear. They don't really know, like when they do integrative medicine, if it was, conventional medicine or if it was the natural approach or if it was both, maybe there's not a lot of literature on it today that's that's affirming one or the other. But, there are some really great integrative doctors who are part of the symposium. I encourage people to go listen to Doctor Thomas Loti Doctor Nathan Goodyear, there's quite a few, where they do know from their own case studies, internal case studies within their clinics.

Doctor Leah and Connolly has a huge facility in California, has treated thousands of patients with integrative medicine. They do know, very clearly that the combination of the two is what is helping these patients to to heal. And they're doing things like IPT in the potentiated therapy, low dose chemotherapy. They know they can kill cancer cells quickly, reduce tumor size with some targeted low dose chemotherapy. But then they're doing, you know, high level vitamin C injections and they're doing putting them on exercise and meditation and changing their diet and person therapy, so on and so forth.

And they can see very clearly the combination of the two is what's helping people heal. I love that you focus on, you know, the science and the hard data because, a lot of people need that. You know, it's it's like, important. It is important. And, and I think there's something to be said about following your intuition. Right? This gentleman, Shin, I think you said was his name when home was told, you know, he's going to die. And then what? How did he find this path of healing other than, you know, divine inspiration, intuition?

I don't know. I didn't I didn't ask you, maybe, you know, but I wanted to ask you about the mindset, like, how important is the mindset in, and, and the level of belief in the people that you've studied on their path of healing? It's a mindsets. Incredibly important. I'll say 15 years of studying these people, over 1500 cases. I am looking for the common threads. I am looking for what commonalities they have in their mindset. And when it comes to the mental, emotional, spiritual work they have seven things that they all do and three other things that they do which are physical, right?

The diet, the urban supplements, which, by the way, can get very intense. And, you know, I don't mean to dismiss those as just, oh, little things. Right? I mean, the person diet is an incredible commitment. So, you know, diet and herbs and supplements and then exercise, those are the three physical things that radical mission survivors do to get well. Those are all incredibly important. But there's seven other things that they do that they all, according to my interviews with them, they give equal importance to which are mental, emotional and spiritual.

So really 7/10 of their work is mental, emotional, spiritual. So when you say, how important is it? Like it's incredibly 70% at least. Yeah, 70% of it is at least. Right. And these are things like, releasing suppressed emotions such as stress, fear, anxiety, trauma. Right. Increasing positive emotions like gratitude, joy, peace, love, things like increasing your spiritual connection, practice, whatever that may be for you. You know, that could be a prayer that's associated with a particular religion or could be something secular, like running or gardening, or meditating.

So all of these sort of mental, emotional, spiritual practices in encompass a big part of their life and their day once they get on to this path of commission. So it's it's hugely, hugely important. I just can't stress it enough what I sort of geek out on as a researcher, obviously, I geek out when they're all saying the same thing. Right? That's as as a researcher, I love seeing my findings replicated interview after interview. But what I really enjoy is finding the clinical trials that are being done in universities around the world right now that prove that these mental, emotional techniques or lifestyle changes actually impact your immune system, right?

A six week course on Mbsr mindfulness based stress reduction has been shown to significantly increase natural killer cells in your immune system. I don't have a lab that I'm working at, right? I'm I'm an independent qualitative researcher. So I'm doing, you know, in-depth interviews like this. But there are people out there putting people through an mbsr course and then having them spit in a cup and give it, get their blood, draw, blood drawn to measure their natural killer cells and to know that their what they're finding is that this mental and emotional intervention, which is safe, pretty much free, because the more classes offered for free by the hospital just takes a little bit of time and effort for you.

And the purpose of it is to reduce stress and relax. Right? So we're not asking people to like, you know, climb up mount Everest backwards, right? We're asking them to spend an hour every Tuesday doing something that leads them to a relaxed state, and to know that that helps your immune system fight cancer by increasing the number of natural killer cells in your body. I just find that I find that incredible. And that's where, you know, the doctors that you mentioned who are on the frontlines and doing this integrative work with the people who are given months to live at traditional hospital science, right, with the people who are running these larger clinical trials.

They're 10 to 20 years behind those frontline doctors. But we're we're getting there, right. The clinical trials are starting to show that these mental, emotional shifts, right. Turning on your parasympathetic nervous system, getting to a meditative, calm state, activating the areas of your brain related to compassion, quieting the ones related to revenge and anger. These don't just make you a happier and more peaceful person. These increase your white blood cells in your natural killer cells and your and increase your telomere length.

