The Veteran Who Built a Free Mental Health Service with Chris Sanders and Dr Debs Eastwood

Introduction and Counseling Mission 0:00

Welcome to the Wellness [music] on Tap Welcome to the Wellness [music] on Tap podcast with your host Dr. Debs podcast with your host Dr. Debs podcast with your host Dr. Debs Eastwood. Eastwood. Eastwood. >> So, you've had an interesting >> So, you've had an interesting >> So, you've had an interesting journey to get to what you're doing now, journey to get to what you're doing now, journey to get to what you're doing now, haven't you? haven't you? haven't you? >> Yes. Just a little >> Yes. Just a little >> Yes. Just a little >> just a little tiny tiny tiny weeny >> just a little tiny tiny tiny weeny >> just a little tiny tiny tiny weeny little bit. [snorts and clears throat] little bit. [snorts and clears throat] little bit. [snorts and clears throat] >> And what you're doing now is you and >> And what you're doing now is you and >> And what you're doing now is you and another lovely lady, Rosanna, are another lovely lady, Rosanna, are another lovely lady, Rosanna, are offering counseling services.

offering counseling services. offering counseling services. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> That's where we're going to end up. >> That's where we're going to end up. >> That's where we're going to end up. >> Okay. Where is the beginning of this >> Okay. Where is the beginning of this >> Okay. Where is the beginning of this journey for you?

Leaving the Forces and PTSD Diagnosis 0:30

journey for you? journey for you? >> Um the journey for myself started after >> Um the journey for myself started after >> Um the journey for myself started after I'd left the forces. I'd left the forces. I'd left the forces. Uh I left in 2004. Um and I was trying Uh I left in 2004. Um and I was trying Uh I left in 2004. Um and I was trying to start my own business at the time, to start my own business at the time, to start my own business at the time, but that um wasn't coming to fruition. but that um wasn't coming to fruition.

but that um wasn't coming to fruition. Um and I was getting angry all the time Um and I was getting angry all the time Um and I was getting angry all the time and depressed and I'd started drinking a and depressed and I'd started drinking a and depressed and I'd started drinking a lot more often. Um, but the an the anger lot more often. Um, but the an the anger lot more often. Um, but the an the anger was always there and I didn't realize was always there and I didn't realize was always there and I didn't realize where it was coming from until I had a where it was coming from until I had a where it was coming from until I had a massive massive breakdown, which massive massive breakdown, which massive massive breakdown, which unfortunately ended the relationship at unfortunately ended the relationship at unfortunately ended the relationship at the time. Um, and then about a month or the time. Um, and then about a month or the time. Um, and then about a month or so after the breakup of the so after the breakup of the so after the breakup of the relationship, I went to speak to a relationship, I went to speak to a relationship, I went to speak to a doctor about all the issues that I've doctor about all the issues that I've doctor about all the issues that I've been having since leaving the forces.

been having since leaving the forces. been having since leaving the forces. Um, and he diagnosed me with Um, and he diagnosed me with Um, and he diagnosed me with post-traumatic stress disorder. H post-traumatic stress disorder. H post-traumatic stress disorder. H >> not a huge surprise in hindsight, I'm >> not a huge surprise in hindsight, I'm >> not a huge surprise in hindsight, I'm sure. sure. sure. >> No, no. I mean, I'd heard about it, but >> No, no. I mean, I'd heard about it, but >> No, no. I mean, I'd heard about it, but it was one of those things that it's it was one of those things that it's it was one of those things that it's like, oh, it's it's a myth. It's not me.

like, oh, it's it's a myth. It's not me. like, oh, it's it's a myth. It's not me. I I don't suffer with things like that. I I don't suffer with things like that. I I don't suffer with things like that. [snorts] I mean, physically, up until [snorts] I mean, physically, up until [snorts] I mean, physically, up until recently, I've never been ill. And I had recently, I've never been ill. And I had recently, I've never been ill. And I had all the childhood diseases, but I never all the childhood diseases, but I never all the childhood diseases, but I never got ill. And to be told that you've got got ill. And to be told that you've got got ill. And to be told that you've got a a mental disorder, it was quite a a mental disorder, it was quite a a mental disorder, it was quite shocking. Um, shocking. Um, shocking. Um, >> and it was scary to think that >> and it was scary to think that >> and it was scary to think that everything that was going on was because everything that was going on was because everything that was going on was because of stuff, the trauma that had happened of stuff, the trauma that had happened of stuff, the trauma that had happened in the past, obviously.

in the past, obviously. in the past, obviously. >> Yeah. Cuz you've got to be fit and >> Yeah. Cuz you've got to be fit and >> Yeah. Cuz you've got to be fit and healthy to be in the forces, haven't healthy to be in the forces, haven't healthy to be in the forces, haven't you? you? you? >> Yeah. But I mean, the

Military Culture, Trauma, and Support Gaps 2:02

>> Yeah. But I mean, the >> Yeah. But I mean, the I think during the time in the forces, I think during the time in the forces, I think during the time in the forces, you kept that busy that you don't even you kept that busy that you don't even you kept that busy that you don't even think about it. You don't get time to think about it. You don't get time to think about it. You don't get time to think about it. you're always on the think about it. you're always on the think about it. you're always on the move or if you're on leave, you're move or if you're on leave, you're move or if you're on leave, you're always partying hard. That that was the always partying hard. That that was the always partying hard. That that was the thing. Work hard, play hard, right?

thing. Work hard, play hard, right? thing. Work hard, play hard, right? >> Um that was the mentality that we had. >> Um that was the mentality that we had. >> Um that was the mentality that we had. Um and we never discussed things. It was Um and we never discussed things. It was Um and we never discussed things. It was like feelings and things like that were like feelings and things like that were like feelings and things like that were never discussed. Um and then after you never discussed. Um and then after you never discussed. Um and then after you leave, there's no sort of help.

leave, there's no sort of help. leave, there's no sort of help. >> Um not as much as there is now. Um but >> Um not as much as there is now. Um but >> Um not as much as there is now. Um but there was there was a little bit of help there was there was a little bit of help there was there was a little bit of help but you had to really look for it. Um but you had to really look for it. Um but you had to really look for it. Um and having that having those issues and and having that having those issues and and having that having those issues and not having anyone to talk to it causes not having anyone to talk to it causes not having anyone to talk to it causes well as I say it caused a massive well as I say it caused a massive well as I say it caused a massive breakdown.

breakdown. breakdown. >> Yeah. Yeah. I'm not surprising you you >> Yeah. Yeah. I'm not surprising you you >> Yeah. Yeah. I'm not surprising you you you're one of many in that sense, aren't you're one of many in that sense, aren't you're one of many in that sense, aren't you? Sadly. you? Sadly. you? Sadly. >> Yeah. I mean the the the numbers are >> Yeah. I mean the the the numbers are >> Yeah. I mean the the the numbers are increasing all the time. I mean more increasing all the time. I mean more increasing all the time. I mean more more recent years you've got the Afghan more recent years you've got the Afghan more recent years you've got the Afghan wars but people seem to get forget the wars but people seem to get forget the wars but people seem to get forget the guys that were in the fog clans Northern guys that were in the fog clans Northern guys that were in the fog clans Northern Ireland Bosnia Kosovo the those sort of Ireland Bosnia Kosovo the those sort of Ireland Bosnia Kosovo the those sort of wars seem to have been put to the side wars seem to have been put to the side wars seem to have been put to the side um and it's more about the modern day um and it's more about the modern day um and it's more about the modern day conflicts but it's the older guys that conflicts but it's the older guys that conflicts but it's the older guys that are now realizing that a lot of their are now realizing that a lot of their are now realizing that a lot of their issues are due to the fact that it's issues are due to the fact that it's issues are due to the fact that it's trauma related.

Homelessness, Budgeting, and Recovery 3:28

trauma related. trauma related. >> Yeah. I mean, one of those wars in >> Yeah. I mean, one of those wars in >> Yeah. I mean, one of those wars in particular, this will let you know particular, this will let you know particular, this will let you know exactly when it was. I was going out to exactly when it was. I was going out to exactly when it was. I was going out to see my cousin in Sydney and I flew on see my cousin in Sydney and I flew on see my cousin in Sydney and I flew on Yuguslav Airlines.

Yuguslav Airlines. Yuguslav Airlines. >> Yeah. Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. Yeah. [laughter] In 1994. So I and the reason that it In 1994. So I and the reason that it In 1994. So I and the reason that it really sticks in my head um one amongst really sticks in my head um one amongst really sticks in my head um one amongst many is that there was a long layover many is that there was a long layover many is that there was a long layover in Yugoslavia, which is obviously a in Yugoslavia, which is obviously a in Yugoslavia, which is obviously a relatively short flight from here relatively short flight from here relatively short flight from here considering what I got left to do.

considering what I got left to do. considering what I got left to do. [snorts] [snorts] [snorts] And the seating was awful in the And the seating was awful in the And the seating was awful in the airport. And I found a set of stairs and airport. And I found a set of stairs and airport. And I found a set of stairs and I wandered down these stairs and there I wandered down these stairs and there I wandered down these stairs and there was, you know, comfy sofas a little bit was, you know, comfy sofas a little bit was, you know, comfy sofas a little bit like this.

like this. like this. Oh, brilliant. So, I went and sat on one Oh, brilliant. So, I went and sat on one Oh, brilliant. So, I went and sat on one of those sofas. of those sofas. of those sofas. I think I kicked my shoes off and put I think I kicked my shoes off and put I think I kicked my shoes off and put the feet up on the rrook sack. the feet up on the rrook sack. the feet up on the rrook sack. Next thing I know, Next thing I know, Next thing I know, I'm asleep and there's a guy I'm asleep and there's a guy I'm asleep and there's a guy full bulletproof vest with a big machine full bulletproof vest with a big machine full bulletproof vest with a big machine gun proddding me with this machine gun gun proddding me with this machine gun gun proddding me with this machine gun [laughter] to wake me up. I mean, I was [laughter] to wake me up. I mean, I was [laughter] to wake me up. I mean, I was 25.

25. 25. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> That scared the living [ __ ] out of me. >> That scared the living [ __ ] out of me. >> That scared the living [ __ ] out of me. Um, you know, and obviously neither of Um, you know, and obviously neither of Um, you know, and obviously neither of us could speak. us could speak. us could speak. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. I'm going >> Yeah. I'm going >> Yeah. I'm going >> Yeah. [snorts] >> Yeah. [snorts] >> Yeah. [snorts] >> But so that was as close as I got.

>> But so that was as close as I got. >> But so that was as close as I got. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> I [snorts] mean that must have been >> I [snorts] mean that must have been >> I [snorts] mean that must have been scary for you in that sense. I mean it scary for you in that sense. I mean it scary for you in that sense. I mean it was because you know I knew it it hadn't was because you know I knew it it hadn't was because you know I knew it it hadn't broken out at that point but whilst I broken out at that point but whilst I broken out at that point but whilst I was there cuz I was there for a couple was there cuz I was there for a couple was there cuz I was there for a couple of months uh 3 months of months uh 3 months of months uh 3 months I could hear about it on the news and I could hear about it on the news and I could hear about it on the news and I'm like oh great so I'm going to fly I'm like oh great so I'm going to fly I'm like oh great so I'm going to fly back into a country at war. marvelous back into a country at war. marvelous back into a country at war. marvelous and so I'm glad it didn't happen on the and so I'm glad it didn't happen on the and so I'm glad it didn't happen on the return journey or something. [laughter] return journey or something. [laughter] return journey or something. [laughter] >> That would have had a different >> That would have had a different >> That would have had a different connotation altogether. But you know connotation altogether. But you know connotation altogether. But you know that is trivia. It's nothing. I'm that is trivia. It's nothing. I'm that is trivia. It's nothing. I'm laughing about it as to what you know laughing about it as to what you know laughing about it as to what you know yourself and your colleagues.

yourself and your colleagues. yourself and your colleagues. >> I mean a lot of the time >> I mean a lot of the time >> I mean a lot of the time >> while when the things have happened we >> while when the things have happened we >> while when the things have happened we we have that mentality to deal with it. we have that mentality to deal with it. we have that mentality to deal with it. it it becomes like a a dark humor u it it becomes like a a dark humor u it it becomes like a a dark humor u while you're in there but it's as I say while you're in there but it's as I say while you're in there but it's as I say it's once you've lost that brotherhood it's once you've lost that brotherhood it's once you've lost that brotherhood once you're out and you're left to your once you're out and you're left to your once you're out and you're left to your own devices and they do leave you to own devices and they do leave you to own devices and they do leave you to your own devices your own devices your own devices >> that's when the suffering starts >> that's when the suffering starts >> that's when the suffering starts >> um I mean some guys do stay in touch uh >> um I mean some guys do stay in touch uh >> um I mean some guys do stay in touch uh a lot of us do drift apart but then come a lot of us do drift apart but then come a lot of us do drift apart but then come together for remembrance Sunday together for remembrance Sunday together for remembrance Sunday >> and even on remembrance Sunday it's like >> and even on remembrance Sunday it's like >> and even on remembrance Sunday it's like we've never been apart But it's the dark we've never been apart But it's the dark we've never been apart But it's the dark humor stuff.

humor stuff. humor stuff. >> It's never actually, >> It's never actually, >> It's never actually, >> we never actually dealt with the issues >> we never actually dealt with the issues >> we never actually dealt with the issues >> as and when they happened. >> as and when they happened. >> as and when they happened. >> Um I mean I'm not sure what it was like >> Um I mean I'm not sure what it was like >> Um I mean I'm not sure what it was like it's like these days, but I can't seem it's like these days, but I can't seem it's like these days, but I can't seem to see that it's changed that much.

to see that it's changed that much. to see that it's changed that much. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> so when was it that you came out? >> so when was it that you came out? >> so when was it that you came out? >> Uh I left in 2004. >> Uh I left in 2004. >> Uh I left in 2004. >> 2004. >> 2004. >> 2004. >> There's potentially plenty of time for >> There's potentially plenty of time for >> There's potentially plenty of time for it to change, but like you say, that it to change, but like you say, that it to change, but like you say, that doesn't necessarily mean it has, does doesn't necessarily mean it has, does doesn't necessarily mean it has, does it?

it? it? >> No. No. I mean the the There was a study >> No. No. I mean the the There was a study >> No. No. I mean the the There was a study that was done a few years ago um with I that was done a few years ago um with I that was done a few years ago um with I mean as you know I was homeless on and mean as you know I was homeless on and mean as you know I was homeless on and off for seven years um there was a study off for seven years um there was a study off for seven years um there was a study done and it turned out that like 80% of done and it turned out that like 80% of done and it turned out that like 80% of the homeless living on the streets of the homeless living on the streets of the homeless living on the streets of London are actually ex forces London are actually ex forces London are actually ex forces um and it's the we come out we get into um and it's the we come out we get into um and it's the we come out we get into jobs civies don't understand the sense jobs civies don't understand the sense jobs civies don't understand the sense of humor complaints get made guys lose of humor complaints get made guys lose of humor complaints get made guys lose the jobs lose the houses and and it's the jobs lose the houses and and it's the jobs lose the houses and and it's it's a sad state of affairs I I The it's a sad state of affairs I I The it's a sad state of affairs I I The veterans do need the support and help.

veterans do need the support and help. veterans do need the support and help. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> There needs to be >> There needs to be >> There needs to be debriefing debriefing debriefing and [snorts] support to rebuild. and [snorts] support to rebuild. and [snorts] support to rebuild. >> Yeah. Yeah. And so to rehabilitate into >> Yeah. Yeah. And so to rehabilitate into >> Yeah. Yeah. And so to rehabilitate into normal civilian life. Um, another one of normal civilian life. Um, another one of normal civilian life. Um, another one of the reasons the veterans seem to suffer the reasons the veterans seem to suffer the reasons the veterans seem to suffer is while you're in the forces, is while you're in the forces, is while you're in the forces, everything's paid for. You get your wage everything's paid for. You get your wage everything's paid for. You get your wage at the end of the month, that's yours.

at the end of the month, that's yours. at the end of the month, that's yours. You're not taught how to budget. Um, so You're not taught how to budget. Um, so You're not taught how to budget. Um, so you're not taught about your rent, your you're not taught about your rent, your you're not taught about your rent, your council tax, your work bills, your gas council tax, your work bills, your gas council tax, your work bills, your gas rays, your electric bills. You're not rays, your electric bills. You're not rays, your electric bills. You're not taught about your overheads. It I mean, taught about your overheads. It I mean, taught about your overheads. It I mean, this was when I left. Again, I can't say this was when I left. Again, I can't say this was when I left. Again, I can't say what it's like today. Um, what it's like today. Um, what it's like today. Um, [clears throat] [clears throat] [clears throat] but your resettlement course uh was but your resettlement course uh was but your resettlement course uh was whatever company at the time was doing a whatever company at the time was doing a whatever company at the time was doing a lot of recruiting. That's where your lot of recruiting. That's where your lot of recruiting. That's where your resettlement course usually veered resettlement course usually veered resettlement course usually veered towards.

towards. towards. >> So, not biased at all then? >> So, not biased at all then? >> So, not biased at all then? >> No. [laughter] >> No. [laughter] >> No. [laughter] No. Um I mean when I when I I was due to No. Um I mean when I when I I was due to No. Um I mean when I when I I was due to come out in 2000 but due to personal come out in 2000 but due to personal come out in 2000 but due to personal circumstances I ended up staying in and circumstances I ended up staying in and circumstances I ended up staying in and at the time it was building computers at the time it was building computers at the time it was building computers and MSTOS programming. So I went and did and MSTOS programming. So I went and did and MSTOS programming. So I went and did the resettlement course for that. Um the resettlement course for that. Um the resettlement course for that. Um but a lot of people were getting into it but a lot of people were getting into it but a lot of people were getting into it at that early stage cuz home PCs were at that early stage cuz home PCs were at that early stage cuz home PCs were becoming more fashionable. um laptops becoming more fashionable. um laptops becoming more fashionable. um laptops were still were just coming into were still were just coming into were still were just coming into fruition for households as well. Um so fruition for households as well. Um so fruition for households as well. Um so it was a big thing then and as I said it was a big thing then and as I said it was a big thing then and as I said due to personal circumstances due to personal circumstances due to personal circumstances um I ended up staying in um I ended up staying in um I ended up staying in >> uh but over the years it's like the guys >> uh but over the years it's like the guys >> uh but over the years it's like the guys have been veered off into resettlement have been veered off into resettlement have been veered off into resettlement and then it's like how to write a CV and and then it's like how to write a CV and and then it's like how to write a CV and a covering letter. There's none. There's a covering letter. There's none. There's a covering letter. There's none. There's no They've got the life skills. They no They've got the life skills. They no They've got the life skills. They know how to look after themselves. They know how to look after themselves. They know how to look after themselves. They know how to cook, clean, and stuff like know how to cook, clean, and stuff like know how to cook, clean, and stuff like that, but there's none of the budgeting that, but there's none of the budgeting that, but there's none of the budgeting skills, the important skills that they skills, the important skills that they skills, the important skills that they need to live a life.

need to live a life. need to live a life. >> Yeah. Which >> Yeah. Which >> Yeah. Which bearing in mind what you've just said bearing in mind what you've just said bearing in mind what you've just said about being intermittently homeless, about being intermittently homeless, about being intermittently homeless, >> if you've got no concept of how to run a >> if you've got no concept of how to run a >> if you've got no concept of how to run a household financially, household financially, household financially, >> that's much more likely to happen, isn't >> that's much more likely to happen, isn't >> that's much more likely to happen, isn't it? And that's that's one of the main it? And that's that's one of the main it? And that's that's one of the main reasons I became homeless as well as the reasons I became homeless as well as the reasons I became homeless as well as the the relationship ended because of my the relationship ended because of my the relationship ended because of my breakdown. But again, it was because I I breakdown. But again, it was because I I breakdown. But again, it was because I I couldn't budget and that's why I kept couldn't budget and that's why I kept couldn't budget and that's why I kept becoming homeless over the years is becoming homeless over the years is becoming homeless over the years is because I was never taught.

because I was never taught. because I was never taught. >> Um and even >> Um and even >> Um and even I think seven years before I became sort I think seven years before I became sort I think seven years before I became sort of stable and even then I struggled with of stable and even then I struggled with of stable and even then I struggled with it. Um, but from 2013 to now, it's been it. Um, but from 2013 to now, it's been it. Um, but from 2013 to now, it's been a long hard struggle because it's been a a long hard struggle because it's been a a long hard struggle because it's been a survival. It's like, right, I've got to survival. It's like, right, I've got to survival. It's like, right, I've got to pay this, I've got to pay this, I've got pay this, I've got to pay this, I've got pay this, I've got to pay this, I've got to pay this before I can even think to pay this before I can even think to pay this before I can even think about anything else.

about anything else. about anything else. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um, and it is it's a sad state of >> Um, and it is it's a sad state of >> Um, and it is it's a sad state of affairs to be honest. affairs to be honest. affairs to be honest. >> Yeah. Because what how old were you when >> Yeah. Because what how old were you when >> Yeah. Because what how old were you when you went in? you went in? you went in? >> Uh, I was 18 when I joined. So, I was >> Uh, I was 18 when I joined. So, I was >> Uh, I was 18 when I joined. So, I was going to say most kids are like 17, 18, going to say most kids are like 17, 18, going to say most kids are like 17, 18, 19, aren't they?