So physiologically, you are helping your body fight cancer cells by doing a mental emotional practice. And science is, really on the tip of the iceberg of being able to prove that. And I love that. I love when you tell me, you know, telomeres were only discovered, you know, a couple decades ago. Right? This is something we didn't even know existed, according to science. Well, now we know it exists. And now we know that practices like meditation and trauma release can lengthen telomeres, which then, is correlated with decreased risk of cancer.

So yeah, the science is just is just coming right behind these radical remission cases and saying, yep, what you what you did and what you did. Bailey we now know why it works. And and I find that really inspiring. It's an exciting future to dream of and hope of that. You know that when someone has a cancer diagnosis, the modern medical approach, the modern medicine approach is going to be implementing all ten of these factors, right? It's like, hey, look, we know this and this and this and this meditation and more sleep.

And, you know, reduction from exposure to, emfs and eating, you know, plant based, organic, food, all these aspects that you're seeing these commonalities exercise, all these things, that becomes your subscription, that becomes your prescription. Right. Right along with the low dose chemo or along with the you know, the iPPt therapy. It's not that those types of, you know, sort of stronger medicines aren't going to have a place, right? A new therapy is is going to be fantastic. It already is. And that's where the future of cancer care is.

It's immunotherapy. But we already have doctors in Australia and over in Scandinavia who are literally prescribing exercise for their cancer patients. And they say, okay, great, you're done with your chemo. Great. Now go over to our gym and this is your trainer Joe, and he's going to run you through your exercise routine. And it's actually required. Right. It's just as much of a requirement as the chemo they just received. Because the studies have shown if you do gentle exercise right after chemo, it actually helps your body flush out the toxins of chemo while opening up the cancer cells to be, you know, harmed by the chemo or pumped by the chemo.

So we, you know, we're starting to see this and it's really exciting. You know, I look forward to the day when after a cancer surgery, someone isn't delivered a plate of, you know, potato chips and potato salad and a hamburger from the hospital kitchen, you know, like, let's hope that that the day of that food changing happens sooner rather than later. But I do believe that there's a bright future ahead of us with cancer care, where these ten healing factors are absolutely prescribed and encouraged by your doctor.

And hopefully the integrative cancer centers that we have across the country that are part of these main hospitals will, be able to say, yep, come, you know, come, come do our ten week program and we'll teach you these ten factors or something like that. I hope I hope that happens. So you have a new book coming out, called radical Hope. Right. So this is an extension out. Oh it's out, oh it's out now. Yes. It came out during Covid which was a very strange time for bit to come out. But yes. My, my second baby's here. Radical.

Hope you can see it. Yeah. It came out in April 2020. So, like I said, a very strange time, but, it's out and I hope that people enjoy it because it what it does is it updates people on the six years that

Why Healing Starts With Purpose and Forgiveness 22:00

passed between from commission coming out and then radical hope coming out. And those six years have been pretty important in terms of integrative cancer. I know you've been in this field for a long time, too, Nathan. So you've seen sort of the explosion of immunotherapy and also the rise of, studies that are studying, you know, criteria that we didn't study 20 years ago. Right? Telomere length, natural killer cells, you know, levels, serotonin levels, things, oxytocin levels. We just have the technology now to really measure the effects of lifestyle changes.

You know, like, you know, increasing social support. That's something that, you know, wasn't necessarily hard science 20 years ago. But now that we can measure someone's biology before and after a social support group, we now can measure the effects of that, social interaction. So. So yeah. So radical Hope is a follow up book, to radical Remission. It brings people up to speed on all the wonderful new studies that have come out from my colleagues in integrative medicine. But I would say, just as importantly, it lets people know about the over 600 cases that came into my website since radical remission came out.

And I, I'm so thrilled to know that radical missions are happening even more often than I predicted. Right? You know, I had I had, you know, a tenfold jump in radical remission cases that I was collecting when my first book came out. And it's not like it's not as if my book came out. And then everybody followed those nine things, and then they had radical remissions. I mean, it doesn't first of all, doesn't happen that quickly, nor is my art, my books meant to be prescriptive. Like, this is how you have a radical remission.

Rather, I'm just studying these people, right? I'm studying them and reporting on them. So to know that by simply publicizing the phenomenon of radical remission, I, my own website, saw tenfold increase in the number of cases. I was like, okay, these radical admissions were out there just sitting there silently and nobody was, you know, listening to them or saying, I want to study you. And so all it sort of took was my first book and my website to be like, I want to study you. And then they came flooding in.