19, aren't they? 19, aren't they? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And what average kid of that age knows

Counseling Training and Finding the Right Approach 10:20

>> And what average kid of that age knows >> And what average kid of that age knows how to budget a household? how to budget a household? how to budget a household? >> No. >> No. >> No. >> Cuz it's not taught, is it? >> Cuz it's not taught, is it? >> Cuz it's not taught, is it? >> No. And and it wasn't it wasn't taught >> No. And and it wasn't it wasn't taught >> No. And and it wasn't it wasn't taught growing up, it's like, oh, you need to growing up, it's like, oh, you need to growing up, it's like, oh, you need to save your money. But as a as a teenage save your money. But as a as a teenage save your money. But as a as a teenage kid, it's like, I want to go out with my kid, it's like, I want to go out with my kid, it's like, I want to go out with my mates. I want to go to like the cinema.

mates. I want to go to like the cinema. mates. I want to go to like the cinema. I want to go to um oh just before I was I want to go to um oh just before I was I want to go to um oh just before I was 17 was like I'm going to the pub and 17 was like I'm going to the pub and 17 was like I'm going to the pub and having a slightly pine that I can get having a slightly pine that I can get having a slightly pine that I can get away with and it was that socializing away with and it was that socializing away with and it was that socializing aspect.

aspect. aspect. >> Um so it's like if you didn't if you ran >> Um so it's like if you didn't if you ran >> Um so it's like if you didn't if you ran out of your money you'd still have mom out of your money you'd still have mom out of your money you'd still have mom and dads to go back to. and dads to go back to. and dads to go back to. >> Absolutely. Yeah. >> Absolutely. Yeah. >> Absolutely. Yeah. >> Yeah. So perhaps if proper life skills >> Yeah. So perhaps if proper life skills >> Yeah. So perhaps if proper life skills were taught in school were taught in school were taught in school >> that could help potentially >> that could help potentially >> that could help potentially coming out. I I think I mean it's all coming out. I I think I mean it's all coming out. I I think I mean it's all well and good having maths and English well and good having maths and English well and good having maths and English because the the the general because the the the general because the the the general qualifications that anyone needs to get qualifications that anyone needs to get qualifications that anyone needs to get employment but with the mathematics do employment but with the mathematics do employment but with the mathematics do the budgeting.

the budgeting. the budgeting. >> Yeah. It could easily be fitted into the >> Yeah. It could easily be fitted into the >> Yeah. It could easily be fitted into the curriculum, couldn't it? curriculum, couldn't it? curriculum, couldn't it? >> Yeah. Cuz that's where a lot of people >> Yeah. Cuz that's where a lot of people >> Yeah. Cuz that's where a lot of people fail in life, fail in life, fail in life, >> it's like oh I'm in debt or I'll go and >> it's like oh I'm in debt or I'll go and >> it's like oh I'm in debt or I'll go and get a credit card or I'll go and get a get a credit card or I'll go and get a get a credit card or I'll go and get a loan not realizing that the APR was on loan not realizing that the APR was on loan not realizing that the APR was on the loan they're paying back for 30 odd the loan they're paying back for 30 odd the loan they're paying back for 30 odd years.

years. years. >> Yeah. Um, and it it's that sort of thing >> Yeah. Um, and it it's that sort of thing >> Yeah. Um, and it it's that sort of thing that needs to be put in place. Um, that needs to be put in place. Um, that needs to be put in place. Um, >> I [snorts] mean, I think I've mentioned >> I [snorts] mean, I think I've mentioned >> I [snorts] mean, I think I've mentioned it to you before. It's like everyone's it to you before. It's like everyone's it to you before. It's like everyone's only two bad choices away from being only two bad choices away from being only two bad choices away from being homeless.

homeless. homeless. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> One of them is money. Another one could >> One of them is money. Another one could >> One of them is money. Another one could be drink or relationships. be drink or relationships. be drink or relationships. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Just two bad choices. >> Just two bad choices. >> Just two bad choices. >> Yeah. And we all have those in our >> Yeah. And we all have those in our >> Yeah. And we all have those in our lives. >> Makes you stop and think, doesn't it >> Makes you stop and think, doesn't it really?

really? really? >> Yeah. Um, I mean, look, looking back, >> Yeah. Um, I mean, look, looking back, >> Yeah. Um, I mean, look, looking back, if I'd have had the help that I'm if I'd have had the help that I'm if I'd have had the help that I'm wanting to offer people, wanting to offer people, wanting to offer people, um, I wouldn't have been in the um, I wouldn't have been in the um, I wouldn't have been in the situations I was in. situations I was in. situations I was in. Um, I mean, when I was diagnosed with Um, I mean, when I was diagnosed with Um, I mean, when I was diagnosed with the PTSD, the PTSD, the PTSD, now that was 2 years after I'd actually now that was 2 years after I'd actually now that was 2 years after I'd actually left the forces, left the forces, left the forces, >> right?

>> right? >> right? um from that diagnosis and then being um from that diagnosis and then being um from that diagnosis and then being referred to talking therapies and this referred to talking therapies and this referred to talking therapies and this is 2006 is 2006 is 2006 9 weeks he took me to see the first 9 weeks he took me to see the first 9 weeks he took me to see the first person the first counselor that I'd been person the first counselor that I'd been person the first counselor that I'd been signposted to and within that first signposted to and within that first signposted to and within that first session that counselor tried hypnotizing session that counselor tried hypnotizing session that counselor tried hypnotizing me [cough] and he was like hang on a me [cough] and he was like hang on a me [cough] and he was like hang on a minute where where do you think you're minute where where do you think you're minute where where do you think you're going with this? No, this this isn't going with this? No, this this isn't going with this? No, this this isn't going to work. Um I then went through going to work. Um I then went through going to work. Um I then went through several other counselors. Um C there was several other counselors. Um C there was several other counselors. Um C there was CBT just coming into its fruition uh CBT just coming into its fruition uh CBT just coming into its fruition uh which is widely used in the NHS now that which is widely used in the NHS now that which is widely used in the NHS now that they just started it at that point.

they just started it at that point. they just started it at that point. >> Um psycho dynamic which is dealing with >> Um psycho dynamic which is dealing with >> Um psycho dynamic which is dealing with your childhood traumas and your childhood traumas and your childhood traumas and >> right >> right >> right >> um and then it was a person- centered >> um and then it was a person- centered >> um and then it was a person- centered therapist that I saw. Um, and we we just therapist that I saw. Um, and we we just therapist that I saw. Um, and we we just sat like you and I are having a chat and sat like you and I are having a chat and sat like you and I are having a chat and everything. And then it was like the everything. And then it was like the everything. And then it was like the first hour was done. Went back the next first hour was done. Went back the next first hour was done. Went back the next week. By by the time week six had come, week. By by the time week six had come, week. By by the time week six had come, I'd found out what most of my triggers I'd found out what most of my triggers I'd found out what most of my triggers were as to why I was drinking and were as to why I was drinking and were as to why I was drinking and everything. And it's like if the others everything. And it's like if the others everything. And it's like if the others had done that, had done that, had done that, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> yeah, >> I might have it might have helped or on >> I might have it might have helped or on >> I might have it might have helped or on leaving the forces if that was put in leaving the forces if that was put in leaving the forces if that was put in place.

place. place. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. Um, I wouldn't have I wouldn't have then Um, I wouldn't have I wouldn't have then Um, I wouldn't have I wouldn't have then become homeless to get caught in that become homeless to get caught in that become homeless to get caught in that cycle. cycle. cycle. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. Because it is, isn't it? It's a it's a Because it is, isn't it? It's a it's a Because it is, isn't it? It's a it's a psy cyclical cyclical whatever thing psy cyclical cyclical whatever thing psy cyclical cyclical whatever thing when you're in that sort of when you're in that sort of when you're in that sort of homelessness. Can't get a job, can't get homelessness. Can't get a job, can't get homelessness. Can't get a job, can't get a bank account cuz I haven't got an a bank account cuz I haven't got an a bank account cuz I haven't got an address. And then where do I start? And address. And then where do I start? And address. And then where do I start? And >> I I mean the other thing that I I did do >> I I mean the other thing that I I did do >> I I mean the other thing that I I did do and I must apologize to the women that and I must apologize to the women that and I must apologize to the women that I've hurt over the years. I got into I've hurt over the years. I got into I've hurt over the years. I got into relationships, but in my mindset at the relationships, but in my mindset at the relationships, but in my mindset at the time, I wasn't ready for that time, I wasn't ready for that time, I wasn't ready for that relationship because I was still in the relationship because I was still in the relationship because I was still in the alcohol addiction and I'd still got alcohol addiction and I'd still got alcohol addiction and I'd still got [snorts] [snorts] [snorts] >> even though I was living with them for a >> even though I was living with them for a >> even though I was living with them for a short period of time, it was always short period of time, it was always short period of time, it was always their home. It wasn't mine their home. It wasn't mine their home. It wasn't mine >> with you.

>> with you. >> with you. >> So, I I I was homeless homeless. Um >> So, I I I was homeless homeless. Um >> So, I I I was homeless homeless. Um >> u people seem to think that when you're >> u people seem to think that when you're >> u people seem to think that when you're homeless, it's on the street. It's not homeless, it's on the street. It's not homeless, it's on the street. It's not um it's it's um it's it's um it's it's >> sofa surfing and >> sofa surfing and >> sofa surfing and >> Yeah. Yeah.

>> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Not having >> Yeah. Not having >> Yeah. Not having >> not having your own stable home that you >> not having your own stable home that you >> not having your own stable home that you can call home. can call home. can call home. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Living with a partner isn't it can >> Living with a partner isn't it can >> Living with a partner isn't it can become a home for c for some people, become a home for c for some people, become a home for c for some people, >> but for someone that was in my mental >> but for someone that was in my mental >> but for someone that was in my mental state at the time, it was always their state at the time, it was always their state at the time, it was always their house. It was always their home.

house. It was always their home. house. It was always their home. >> It was just a place you happened to be >> It was just a place you happened to be >> It was just a place you happened to be living. living. living. >> Yeah. [snorts] >> Yeah. [snorts] >> Yeah. [snorts] >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, you got out of that cycle though. So, you got out of that cycle though. So, you got out of that cycle though. >> Yes. Yeah. >> Yes. Yeah. >> Yes. Yeah. and took a long time but eventually and took a long time but eventually and took a long time but eventually Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. >> And that was with the help of this >> And that was with the help of this >> And that was with the help of this talking as well. talking as well. talking as well. >> Yeah. And the talking therapist helped. >> Yeah. And the talking therapist helped. >> Yeah. And the talking therapist helped. I mean for the alcohol addiction uh or I mean for the alcohol addiction uh or I mean for the alcohol addiction uh or what I thought was the alcohol what I thought was the alcohol what I thought was the alcohol addiction. Um I did start with AA. Um addiction. Um I did start with AA. Um addiction. Um I did start with AA. Um and it's a very good service. It works and it's a very good service. It works and it's a very good service. It works for a lot of people. Um it wasn't for me for a lot of people. Um it wasn't for me for a lot of people. Um it wasn't for me because of the religious side of it, because of the religious side of it, because of the religious side of it, right? um uh right? um uh right? um uh it it just became too much. Um and then it it just became too much. Um and then it it just became too much. Um and then uh you get your sponsor, he was uh you get your sponsor, he was uh you get your sponsor, he was constantly phoning. Um constantly phoning. Um constantly phoning. Um and it and it was like he was putting and it and it was like he was putting and it and it was like he was putting all his issues on me whereas it's like all his issues on me whereas it's like all his issues on me whereas it's like hang on a minute, it's supposed to be hang on a minute, it's supposed to be hang on a minute, it's supposed to be the other way around and um some people the other way around and um some people the other way around and um some people take it to an extreme and I that's what take it to an extreme and I that's what take it to an extreme and I that's what I didn't gel with with that. And then I didn't gel with with that. And then I didn't gel with with that. And then when the talking therapy started when the talking therapy started when the talking therapy started and the and the diagnosis of PTSD came and the and the diagnosis of PTSD came and the and the diagnosis of PTSD came about, um there was one AA meeting I about, um there was one AA meeting I about, um there was one AA meeting I went to and there was actually um an ex went to and there was actually um an ex went to and there was actually um an ex soldier that had done his old 22 years.

soldier that had done his old 22 years. soldier that had done his old 22 years. He'd been out for 10 years, been sober He'd been out for 10 years, been sober He'd been out for 10 years, been sober for 10 years as well. Um and his story for 10 years as well. Um and his story for 10 years as well. Um and his story just aligned with mine. the feelings just aligned with mine. the feelings just aligned with mine. the feelings after leaving the abandonment and after leaving the abandonment and after leaving the abandonment and everything else. He was he'd been everything else. He was he'd been everything else. He was he'd been homeless as well. He turned his life homeless as well. He turned his life homeless as well. He turned his life around through aa um but I couldn't see around through aa um but I couldn't see around through aa um but I couldn't see that that was my path. Um but when the that that was my path. Um but when the that that was my path. Um but when the counseling came along and I found that counseling came along and I found that counseling came along and I found that the the right counselor, I knew that the the right counselor, I knew that the the right counselor, I knew that eventually that's something I wanted to eventually that's something I wanted to eventually that's something I wanted to do.

do. do. >> Yeah. So you didn't go straight into >> Yeah. So you didn't go straight into >> Yeah. So you didn't go straight into doing that for yourself then? doing that for yourself then? doing that for yourself then? >> No. No. Um I I it was about so I had my >> No. No. Um I I it was about so I had my >> No. No. Um I I it was about so I had my first person centered in 2007. first person centered in 2007. first person centered in 2007. I'd seen the other counselors. It was I'd seen the other counselors. It was I'd seen the other counselors. It was 2007 when I first saw this person 2007 when I first saw this person 2007 when I first saw this person centered therapist. Um and then it was centered therapist. Um and then it was centered therapist. Um and then it was 2017 when I actually started training to 2017 when I actually started training to 2017 when I actually started training to become a counselor.

Building RDCS and Expanding Access 17:10

become a counselor. become a counselor. >> And it's quite a long course, isn't it? >> And it's quite a long course, isn't it? >> And it's quite a long course, isn't it? The counselor training. The counselor training. The counselor training. >> It's uh you have to start at your level >> It's uh you have to start at your level >> It's uh you have to start at your level two uh which is a year long. Then your two uh which is a year long. Then your two uh which is a year long. Then your level three another year and then you level three another year and then you level three another year and then you diploma course level four which is a diploma course level four which is a diploma course level four which is a two-year course.

two-year course. two-year course. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Um within that course you have to do 100 >> Um within that course you have to do 100 >> Um within that course you have to do 100 hours volunteering counseling. hours volunteering counseling. hours volunteering counseling. >> Uh you have to have your own personal >> Uh you have to have your own personal >> Uh you have to have your own personal therapy as well. So but within the therapy as well. So but within the therapy as well. So but within the course as well you break into little course as well you break into little course as well you break into little groups and you have therapy within the groups and you have therapy within the groups and you have therapy within the within the class time as well. Um, so within the class time as well. Um, so within the class time as well. Um, so and it's trying to learn the skills and and it's trying to learn the skills and and it's trying to learn the skills and everything, but there was things that everything, but there was things that everything, but there was things that came out then that I'd not realized with came out then that I'd not realized with came out then that I'd not realized with the counseling.

the counseling. the counseling. >> So there was a lot of new stuff had come >> So there was a lot of new stuff had come >> So there was a lot of new stuff had come to light and it was like, oh well, hang to light and it was like, oh well, hang to light and it was like, oh well, hang on a minute. Um, where's this where's on a minute. Um, where's this where's on a minute. Um, where's this where's this thought come from? Why am I feeling this thought come from? Why am I feeling this thought come from? Why am I feeling this? And this? And this? And >> yeah.

>> yeah. >> yeah. >> And was it during that process that you >> And was it during that process that you >> And was it during that process that you met Rosanna? met Rosanna? met Rosanna? >> It was. Yeah. Um, so, >> It was. Yeah. Um, so, >> It was. Yeah. Um, so, um, I, as I say, I started, uh, my level um, I, as I say, I started, uh, my level um, I, as I say, I started, uh, my level two in 2017. That was while I was still two in 2017. That was while I was still two in 2017. That was while I was still living in the Leicester as Bay Area. Um, living in the Leicester as Bay Area. Um, living in the Leicester as Bay Area. Um, due to personal circumstances, um, I got due to personal circumstances, um, I got due to personal circumstances, um, I got my cousin who was autistic. He came to my cousin who was autistic. He came to my cousin who was autistic. He came to stop with me for a year. Um, he he got stop with me for a year. Um, he he got stop with me for a year. Um, he he got into some trouble back in Rothram.

into some trouble back in Rothram. into some trouble back in Rothram. Um, and he needed a breakaway. So, he Um, and he needed a breakaway. So, he Um, and he needed a breakaway. So, he came and stayed with me. A year after came and stayed with me. A year after came and stayed with me. A year after that um I'd started again but then I got that um I'd started again but then I got that um I'd started again but then I got custody of my daughter. Um and then in custody of my daughter. Um and then in custody of my daughter. Um and then in that in that in where I had to stop that in that in where I had to stop that in that in where I had to stop learning we actually moved from learning we actually moved from learning we actually moved from Leicester back to Rotherham. Um she'd Leicester back to Rotherham. Um she'd Leicester back to Rotherham. Um she'd missed a year of her GCES. So the first missed a year of her GCES. So the first missed a year of her GCES. So the first year of GCSEs due to um she'd been year of GCSEs due to um she'd been year of GCSEs due to um she'd been living with her auntie who was supposed living with her auntie who was supposed living with her auntie who was supposed to be homeschooling her and that didn't to be homeschooling her and that didn't to be homeschooling her and that didn't happen.

happen. happen. >> Right. That's a shame. where we were >> Right. That's a shame. where we were >> Right. That's a shame. where we were living. I'd tried all the schools to try living. I'd tried all the schools to try living. I'd tried all the schools to try and get her back put back a year because and get her back put back a year because and get her back put back a year because her, excuse [clears throat] me, her her, excuse [clears throat] me, her her, excuse [clears throat] me, her birthday falls at the end of August.

birthday falls at the end of August. birthday falls at the end of August. She's a few days from the the cut off um She's a few days from the the cut off um She's a few days from the the cut off um for the year. for the year. for the year. >> Um and I was trying to like get her to >> Um and I was trying to like get her to >> Um and I was trying to like get her to restart uh year well it was fourth year restart uh year well it was fourth year restart uh year well it was fourth year comp years 10 11 now. Yeah.

comp years 10 11 now. Yeah. comp years 10 11 now. Yeah. >> Um and none of the schools would take >> Um and none of the schools would take >> Um and none of the schools would take her on and I thought [sighs] her on and I thought [sighs] her on and I thought [sighs] what can I do? What can I do? And what can I do? What can I do? And what can I do? What can I do? And because my family still lived in because my family still lived in because my family still lived in Rotherham, I thought, well, if I make a Rotherham, I thought, well, if I make a Rotherham, I thought, well, if I make a move back to Rotherham, I've got ties move back to Rotherham, I've got ties move back to Rotherham, I've got ties that I could get her into a school. If that I could get her into a school. If that I could get her into a school. If I'm working, at least she's got her I'm working, at least she's got her I'm working, at least she's got her aunts and her uncles and a grand grandma aunts and her uncles and a grand grandma aunts and her uncles and a grand grandma and grandpa available if I'm not at and grandpa available if I'm not at and grandpa available if I'm not at home. Uh anyway, we made the move to home. Uh anyway, we made the move to home. Uh anyway, we made the move to Rotheram. Um this was back in 2018.

Um I then started the level two in Um I then started the level two in Barnsley 2019. Barnsley 2019. Barnsley 2019. Uh due to COVID we ended up having to Uh due to COVID we ended up having to Uh due to COVID we ended up having to stop learning again. stop learning again. stop learning again. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Um cuz in that interim I'd >> Um cuz in that interim I'd >> Um cuz in that interim I'd um I'd met someone in the period of um I'd met someone in the period of um I'd met someone in the period of moving back to Rotherham. We're now moving back to Rotherham. We're now moving back to Rotherham. We're now husband and wife.

husband and wife. husband and wife. >> Um [snorts] we had a wedding to plan >> Um [snorts] we had a wedding to plan >> Um [snorts] we had a wedding to plan for. We planning to buy a house together for. We planning to buy a house together for. We planning to buy a house together at that time as well. And Rebecca my at that time as well. And Rebecca my at that time as well. And Rebecca my tutor she was just like take a year off. tutor she was just like take a year off. tutor she was just like take a year off. >> Yeah. [laughter] He's like, I've taken >> Yeah. [laughter] He's like, I've taken >> Yeah. [laughter] He's like, I've taken years off already because of this, this, years off already because of this, this, years off already because of this, this, and this. I don't want like just take a and this. I don't want like just take a and this. I don't want like just take a year off and start again. And then I year off and start again. And then I year off and start again. And then I started the level three, and that's started the level three, and that's started the level three, and that's where I met Rosanna. Um, and where I met Rosanna. Um, and where I met Rosanna. Um, and we've from the level three, we just we've from the level three, we just we've from the level three, we just gelled. Um, we we're like a brother and gelled. Um, we we're like a brother and gelled. Um, we we're like a brother and sister.

sister. sister. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um, and we've got a lot of respect for >> Um, and we've got a lot of respect for >> Um, and we've got a lot of respect for each other. We both we both have had each other. We both we both have had each other. We both we both have had things happen in our past things happen in our past things happen in our past >> um and and in the present >> um and and in the present >> um and and in the present >> um and we're always there for each other >> um and we're always there for each other >> um and we're always there for each other no matter what. And it's it's a really no matter what. And it's it's a really no matter what. And it's it's a really good relationship that we've got.

good relationship that we've got. good relationship that we've got. >> That's lovely. >> That's lovely. >> That's lovely. >> You're both very lovely people. >> You're both very lovely people. >> You're both very lovely people. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Oh, you know, and I can see having seen >> Oh, you know, and I can see having seen >> Oh, you know, and I can see having seen both of you, you know, together and both of you, you know, together and both of you, you know, together and separate that that is separate that that is separate that that is a very supportive relationship and a very supportive relationship and a very supportive relationship and that's important to have, isn't it?

that's important to have, isn't it? that's important to have, isn't it? >> Yeah. especially in the venture that >> Yeah. especially in the venture that >> Yeah. especially in the venture that we're trying to do. Um [snorts] during we're trying to do. Um [snorts] during we're trying to do. Um [snorts] during uh the level three, we were doing some uh the level three, we were doing some uh the level three, we were doing some investigative work into talking investigative work into talking investigative work into talking therapies and waiting lists. Um and we therapies and waiting lists. Um and we therapies and waiting lists. Um and we we've continued the research and last we've continued the research and last we've continued the research and last year there was 1.7 million waiting over year there was 1.7 million waiting over year there was 1.7 million waiting over 18 months to be seen.