So you get you're giving a voice, you're giving a voice and a platform to people, which is so important. Yeah. Because because we have we have, we have strength in numbers. We have scientific strength. Right. It's for me, I'm excited because now I just have more cases to study. I mean, we we've collected, on average, 120 a year for the last six years, and typically only 20 cases a year are published in medical journals. So we're we're collecting six times the amount of cases that are men. And published in medical journals.

And it's because people are finally talking about it and they're like, oh, I had that happen to my cousin. And then people are like, really? That happened to your cousin? Well, you should he should tell Kelly his story. And so I, I hear from a lot of people and I like that. So, so someone tuning in says, I want to be, you know, one of your radical remission cases. I want to be someone that can submit to your website. What would you tell them? I would first say, I'm not a medical doctor, so I do not give them medical advice.

And I just I have to say that, but no, truly, I am not just the position that I am in and like to be in is I'm not trying to tell people how to heal. I am trying to really observe and analyze and study the people who have healed and then to tell the whole world what I found, because I think it's interesting and I think we have a lot to learn from them. Whether we should copycat them immediately and expect the same results, it's definitely not right. You know, whether or not you you embrace these ten healing factors should be up to you and in consultation with your doctor, what's being said.

So there's also the disclaimers that being said, these ten healing factors that have emerged from my research are completely free. Most of them are safe and studies have clinical studies have shown that they significantly improve the immune system. So what that means is these are things anyone can start doing right now and they can't hurt. And they might help and they might help a lot. They might help your body even have a radical remission. But even if they don't, they're going to strengthen your immune system.

And that's just that's a good thing. That's a if you are interested in strengthening your immune system, then you should do these ten things. So knowing all of that, you know, these are ten things that I've brought into my life as someone who's helping to prevent cancer. Many of the people that I study in my interviews with them, they embrace these ten healing factors intensively, got to remission, and then they sort of got loosey goosey and backed off of them and stopped doing, and let the stress come back in and let the donuts come back in and, you know, stop doing these ten things.

And then they had a recurrence. And then they turned up the gas again on these ten factors, and then it went away again, which might sound scary to some people listening, but it actually gives me a lot of hope. And it calms me down to know that these things are like the the brake and the gas pedal. So if you want to put the brakes on cancer, you just put the gas pedal on these ten factors. And if you want to, you know, let cancer or other diseases thrive in your body, then you take off the gas pedal on these ten factors and watch what happens. It's a choice.

So it kind of when when you have the knowledge, it does become a choice at that point. Yeah. Yeah. It's sort of like I know better now not to eat the way I used to eat. And I know better now not to go a week without exercising. I'm not saying it's always easy. I mean, I have two young kids and, you know, Covid lockdown for all these months has been stressful and has tested a lot of my, my habits and the routines that I've gotten into. So it's not always easy, but but what I would say to someone is consider doing some or all of these ten healing factors, not necessarily because it's definitely going to cure cancer, because we can't guarantee that, but because what we can guarantee is that it's going to strengthen your immune system.

And scientific studies have proven that. So, you know, it's just it's just sort of common sense. And then the next thing everybody asks me is like, well, okay, which one do I start with? And that's always an interesting question. I'd be curious to know how you'd answer that. Nathan. You know, so, you know, the physical, our diet, exercise and then herbs and supplements and then the the seven mental emotional are increasing positive emotions releasing suppressed emotions, following your intuition, deepening your spiritual connection.

Practice increasing social support and having strong reasons for living. I think I got all of them. So okay, there's ten. Which do you start with? Right. Most people that I study, whether they're kind of conscious of it or not, they start with strong reasons for living because if you don't have your strong reasons for living clear in your head, it's going to be a lot harder to completely overhaul your diet or to start exercising every day when you have an exercise in ten years. So getting sorted to your why?

Why do I want to live? Why do I want to heal? Why do I want to, bring balance back into my body in my life? Having that why become sort of like your cheerleader? Like, okay, you can do this because x y, and Z. So that's often one that I encourage people to start with is just just, you know, take a quiet night, light a candle, get quiet, put on some nice music, and just start journaling about why you want to live in this body for a long time. And once you have that question for for a long time, for a long time, well, we're all going to die, right?

That's the one. Inevitability of this human experience is that we will leave these bodies. And so how much longer do you want to be in this body, and what would you like to do when you're in it? And, I think that's a good starting place because you can do that. And the night of diagnosis, you know, the diet can start after the grocery store run and the supplements can start after you've talked to a qualified health professional and, and decided which supplements or, you know, I.V. infusions you need.