18 months to be seen. 18 months to be seen. >> 18 months >> 18 months >> 18 months >> 18 months to be seen firsthand. This is >> 18 months to be seen firsthand. This is >> 18 months to be seen firsthand. This is when they've been referred. when they've been referred. when they've been referred. um or when they've self-reerred they've um or when they've self-reerred they've um or when they've self-reerred they've been so 1.7 million within the UK. This been so 1.7 million within the UK. This been so 1.7 million within the UK. This is the over 18 bracket by the way. Yeah.

is the over 18 bracket by the way. Yeah. is the over 18 bracket by the way. Yeah. >> Um it was 515,000 teenage children. >> Um it was 515,000 teenage children. >> Um it was 515,000 teenage children. It doesn't doesn't go into the younger It doesn't doesn't go into the younger It doesn't doesn't go into the younger years support numbers. Um for some years support numbers. Um for some years support numbers. Um for some reason um all the research we've done, reason um all the research we've done, reason um all the research we've done, we can't find anything we can't find anything we can't find anything >> below the age of 12, >> below the age of 12, >> below the age of 12, >> right? Um but yeah, 515,000 children, >> right? Um but yeah, 515,000 children, >> right? Um but yeah, 515,000 children, 1.7 million people. And out of that 1.7 1.7 million people. And out of that 1.7 1.7 million people. And out of that 1.7 million, half of those people have million, half of those people have million, half of those people have either not completed the service or either not completed the service or either not completed the service or haven't been able to start the service haven't been able to start the service haven't been able to start the service because they got fed up with the waiting because they got fed up with the waiting because they got fed up with the waiting times.

times. times. >> That's staggering. >> That's staggering. >> That's staggering. >> It's a staggering amount of number and >> It's a staggering amount of number and >> It's a staggering amount of number and it's increasing every day. it's increasing every day. it's increasing every day. >> So that was your niche. That was your >> So that was your niche. That was your >> So that was your niche. That was your in. in. in. >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean we we also looked in >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean we we also looked in >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean we we also looked in because as as I said um part of the because as as I said um part of the because as as I said um part of the course criteria is you have to have your course criteria is you have to have your course criteria is you have to have your own private counseling and through own private counseling and through own private counseling and through student discounts we we got it at a student discounts we we got it at a student discounts we we got it at a fairly low rate. Um but when we looked fairly low rate. Um but when we looked fairly low rate. Um but when we looked at the bigger picture uh and it is area at the bigger picture uh and it is area at the bigger picture uh and it is area focused as well the pricing.

focused as well the pricing. focused as well the pricing. >> Um so for the Barnsley [snorts] >> Um so for the Barnsley [snorts] >> Um so for the Barnsley [snorts] area you were looking at £45 plus an area you were looking at £45 plus an area you were looking at £45 plus an hour hour hour um for private therapy. um for private therapy. um for private therapy. >> Barnes is not an affluent area. >> Barnes is not an affluent area. >> Barnes is not an affluent area. >> No Sheffield which is seven miles seven >> No Sheffield which is seven miles seven >> No Sheffield which is seven miles seven eight miles down the road £80 an hour.

eight miles down the road £80 an hour. eight miles down the road £80 an hour. You go further a field to some of the You go further a field to some of the You go further a field to some of the bigger cities like Leeds or where the bigger cities like Leeds or where the bigger cities like Leeds or where the big companies are coming in, you're big companies are coming in, you're big companies are coming in, you're looking at over £150 an hour. looking at over £150 an hour. looking at over £150 an hour. >> It's a staggering amount. [snorts] And >> It's a staggering amount. [snorts] And >> It's a staggering amount. [snorts] And Rosanna and I weren't happy with the Rosanna and I weren't happy with the Rosanna and I weren't happy with the fact that they were charging that much fact that they were charging that much fact that they were charging that much because it's not affordable. I mean, £45 because it's not affordable. I mean, £45 because it's not affordable. I mean, £45 in a working family in a working family in a working family >> in this day and age is a struggle to >> in this day and age is a struggle to >> in this day and age is a struggle to find.

find. find. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Because I guess you most people like to >> Because I guess you most people like to >> Because I guess you most people like to come at least once a week. come at least once a week. come at least once a week. >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean that's that's the >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean that's that's the >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean that's that's the ideal is once a week. ideal is once a week. ideal is once a week. >> Um you usually I mean the NHS do it at >> Um you usually I mean the NHS do it at >> Um you usually I mean the NHS do it at seven six to seven sessions and then seven six to seven sessions and then seven six to seven sessions and then they're done. That's them done.

they're done. That's them done. they're done. That's them done. >> Um we we seem to think that >> Um we we seem to think that >> Um we we seem to think that >> seven's too short a number. You you need >> seven's too short a number. You you need >> seven's too short a number. You you need to have at least 10, maybe 12 just to to have at least 10, maybe 12 just to to have at least 10, maybe 12 just to get to um the right place that the the get to um the right place that the the get to um the right place that the the person wants to be. Um but so 10 person wants to be. Um but so 10 person wants to be. Um but so 10 sessions at 45 that's 450 quid coming sessions at 45 that's 450 quid coming sessions at 45 that's 450 quid coming out of someone's budget.

out of someone's budget. out of someone's budget. We don't we didn't like that and we We don't we didn't like that and we We don't we didn't like that and we didn't like the fact that people are didn't like the fact that people are didn't like the fact that people are either waiting or dropping out. either waiting or dropping out. either waiting or dropping out. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So we decided that we were going to do >> So we decided that we were going to do >> So we decided that we were going to do something about it. Um Rosanna initially something about it. Um Rosanna initially something about it. Um Rosanna initially was like start start a business start a was like start start a business start a was like start start a business start a business. I was like no we want to business. I was like no we want to business. I was like no we want to become a charity.

become a charity. become a charity. >> That is that is our goal. We want to >> That is that is our goal. We want to >> That is that is our goal. We want to become a charity. Um, in the interim we become a charity. Um, in the interim we become a charity. Um, in the interim we become a community interest company so become a community interest company so become a community interest company so we can get funding and the funding is to we can get funding and the funding is to we can get funding and the funding is to basically pay the priv private basically pay the priv private basically pay the priv private counselors their fees counselors their fees counselors their fees but to take the we're trying to get but to take the we're trying to get but to take the we're trying to get partnerships with GP surgeries and partnerships with GP surgeries and partnerships with GP surgeries and things like that but to take the things like that but to take the things like that but to take the pressure off the NHS not take away from pressure off the NHS not take away from pressure off the NHS not take away from the NHS but just to take that pressure the NHS but just to take that pressure the NHS but just to take that pressure off.

off. off. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Amazing. >> Amazing. >> Amazing. So people are getting it free if they So people are getting it free if they So people are getting it free if they come in via that route. Then come in via that route. Then come in via that route. Then >> they will be once once we've got the >> they will be once once we've got the >> they will be once once we've got the funding and everything in place. Yeah. funding and everything in place. Yeah. funding and everything in place. Yeah. People will be getting free counseling People will be getting free counseling People will be getting free counseling in the interim while we're still setting in the interim while we're still setting in the interim while we're still setting up. Um one of the things that was halfel

Media Attention and Public Awareness 25:30

up. Um one of the things that was halfel up. Um one of the things that was halfel for me, but we've sort of extended it so for me, but we've sort of extended it so for me, but we've sort of extended it so veterans, any veteran or serving member veterans, any veteran or serving member veterans, any veteran or serving member of the forces gets it for free no matter of the forces gets it for free no matter of the forces gets it for free no matter what. Um but we've [snorts] now extended what. Um but we've [snorts] now extended what. Um but we've [snorts] now extended this to the fire service, the police this to the fire service, the police this to the fire service, the police force and uniform any uniform services.

force and uniform any uniform services. force and uniform any uniform services. So ambulance, paramedics, doctors, So ambulance, paramedics, doctors, So ambulance, paramedics, doctors, nurses. Um I know the NHS has their own nurses. Um I know the NHS has their own nurses. Um I know the NHS has their own um well-being. Um but the a lot of the um well-being. Um but the a lot of the um well-being. Um but the a lot of the NHS staff don't know that they've NHS staff don't know that they've NHS staff don't know that they've they've got the option to choose. Um, I they've got the option to choose. Um, I they've got the option to choose. Um, I can't remember the what it's called, but can't remember the what it's called, but can't remember the what it's called, but if they want to choose private therapy, if they want to choose private therapy, if they want to choose private therapy, they can take the private therapy and they can take the private therapy and they can take the private therapy and then claim the money back off the NHS.

then claim the money back off the NHS. then claim the money back off the NHS. >> No, I wouldn't thought that's very well >> No, I wouldn't thought that's very well >> No, I wouldn't thought that's very well publicized. publicized. publicized. >> No, no. I >> No, no. I >> No, no. I >> mean, most well-being departments, I can >> mean, most well-being departments, I can >> mean, most well-being departments, I can only speak about Barsley Hospital only speak about Barsley Hospital only speak about Barsley Hospital because that's where I work. Um, because that's where I work. Um, because that's where I work. Um, they do have a well-being service.

they do have a well-being service. they do have a well-being service. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I see things occasionally up on boards >> I see things occasionally up on boards >> I see things occasionally up on boards or on, you know, hospitalwide emails and or on, you know, hospitalwide emails and or on, you know, hospitalwide emails and things like that. But if you don't see things like that. But if you don't see things like that. But if you don't see those, you wouldn't know. those, you wouldn't know.

those, you wouldn't know. >> No, no. I mean, I went and um tried >> No, no. I mean, I went and um tried >> No, no. I mean, I went and um tried posting some leaflets around areas um posting some leaflets around areas um posting some leaflets around areas um and it was the new center that's opened and it was the new center that's opened and it was the new center that's opened in Barnsley, Glass Works. in Barnsley, Glass Works. in Barnsley, Glass Works. >> Yeah, the glass works center. >> Yeah, the glass works center.

>> Yeah, the glass works center. >> And I think I got the most obnoxious >> And I think I got the most obnoxious >> And I think I got the most obnoxious receptionist I could ever deal with. Um receptionist I could ever deal with. Um receptionist I could ever deal with. Um I was trying to explain to her the I was trying to explain to her the I was trying to explain to her the situation. Um I was like, "Oh, it's open situation. Um I was like, "Oh, it's open situation. Um I was like, "Oh, it's open to staff members. It's open to the to staff members. It's open to the to staff members. It's open to the public. um this is what we're trying to public. um this is what we're trying to public. um this is what we're trying to do and it's like well we've got our own do and it's like well we've got our own do and it's like well we've got our own we've got our own it's just like okay we've got our own it's just like okay we've got our own it's just like okay okay okay okay step away from that um but I thought step away from that um but I thought step away from that um but I thought rather than going in person from from rather than going in person from from rather than going in person from from now I am emailing places to try and get now I am emailing places to try and get now I am emailing places to try and get partnerships with them partnerships with them partnerships with them >> yeah I'd happily give me some leaflets >> yeah I'd happily give me some leaflets >> yeah I'd happily give me some leaflets and information and I'll take it and information and I'll take it and information and I'll take it straight to the well-being lead at straight to the well-being lead at straight to the well-being lead at Barnesley Hospital and say lighten your Barnesley Hospital and say lighten your Barnesley Hospital and say lighten your burden do what you can you know to help burden do what you can you know to help burden do what you can you know to help everybody Yeah, I mean that's the thing.

everybody Yeah, I mean that's the thing. everybody Yeah, I mean that's the thing. People People need to talk. People need People People need to talk. People need People People need to talk. People need Well, no, not to talk. People need to be Well, no, not to talk. People need to be Well, no, not to talk. People need to be heard. heard. heard. >> That's the key, isn't it? >> That's the key, isn't it? >> That's the key, isn't it? >> People need to be heard and it's not >> People need to be heard and it's not >> People need to be heard and it's not happening. The N, as I said, the NHS happening. The N, as I said, the NHS happening. The N, as I said, the NHS um there are areas that that are um there are areas that that are um there are areas that that are struggling struggling struggling >> and the mental health side is one of >> and the mental health side is one of >> and the mental health side is one of them. And I know it's not the staff them. And I know it's not the staff them. And I know it's not the staff fault. they are on demand, overworked, fault. they are on demand, overworked, fault. they are on demand, overworked, um, and they just can't keep up with the um, and they just can't keep up with the um, and they just can't keep up with the numbers that are coming through.

numbers that are coming through. numbers that are coming through. >> Um, and this is why we want to get the >> Um, and this is why we want to get the >> Um, and this is why we want to get the partnerships in place because everyone partnerships in place because everyone partnerships in place because everyone does need to be heard does need to be heard does need to be heard >> at whatever stage they're at. >> at whatever stage they're at. >> at whatever stage they're at. >> It's no use waiting 18 months >> It's no use waiting 18 months >> It's no use waiting 18 months for a problem that was back then. I mean for a problem that was back then. I mean for a problem that was back then. I mean be it bereavement, be it trauma, be it bereavement, be it trauma, be it bereavement, be it trauma, um um um cancer, uh which is close to me as you cancer, uh which is close to me as you cancer, uh which is close to me as you know as well.

know as well. know as well. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> people need to talk at that moment the >> people need to talk at that moment the >> people need to talk at that moment the >> within two weeks maximum >> within two weeks maximum >> within two weeks maximum >> from referral to being seen. >> from referral to being seen. >> from referral to being seen. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> 18 months it's either gone one of two >> 18 months it's either gone one of two >> 18 months it's either gone one of two ways. They've either dealt with it and ways. They've either dealt with it and ways. They've either dealt with it and moved on or they've unfortunately moved on or they've unfortunately moved on or they've unfortunately they've gone the other way.

they've gone the other way. they've gone the other way. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. Yeah. I was going to say that nothing in Yeah. I was going to say that nothing in Yeah. I was going to say that nothing in life stays the same. life stays the same. life stays the same. >> No. >> No. >> No. >> For 18 weeks, never mind 18 months. >> For 18 weeks, never mind 18 months. >> For 18 weeks, never mind 18 months. >> No. No. I mean, and whatever trauma they >> No. No. I mean, and whatever trauma they >> No. No. I mean, and whatever trauma they had at that time, had at that time, had at that time, >> if they've had more compressed on that, >> if they've had more compressed on that, >> if they've had more compressed on that, it's it's going to be detrimental to the it's it's going to be detrimental to the it's it's going to be detrimental to the mental health.

mental health. mental health. >> Of course it does. >> Of course it does. >> Of course it does. >> And that's why we want to step in and go >> And that's why we want to step in and go >> And that's why we want to step in and go right right right >> in the meantime before your NHS therapy >> in the meantime before your NHS therapy >> in the meantime before your NHS therapy starts, we've got this option. starts, we've got this option. starts, we've got this option. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. And I'm guess some of those people will And I'm guess some of those people will And I'm guess some of those people will go on to have the NHS therapy and others go on to have the NHS therapy and others go on to have the NHS therapy and others you'll have dealt with. You'll have you'll have dealt with. You'll have you'll have dealt with. You'll have fixed them for one for the better.

fixed them for one for the better. fixed them for one for the better. >> Yeah. Cuz I mean there's plenty of >> Yeah. Cuz I mean there's plenty of >> Yeah. Cuz I mean there's plenty of counselors out there looking for counselors out there looking for counselors out there looking for clients. Um but the price that they're clients. Um but the price that they're clients. Um but the price that they're charging as I said in this day and age charging as I said in this day and age charging as I said in this day and age working families struggle to live.

working families struggle to live. working families struggle to live. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And if a parent or a struggling family And if a parent or a struggling family And if a parent or a struggling family u financially need need to talk but want u financially need need to talk but want u financially need need to talk but want want to be heard rather than sit with a want to be heard rather than sit with a want to be heard rather than sit with a family member and have them go you family member and have them go you family member and have them go you should do it this way, you should do it should do it this way, you should do it should do it this way, you should do it that way.

that way. that way. >> It's like they're not wanting the >> It's like they're not wanting the >> It's like they're not wanting the advice. They're wanting to their advice. They're wanting to their advice. They're wanting to their feelings to be heard and validated. feelings to be heard and validated. feelings to be heard and validated. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> And that's what the service is about. >> And that's what the service is about. >> And that's what the service is about. >> I mean I think it's brilliant. It just >> I mean I think it's brilliant. It just >> I mean I think it's brilliant. It just fills a desperate need fills a desperate need fills a desperate need >> that the NHS has got at the moment. I >> that the NHS has got at the moment. I >> that the NHS has got at the moment. I mean, I'm obviously in the acute mean, I'm obviously in the acute mean, I'm obviously in the acute medicine side of things and we're medicine side of things and we're medicine side of things and we're understaffed and underfunded, but I am understaffed and underfunded, but I am understaffed and underfunded, but I am aware I mean, one of my best friends is aware I mean, one of my best friends is aware I mean, one of my best friends is a psychiatrist. She works in CAMS so a psychiatrist. She works in CAMS so a psychiatrist. She works in CAMS so with one of the, you know, the with one of the, you know, the with one of the, you know, the children's children's children's >> uh and adolescence mental health >> uh and adolescence mental health >> uh and adolescence mental health services. And services. And services. And so I know even without her I know that so I know even without her I know that so I know even without her I know that mental health issues are escalating in mental health issues are escalating in mental health issues are escalating in the community and the hospitals for the community and the hospitals for the community and the hospitals for whatever reason just can't match demand.

whatever reason just can't match demand. whatever reason just can't match demand. >> No, >> No, >> No, >> they couldn't match it years ago. >> they couldn't match it years ago. >> they couldn't match it years ago. >> No, [laughter] >> No, [laughter] >> No, [laughter] I mean I mean back in 2006 I thought 8 I mean I mean back in 2006 I thought 8 I mean I mean back in 2006 I thought 8 to 10 weeks was far too long to be to 10 weeks was far too long to be to 10 weeks was far too long to be waiting. Um, especially when I had the waiting. Um, especially when I had the waiting. Um, especially when I had the addiction issues with alcohol on top.

addiction issues with alcohol on top. addiction issues with alcohol on top. Um, but it's like 18 months. Um, but it's like 18 months. Um, but it's like 18 months. No, no. People could take a serious No, no. People could take a serious No, no. People could take a serious serious slide down, but then no one's serious slide down, but then no one's serious slide down, but then no one's held accountable for it. It's like, oh, held accountable for it. It's like, oh, held accountable for it. It's like, oh, it's it's what it is. It's the system it's it's what it is. It's the system it's it's what it is. It's the system that's failing. It's no it's the people that's failing. It's no it's the people that's failing. It's no it's the people running the system running the system running the system where it's failing.

where it's failing. where it's failing. >> Yeah. And that does need to change. >> Yeah. And that does need to change. >> Yeah. And that does need to change. >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> [snorts] >> Maybe Sage will change it. You >> Maybe Sage will change it. You >> Maybe Sage will change it. You [laughter] never know. [laughter] never know. [laughter] never know. >> Might take a bit of time. >> Might take a bit of time. >> Might take a bit of time. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. [laughter] >> But all good things do.

>> But all good things do. >> But all good things do. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I mean, I'm I'm under no impression that >> I mean, I'm I'm under no impression that >> I mean, I'm I'm under no impression that this is going to be a quick fix this is going to be a quick fix this is going to be a quick fix solution, but my my plan for our DCS um solution, but my my plan for our DCS um solution, but my my plan for our DCS um with Rosanna [clears throat] is to be with Rosanna [clears throat] is to be with Rosanna [clears throat] is to be similar to a hospital, have a an similar to a hospital, have a an similar to a hospital, have a an all-in-one mental health clinic.

all-in-one mental health clinic. all-in-one mental health clinic. >> Mhm. uh where people can come in uh for >> Mhm. uh where people can come in uh for >> Mhm. uh where people can come in uh for different modalities of counseling uh different modalities of counseling uh different modalities of counseling uh whatever their preference is whatever their preference is whatever their preference is hypnotherapy EMDR therapy um there's al hypnotherapy EMDR therapy um there's al hypnotherapy EMDR therapy um there's al we've also looked at like raiki massage we've also looked at like raiki massage we've also looked at like raiki massage and things like that so a complete and things like that so a complete and things like that so a complete mental health well-being center mental health well-being center mental health well-being center >> yeah that sounds lovely and very needed >> yeah that sounds lovely and very needed >> yeah that sounds lovely and very needed >> because >> because >> because I don't know of anything out there I don't know of anything out there I don't know of anything out there that's outside of the NHS s that's that's outside of the NHS s that's that's outside of the NHS s that's purely mental health focused.

purely mental health focused. purely mental health focused. >> No, I mean the counselors try and do a >> No, I mean the counselors try and do a >> No, I mean the counselors try and do a good job but as I said the the costing good job but as I said the the costing good job but as I said the the costing it's it's just too much for people. it's it's just too much for people. it's it's just too much for people. >> Yeah. And I like the idea of introducing >> Yeah. And I like the idea of introducing >> Yeah. And I like the idea of introducing the different modalities cuz as you said the different modalities cuz as you said the different modalities cuz as you said the first person you spoke to was trying the first person you spoke to was trying the first person you spoke to was trying to do hypnotherapy with the best to do hypnotherapy with the best to do hypnotherapy with the best intentions. I don't doubt intentions. I don't doubt intentions. I don't doubt >> but that wasn't floating your boat at >> but that wasn't floating your boat at >> but that wasn't floating your boat at that time.

that time. that time. >> No. No. And there will be other people >> No. No. And there will be other people >> No. No. And there will be other people that hypnotherapy will be exactly what that hypnotherapy will be exactly what that hypnotherapy will be exactly what they need. they need. they need. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Or maybe the raiki or I don't know >> Or maybe the raiki or I don't know >> Or maybe the raiki or I don't know whatever it might be. whatever it might be. whatever it might be. >> Whatever they need for their mental >> Whatever they need for their mental >> Whatever they need for their mental health wellbeing, that's what we want to health wellbeing, that's what we want to health wellbeing, that's what we want to try and provide. And and as I said, I'm try and provide. And and as I said, I'm try and provide. And and as I said, I'm I'm not dafted enough to know it's going I'm not dafted enough to know it's going I'm not dafted enough to know it's going to be done in a year. It to be done in a year. It to be done in a year. It >> you're looking at 5 to 10 years.

>> you're looking at 5 to 10 years. >> you're looking at 5 to 10 years. >> But in the interim, if we can take the >> But in the interim, if we can take the >> But in the interim, if we can take the pressure off the NHS, then it's a pressure off the NHS, then it's a pressure off the NHS, then it's a blessing in disguise. blessing in disguise. blessing in disguise. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. um on one of the presentations we do for um on one of the presentations we do for um on one of the presentations we do for the college cuz we're looking at giving the college cuz we're looking at giving the college cuz we're looking at giving college college students placements. Um college college students placements. Um college college students placements. Um so a class roughly about 35 students so a class roughly about 35 students so a class roughly about 35 students they've got to do 100 hours that's 3,500 they've got to do 100 hours that's 3,500 they've got to do 100 hours that's 3,500 hours at [clears throat] hours at [clears throat] hours at [clears throat] 10 10 sessions per person averaging 10 10 sessions per person averaging 10 10 sessions per person averaging that's 350 people that could be seen.

that's 350 people that could be seen. that's 350 people that could be seen. >> That's a lot, isn't it? That's going to >> That's a lot, isn't it? That's going to >> That's a lot, isn't it? That's going to help. help. help. >> Yeah. And so you're trailblazing a new >> Yeah. And so you're trailblazing a new >> Yeah. And so you're trailblazing a new model, really, aren't you? model, really, aren't you? model, really, aren't you? >> We're trying to >> We're trying to >> We're trying to >> No, you are. You are. [laughter] You >> No, you are. You are. [laughter] You >> No, you are. You are. [laughter] You guys are. Take it.

guys are. Take it. guys are. Take it. >> Yeah, you're trailblazing a new model >> Yeah, you're trailblazing a new model >> Yeah, you're trailblazing a new model that hopefully that hopefully that hopefully >> will be copied. >> will be copied. >> will be copied. >> Yeah. Well, I mean, we're looking for >> Yeah. Well, I mean, we're looking for >> Yeah. Well, I mean, we're looking for trustees and people to come on board trustees and people to come on board trustees and people to come on board with us because we're not naive naive um with us because we're not naive naive um with us because we're not naive naive um to say that we know it all. We don't.

to say that we know it all. We don't. to say that we know it all. We don't. It's brand new to us, especially It's brand new to us, especially It's brand new to us, especially starting a business, let alone becoming starting a business, let alone becoming starting a business, let alone becoming a charity in the future. It's new to us. a charity in the future. It's new to us. a charity in the future. It's new to us. We need the experience of people that We need the experience of people that We need the experience of people that have done the charity work, trustees. Um have done the charity work, trustees. Um have done the charity work, trustees. Um we're we're we've organized a meeting we're we're we've organized a meeting we're we're we've organized a meeting next Tuesday for any potential trustees next Tuesday for any potential trustees next Tuesday for any potential trustees um to come in. uh because we we're new um to come in. uh because we we're new um to come in. uh because we we're new to it and everybody's experience into it to it and everybody's experience into it to it and everybody's experience into it will give a different point of view will give a different point of view will give a different point of view >> and it will be used within our DCS.