But, you know, the one thing that can start right away is just getting in touch with your. Why. I think that's probably, I don't think I would have said that at first, but as you explained it, I think that's the I agree, that's the most important place to start. That's the place I started,

Integrative Cancer Care and the Future of Treatment 31:00

subconsciously, you know, I went through I had I didn't have cancer. I had a really rough childhood, went through a lot of addiction, was homeless at 15, was really hardcore, addicted to drugs and alcohol, in and out of jail. And a lot of totally lost in my life, you know, mentally, emotionally depressed, physically deteriorating. You know, nobody thought, myself included, that I was even going to live to 18 years old. And, I at, at that time when I was 18, that's kind of what started sparking my own personal transformation was like, what else is possible?

Like, I'm so sick and tired of living this way. I'm so sick and tired of being sick. I'm so sick and tired of being depressed and angry. I'm so sick and tired of not having energy and feeling like crap all the time. But I didn't know anything else was possible. You know, I just didn't. I didn't have a lot of great, influence around me at certain things. It was, you know, hanging around with a lot of people were all doing the same stuff, making a lot of bad choices. And, I had some beautiful people come into my life, you know, and I love my parents to death, and they did the best they could.

You know, I just had to go through that experience as a child. You know? I believe I really needed that to help me become who I am today and do the work I'm able to do today. So the great relationship with my parents now. But I ended up living with my friends family for maybe about a year. There were beautiful people that ate really healthy. They were doing most of these things you're talking about. They meditated and they listened to classical music and they exercise and they, you know, we're loving kind, compassionate people that, you know, ate organic food.

And so just being in that environment gave me this awakening, this opportunity to go, wow, you know, maybe there's something better out there. And once I got clear that, like, I wanted a better life, I wanted to feel good, I wanted to be healthy. I wanted to have meaning and purpose in my life. Everything started changing. And what's interesting about all of these ten factors you're talking about, like I do all those, you know, basically every day. But I didn't start doing them every day. It was you.

Once you go down that path, you say it's that deeper underlying why that that guide you to the next and the next and the next and the next. For me, it started with meditation and then it went down the path of nutrition and diet and supplements and cleansing and raw food and so on and so forth. And then back to deeper spiritual practices and meditation and emotional healing and and now it's like I just do all of it all the time. But, that's 15 years later, you know? Yeah. Yeah, it it's exactly it's not something you can very well, I should say very few people can just overnight start doing all these ten things, you know, full force.

And I actually love that you started with meditation and then got into diet because a lot of people do start with sort of, you know, diet supplements, exercise because it's physical. It's tangible. Right? Like, you know, you're lifting weights, you know, you're eating salad. It's it's something that's just so you can you can check it off the list, okay, I did it. Whereas, you know, forgiving your parents, releasing the trauma of such a terrible childhood. And I'm so sorry you had to endure that, but that takes longer.

It it's not as easy to do, and it's not as easy to know if it's done, but I think it's it's a beautiful example that you did start with meditation and something more mental emotional after your your why and then moved into the physical. Yeah. Talking about forgiveness. I mean it is one of the most powerful mental emotional I would even say spiritual practices we can do. Right. Because holding on to resentment, holding on to. And there's a lot of scientific evidence around this as well, what the practice of forgiveness does for enhancing the immune system, for activating the parasympathetic nervous system, for, you know, when you connect to the, the, emotions of compassion and forgiveness and love and kindness, you literally are turning on your healing capacity of your body.

We know this. They've known this for thousands of years. Our ancestors have. We're just now starting to catch up our science is like, oh yeah, what those guys knew 5000 years ago. That's true today, right? You know, scientists are like, wow, a six week anger management course can, you know, reduce cortisol levels significantly and increase white blood cell cams. And the yogis are like, yeah, yeah, yeah, we've known that forever. But, well, just speaking on forgiveness since you brought that up. Forgiving your parents, like I remember.

And this was really early on in kind of my my own journey. I was actually. So I didn't talk to my mom for probably a few years because I had a lot of resentment, a lot of anger, guilt, you know, different shame, different feelings I didn't even know I had. But I knew somehow, intuitively, I just nobody told me I had to do it. It wasn't. It was just like I knew intuitively I had to forgive her. And I was on the phone with her, I think for the first time in probably 3 or 4 years. And I was in California.

She was in Montana. And I remember telling her that I forgive her on the phone. And it was this, I literally heard this. I heard this, this snap, like this, explosion. It was like, a firework almost, and I could feel it in my body. And I heard it, in my brain, wherever I heard it through the phone. I don't know where it came from, but it was like this huge release that happened. And since then, that single, it's like, I still remember. That's so clear. That was probably 19 years old. It it opened me up to releasing so many of those repressed emotions I've since had to do, you know, more forgiveness work.