>> and it will be used within our DCS. >> and it will be used within our DCS. >> What does RDCS stand for? >> What does RDCS stand for? >> What does RDCS stand for? >> It's reflective development counseling >> It's reflective development counseling >> It's reflective development counseling space. space. space. >> Lovely. I like that. >> Lovely. I like that. >> Lovely. I like that. >> Yeah, it is a play on Rosanna's and my >> Yeah, it is a play on Rosanna's and my >> Yeah, it is a play on Rosanna's and my initials.

initials. initials. >> I that was why I thought I know it >> I that was why I thought I know it >> I that was why I thought I know it doesn't mean that but it is your doesn't mean that but it is your doesn't mean that but it is your initials, isn't it? initials, isn't it? initials, isn't it? >> Yeah. So, Rosanna Doug and Chris >> Yeah. So, Rosanna Doug and Chris >> Yeah. So, Rosanna Doug and Chris Sanders. Yeah. Yeah, Sanders. Yeah. Yeah, Sanders. Yeah. Yeah, >> I I just because as I said, we like >> I I just because as I said, we like >> I I just because as I said, we like brother and sister. It was just what brother and sister. It was just what brother and sister. It was just what what can I come up with for for it? Um, what can I come up with for for it? Um, what can I come up with for for it? Um, and that I think that was about the and that I think that was about the and that I think that was about the fourth one fourth one fourth one >> and I'd taken a few ideas to like, oh, I >> and I'd taken a few ideas to like, oh, I >> and I'd taken a few ideas to like, oh, I like that one. So, and that's what we've like that one. So, and that's what we've like that one. So, and that's what we've gone with.

gone with. gone with. >> Yeah. Well, there's a few people that >> Yeah. Well, there's a few people that >> Yeah. Well, there's a few people that have immediately sprung to mind have immediately sprung to mind have immediately sprung to mind >> that I'm going to put you in touch with >> that I'm going to put you in touch with >> that I'm going to put you in touch with that can hopefully help. that can hopefully help. that can hopefully help. that any help would be truly that any help would be truly that any help would be truly appreciated.

appreciated. appreciated. >> People that >> People that >> People that um a couple who I absolutely adore and um a couple who I absolutely adore and um a couple who I absolutely adore and respect respect respect um run a retreat center that initially um run a retreat center that initially um run a retreat center that initially was just for veterans because the was just for veterans because the was just for veterans because the husband in the equation was a veteran husband in the equation was a veteran husband in the equation was a veteran himself. Um using various different himself. Um using various different himself. Um using various different modalities for PTSD modalities for PTSD modalities for PTSD >> um with great successes. I've been to >> um with great successes. I've been to >> um with great successes. I've been to some of their charity event meals and some of their charity event meals and some of their charity event meals and things like that to help them. um and things like that to help them. um and things like that to help them. um and somebody else who has a very unique somebody else who has a very unique somebody else who has a very unique methodology that is getting really well methodology that is getting really well methodology that is getting really well established now. It's getting the cred established now. It's getting the cred established now. It's getting the cred it should have and would fit very well.

it should have and would fit very well. it should have and would fit very well. >> All right. >> All right. >> All right. >> Into your model of a multimodal >> Into your model of a multimodal >> Into your model of a multimodal mental health treatment center if you mental health treatment center if you mental health treatment center if you like. like. like. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Yeah. I mean is it solution focused is >> Yeah. I mean is it solution focused is >> Yeah. I mean is it solution focused is another one that's uh recently come another one that's uh recently come another one that's uh recently come forward. It started in America a couple forward. It started in America a couple forward. It started in America a couple of years ago I think. Um that's another of years ago I think. Um that's another of years ago I think. Um that's another one we want to look into. Um as well one we want to look into. Um as well one we want to look into. Um as well [snorts] similar to CBT in some aspects [snorts] similar to CBT in some aspects [snorts] similar to CBT in some aspects but um but um but um >> yeah we >> yeah we >> yeah we we all want to become anyone that comes we all want to become anyone that comes we all want to become anyone that comes to our DCS we'd like them to be trained to our DCS we'd like them to be trained to our DCS we'd like them to be trained integratively.

integratively. integratively. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So they're not just using one modality >> So they're not just using one modality >> So they're not just using one modality because um well I can't remember the because um well I can't remember the because um well I can't remember the phrase Rosanna used uh one size doesn't phrase Rosanna used uh one size doesn't phrase Rosanna used uh one size doesn't fit all. fit all. fit all. >> Absolutely. Uh I think that that was the >> Absolutely. Uh I think that that was the >> Absolutely. Uh I think that that was the saying she used and as we know from my saying she used and as we know from my saying she used and as we know from my experience I went to several and they experience I went to several and they experience I went to several and they were all different modalities and it was were all different modalities and it was were all different modalities and it was the person centered that worked for me.

the person centered that worked for me. the person centered that worked for me. >> Yeah. And I completely agree and I'm so >> Yeah. And I completely agree and I'm so >> Yeah. And I completely agree and I'm so pleased now that your life in terms of pleased now that your life in terms of pleased now that your life in terms of the stability the stability the stability >> that you've got generally speaking is so >> that you've got generally speaking is so >> that you've got generally speaking is so so much better. You're in a much better so much better. You're in a much better so much better. You're in a much better place.

place. place. >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean that even though I've >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean that even though I've >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean that even though I've had setbacks throughout the years, the had setbacks throughout the years, the had setbacks throughout the years, the most recent one being the prostate most recent one being the prostate most recent one being the prostate cancer cancer cancer um and the recent diagnosis that it's um and the recent diagnosis that it's um and the recent diagnosis that it's come back not well the prostate's been come back not well the prostate's been come back not well the prostate's been removed but the cancer has come back. Um removed but the cancer has come back. Um removed but the cancer has come back. Um it's still it's not stopping me. I'm it's still it's not stopping me. I'm it's still it's not stopping me. I'm still driven to complete this. It my still driven to complete this. It my still driven to complete this. It my kids are my legacy but this is something kids are my legacy but this is something kids are my legacy but this is something for everyone at the end of the day. um for everyone at the end of the day. um for everyone at the end of the day. um and it can be taken on by anyone and it can be taken on by anyone and it can be taken on by anyone >> many years down the line, fingers >> many years down the line, fingers >> many years down the line, fingers crossed that IP pass um is still going crossed that IP pass um is still going crossed that IP pass um is still going to be there and is still going to be to be there and is still going to be to be there and is still going to be running.

running. running. >> Yeah, absolutely. And I mean the fact >> Yeah, absolutely. And I mean the fact >> Yeah, absolutely. And I mean the fact you're already going into the colleges you're already going into the colleges you're already going into the colleges >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> and getting them involved and making >> and getting them involved and making >> and getting them involved and making them aware of what you're doing. I'm them aware of what you're doing. I'm them aware of what you're doing. I'm sure as people graduate from the sure as people graduate from the sure as people graduate from the counseling course, they're going to want counseling course, they're going to want counseling course, they're going to want to come to you.

to come to you. to come to you. >> Yeah. I mean we are getting a lot of >> Yeah. I mean we are getting a lot of >> Yeah. I mean we are getting a lot of interest from students uh wanting interest from students uh wanting interest from students uh wanting placements with us. Um we've had a few placements with us. Um we've had a few placements with us. Um we've had a few of the students that have volunteered of the students that have volunteered of the students that have volunteered trustees roles. One student who's in the trustees roles. One student who's in the trustees roles. One student who's in the final year um she I think she worked for final year um she I think she worked for final year um she I think she worked for Halifax or someone like that but Halifax or someone like that but Halifax or someone like that but business um the business side of it.

business um the business side of it. business um the business side of it. She's uh agreed to become our business She's uh agreed to become our business She's uh agreed to become our business manager. manager. manager. >> Wonderful. >> Wonderful. >> Wonderful. >> Yeah. So I I I can then get on with the >> Yeah. So I I I can then get on with the >> Yeah. So I I I can then get on with the bigger plans. There'll be someone there bigger plans. There'll be someone there bigger plans. There'll be someone there to run the office. Rosanna and I will to run the office. Rosanna and I will to run the office. Rosanna and I will still be there to make the decisions.

still be there to make the decisions. still be there to make the decisions. Rosanna wants to concentrate on the Rosanna wants to concentrate on the Rosanna wants to concentrate on the counseling side more. And we both counseling side more. And we both counseling side more. And we both eventually want to come because we both eventually want to come because we both eventually want to come because we both have full-time jobs at the moment as have full-time jobs at the moment as have full-time jobs at the moment as well as trying to do this. We want to well as trying to do this. We want to well as trying to do this. We want to step away from them. So our full step away from them. So our full step away from them. So our full attention is on this.

attention is on this. attention is on this. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And so you should. And so how are you >> And so you should. And so how are you >> And so you should. And so how are you getting your message out there? Who are getting your message out there? Who are getting your message out there? Who are you talking to? [laughter] you talking to? [laughter] you talking to? [laughter] >> Um, so >> Um, so >> Um, so last year uh uh before I graduated, I last year uh uh before I graduated, I last year uh uh before I graduated, I was put forward for an award ceremony was put forward for an award ceremony was put forward for an award ceremony within the college.

within the college. within the college. >> Congratulations. >> Congratulations. >> Congratulations. >> Thank you. Um and I didn't know my story >> Thank you. Um and I didn't know my story >> Thank you. Um and I didn't know my story had been put forward. my tutor Rebecca had been put forward. my tutor Rebecca had been put forward. my tutor Rebecca to pull my story forward. And it was to pull my story forward. And it was to pull my story forward. And it was about um things that had happened prior about um things that had happened prior about um things that had happened prior to me joining the army, things that had to me joining the army, things that had to me joining the army, things that had happened while I was in the forces and happened while I was in the forces and happened while I was in the forces and then the homelessness and the addiction then the homelessness and the addiction then the homelessness and the addiction afterwards and then building my life afterwards and then building my life afterwards and then building my life back up. Um so I was put forward for the back up. Um so I was put forward for the back up. Um so I was put forward for the overcoming adversity award um which I um overcoming adversity award um which I um overcoming adversity award um which I um successfully won.