And I think that's, you know, with other people and other experiences, but that that one with my mom was like one of the most powerful things. And that's the thing about forgiveness, right? You don't have to, forgive somebody in person or even on the phone because forgiveness is really about you. It's like we forgive others because we're the ones holding on to, those those negative emotions. And through forgiving, we actually let go of those negative emotions that allow us to heal and to be free from it.

Yeah. That's beautiful. Releasing suppressed emotions is often the of all the tension healing factors. It's usually the one people have the hardest time doing because it's just it's so painful. Right? It's it's hard to go back to the painful past or to those moments where you were hurt or you were scared. But you know, everything we know from from alternative healing modalities. You know, I know you studied qigong and you've worked with Master Mean Tango. So this idea of chee and black chee, and what happens when we're holding on to a traumatic event or years of neglect or, you know, anger, which underneath of it is always, you know, sadness or fear, right?

When you're holding on to these emotions that people often say, it weighs me down. I felt like I was, you know, walking around for years with this weight on my shoulders. Well, in, in qigong and Chinese medicine, that actually that that metaphor makes sense because the idea of this stuck resentment or stuck in anger

Radical Hope, More Cases, and Closing Thoughts 38:30

that we need to forgive and release is stuck like a ball of stuck me that imagine like a weight, like a ball of weight that you're walking around with. And when you can figure out a way to release, then that that she that energy dissipates and finally leaves your body. Right? And so you are lighter from an energetic perspective. And again, this is a theory. This isn't my theory. This is, you know, the theory of Chinese medicine for thousands and thousands of years. I think that in 50 years we'll be able to measure qi and see it with, you know, special, scientific instruments.

But for the moment, we just have 3000 years of texts and theory and. Yeah, I mean, speaking on that, there is a lot of new emerging science that actually can start. It has been able to in machines that can actually measure, you measure energetic field. Right. And they don't call it Qi in the science world. It just energy. They call the bio field bio field. Exactly. But you know Qi bio field your energy field minefield heart field, whatever. I mean, they can measure the energy of your heart, miles away actually, which is really fascinating.

That's for another time. Nother conversation, but that's you need to interview the people at heart and at the Institute. They're the ones who know all about that. Yeah. I think Howard Martin, for a lot of the work we do, because heart math, the work they do around that is incredible. It's incredible. Yeah. Everyone listening should go look up the Heart Math Institute and just read some of the abstracts of the studies they've done, because it'll blow your mind. Yeah, well, I just want to say, you know, thank you so much for the work you do.

It's like, this is so instrumental in helping people have more hope, more realization that, wow, this is possible. And as you said, it's not a prescription. Like do all these ten things you're going to cure cancer. We would, you know, never say that in any of our interviews, but what I love, what you've done is saying, look, all these ten things are commonalities between people who have overcome cancer or other chronic diseases. And these are scientifically validated to support your body and its own healing mechanisms, which is huge.

So you have nothing to lose. Let's just start doing one or 2 or 5 or all ten of these things right now. And I know your worst thing that happens is you get a stronger immune system. You know, but I'm so glad you feel better. You're happier. And you have a strong immune system. You know what's there to lose? So I do want to encourage people to go pick up a copy of Kelly's book, radical Hope. You can go to radical remission.com. Book is radical hope. Also, get a copy of your first book, Radical Remission.

There's, you know, some things you're going to learn in both of them. Kelly, again, I just yeah. Thank you so much for all the great work. Thank you for sharing all this with us. This was super, informative and hopefully very inspiring for everyone tuning in. Awesome. Well, I hope so. Rad. Permission survivors continue to amaze me and inspire me every day. And, I just want to remind your listeners that radical permissions have happened for every single type of cancer. So if you're out there and you think that it's hopeless, I would say there's at least one other person who has overcome this in a in a way that totally shocked their doctors.

So you could be number two. Wow. That's that's incredible to hear. And you're just continuing to gather more and more, cases through your website. And if somebody here know somebody go to radical remission and, and or tell that person to submit their story on her website, which I love, what you've done is you've made it like a community forum. It's a place for people to engage, submit, to learn. So and I want to thank everyone for tuning in to the Conquering Cancer Summit. Please share this with friends and family.

Together, we truly can make a difference for the future of humanity in ending the cancer pandemic. Thank you and I wish you ultimate health and happiness. Be well.