successfully won. successfully won. >> Um and then there a lot of other awards >> Um and then there a lot of other awards >> Um and then there a lot of other awards throughout the night as well. Uh I think throughout the night as well. Uh I think throughout the night as well. Uh I think there was about 14 or 15 in total. Um there was about 14 or 15 in total. Um there was about 14 or 15 in total. Um and then the principal and a group of and then the principal and a group of and then the principal and a group of people get to choose who gets to win the people get to choose who gets to win the people get to choose who gets to win the principal award. And lo and behold, it principal award. And lo and behold, it principal award. And lo and behold, it was me. It was funny. I wasn't expecting was me. It was funny. I wasn't expecting was me. It was funny. I wasn't expecting it. I was sat on the table with um a guy it. I was sat on the table with um a guy it. I was sat on the table with um a guy called Jason and a lady called I think called Jason and a lady called I think called Jason and a lady called I think her name was Alyssa uh from Next. They her name was Alyssa uh from Next. They her name was Alyssa uh from Next. They sponsored the prize money for the sponsored the prize money for the sponsored the prize money for the Overcoming Adversity Award. And I've Overcoming Adversity Award. And I've Overcoming Adversity Award. And I've done some work with Jason um after uh done some work with Jason um after uh done some work with Jason um after uh for my other job in the lighthouse.

for my other job in the lighthouse. for my other job in the lighthouse. >> Right. >> Right. >> Right. >> Um uh so there was those two Rebecca my >> Um uh so there was those two Rebecca my >> Um uh so there was those two Rebecca my tutor my wife my son who was visiting tutor my wife my son who was visiting tutor my wife my son who was visiting from Navy come up for the award ceremony from Navy come up for the award ceremony from Navy come up for the award ceremony and my stepdaughters and I'm talking and my stepdaughters and I'm talking and my stepdaughters and I'm talking away to my son and my wife and my tutor away to my son and my wife and my tutor away to my son and my wife and my tutor both spun the head round once cuz it was both spun the head round once cuz it was both spun the head round once cuz it was it was the leadup to the principal it was the leadup to the principal it was the leadup to the principal award. It's like it's talking about you award. It's like it's talking about you award. It's like it's talking about you like no it's not. don't be dafted. And I like no it's not. don't be dafted. And I like no it's not. don't be dafted. And I carried on talking to my son and my son carried on talking to my son and my son carried on talking to my son and my son would look at me and went, "Dad, he's would look at me and went, "Dad, he's would look at me and went, "Dad, he's talking about you." [laughter] talking about you." [laughter] talking about you." [laughter] It's like, "Nah, don't be silly. It's It's like, "Nah, don't be silly. It's It's like, "Nah, don't be silly. It's not me." And then my name came up and not me." And then my name came up and not me." And then my name came up and spotlight came on. He's like, "What?"

spotlight came on. He's like, "What?" spotlight came on. He's like, "What?" [laughter] [laughter] [laughter] >> And I'd won the principal award. But >> And I'd won the principal award. But >> And I'd won the principal award. But then from that, um, a gentleman called then from that, um, a gentleman called then from that, um, a gentleman called Luke Watson from the Barnes Media team, Luke Watson from the Barnes Media team, Luke Watson from the Barnes Media team, he'd been in touch with a guy from, um, he'd been in touch with a guy from, um, he'd been in touch with a guy from, um, BBC Radio Sheffield who also does BBC Radio Sheffield who also does BBC Radio Sheffield who also does stories for Look North. Um, and they stories for Look North. Um, and they stories for Look North. Um, and they they said, "Oh, we think your story and they said, "Oh, we think your story and they said, "Oh, we think your story and your background and what you're doing is your background and what you're doing is your background and what you're doing is such an achievement and it's a feelood such an achievement and it's a feelood such an achievement and it's a feelood story and we'd like to get it out story and we'd like to get it out story and we'd like to get it out there." Um, there." Um, there." Um, >> so we we ended up doing some >> so we we ended up doing some >> so we we ended up doing some pre-recorded stuff for Look North. Um, pre-recorded stuff for Look North. Um, pre-recorded stuff for Look North. Um, and then on Blue Monday this year, um, I and then on Blue Monday this year, um, I and then on Blue Monday this year, um, I was asked to go to BBC Radio Sheffield was asked to go to BBC Radio Sheffield was asked to go to BBC Radio Sheffield and do a radio show again. I got there.

and do a radio show again. I got there. and do a radio show again. I got there. I thought, "Oh, it's pre-recording. Get I thought, "Oh, it's pre-recording. Get I thought, "Oh, it's pre-recording. Get there for 5 to 7 in the morning." Um, there for 5 to 7 in the morning." Um, there for 5 to 7 in the morning." Um, it's like, "Do you need a drink?" "No, it's like, "Do you need a drink?" "No, it's like, "Do you need a drink?" "No, I'm fine. Can I go to the toilet before I'm fine. Can I go to the toilet before I'm fine. Can I go to the toilet before I go, please?" "Yeah, yeah, that's I go, please?" "Yeah, yeah, that's I go, please?" "Yeah, yeah, that's fine." "Yeah, you'll have you've got a fine." "Yeah, you'll have you've got a fine." "Yeah, you'll have you've got a couple of minutes. You're going live in couple of minutes. You're going live in couple of minutes. You're going live in like 5 minutes." Like, what? [laughter] like 5 minutes." Like, what? [laughter] like 5 minutes." Like, what? [laughter] What do you mean I'm going live? I What do you mean I'm going live? I What do you mean I'm going live? I thought it'd be pre-recorded. No, you're thought it'd be pre-recorded. No, you're thought it'd be pre-recorded. No, you're live this morning.

live this morning. live this morning. Um, so there was that. And as I left Um, so there was that. And as I left Um, so there was that. And as I left that interview, that interview, that interview, um I got a phone call from the TV studio um I got a phone call from the TV studio um I got a phone call from the TV studio in Leeds inviting me up for accounts in Leeds inviting me up for accounts in Leeds inviting me up for accounts chat. chat. chat. >> Um I was like, "Okay, I'll go for that." >> Um I was like, "Okay, I'll go for that."

>> Um I was like, "Okay, I'll go for that." And then um as I was leaving, I was And then um as I was leaving, I was And then um as I was leaving, I was getting pings on my phone. It's like, getting pings on my phone. It's like, getting pings on my phone. It's like, "Just seen you on Look north, mate. Just "Just seen you on Look north, mate. Just "Just seen you on Look north, mate. Just seen you on Look north, mate. Well done. seen you on Look north, mate. Well done. seen you on Look north, mate. Well done. Well done. Didn't realize you gone Well done. Didn't realize you gone Well done. Didn't realize you gone through all that stuff." And it's like, through all that stuff." And it's like, through all that stuff." And it's like, "What do you mean? I'm going up there

Future Plans and Closing Remarks 42:30

"What do you mean? I'm going up there "What do you mean? I'm going up there this afternoon." But they've done the this afternoon." But they've done the this afternoon." But they've done the snippets throughout the day as well as snippets throughout the day as well as snippets throughout the day as well as the couch chat. Um, and then since that the couch chat. Um, and then since that the couch chat. Um, and then since that I was on um the Late Show on radio the I was on um the Late Show on radio the I was on um the Late Show on radio the the other evening. Um, and I've also the other evening. Um, and I've also the other evening. Um, and I've also been on the greatest hits as well. So, been on the greatest hits as well. So, been on the greatest hits as well. So, uh, and it's uh, and it's uh, and it's >> absolute star then.

>> absolute star then. >> absolute star then. >> Yeah. But I mean it it was a shocker for >> Yeah. But I mean it it was a shocker for >> Yeah. But I mean it it was a shocker for me to be honest because it's my it's my me to be honest because it's my it's my me to be honest because it's my it's my story. I I don't think anything of it. story. I I don't think anything of it. story. I I don't think anything of it. Um it's just a series of events I've Um it's just a series of events I've Um it's just a series of events I've gone through in my life and it's like um gone through in my life and it's like um gone through in my life and it's like um and I think the reality hit when the and I think the reality hit when the and I think the reality hit when the Lady Show got in touch and it's like wow Lady Show got in touch and it's like wow Lady Show got in touch and it's like wow I didn't realize my story was that I didn't realize my story was that I didn't realize my story was that powerful for people that things can be powerful for people that things can be powerful for people that things can be overcome. You can change your life overcome. You can change your life overcome. You can change your life around. Um and I never thought it as an around. Um and I never thought it as an around. Um and I never thought it as an inspiration for people either. It to me inspiration for people either. It to me inspiration for people either. It to me it was just it's my life.

it was just it's my life. it was just it's my life. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. [laughter] And that's probably why they want to And that's probably why they want to And that's probably why they want to talk to you because not only have you talk to you because not only have you talk to you because not only have you overcome all these this repeated [ __ ] overcome all these this repeated [ __ ] overcome all these this repeated [ __ ] that's been thrown at you in different that's been thrown at you in different that's been thrown at you in different formats is that you're so humble about formats is that you're so humble about formats is that you're so humble about it.

>> I don't I don't know where that comes >> I don't I don't know where that comes from to be honest. As I say it to me from to be honest. As I say it to me from to be honest. As I say it to me it's just my life. Um regardless of what it's just my life. Um regardless of what it's just my life. Um regardless of what happens or what has happened happens or what has happened happens or what has happened >> it it's made me the person I am today. >> it it's made me the person I am today. >> it it's made me the person I am today. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. >> Um, and I wouldn't be doing RDCS without >> Um, and I wouldn't be doing RDCS without >> Um, and I wouldn't be doing RDCS without it. Um, it. Um, it. Um, as as hard as some people might think it as as hard as some people might think it as as hard as some people might think it is, uh, I think after my story went out is, uh, I think after my story went out is, uh, I think after my story went out on the BBC website as well, um, I'd got on the BBC website as well, um, I'd got on the BBC website as well, um, I'd got an auntie that I'd not spoke to in many an auntie that I'd not spoke to in many an auntie that I'd not spoke to in many years. She got in contact with me years. She got in contact with me years. She got in contact with me saying, "I didn't realize you'd gone saying, "I didn't realize you'd gone saying, "I didn't realize you'd gone through all this. Why didn't you come through all this. Why didn't you come through all this. Why didn't you come and talk to us?" And it's like, "Well, and talk to us?" And it's like, "Well, and talk to us?" And it's like, "Well, I was going through it. There's nothing I was going through it. There's nothing I was going through it. There's nothing you could have said or done that was you could have said or done that was you could have said or done that was that was going to change it.

that was going to change it. that was going to change it. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> but it doesn't define me anymore. >> but it doesn't define me anymore. >> but it doesn't define me anymore. >> No, >> No, >> No, >> I don't dwell on it anymore. >> I don't dwell on it anymore. >> I don't dwell on it anymore. >> Um I know what the plans are for the >> Um I know what the plans are for the >> Um I know what the plans are for the future future future and I know what I've got to do today to and I know what I've got to do today to and I know what I've got to do today to get there. Um there's a phrase I use get there. Um there's a phrase I use get there. Um there's a phrase I use quite often. Um and it helps a lot of my quite often. Um and it helps a lot of my quite often. Um and it helps a lot of my clients as well and a lot of the guys clients as well and a lot of the guys clients as well and a lot of the guys that I support at Lighthouse Homes.

that I support at Lighthouse Homes. that I support at Lighthouse Homes. It doesn't matter how long the journey It doesn't matter how long the journey It doesn't matter how long the journey is. It doesn't matter the size of the is. It doesn't matter the size of the is. It doesn't matter the size of the step you take as long as you're taking step you take as long as you're taking step you take as long as you're taking it in the right direction. it in the right direction. it in the right direction. >> Yeah.

>> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I mean, the guys that I support um >> Yeah. I mean, the guys that I support um >> Yeah. I mean, the guys that I support um in the lighthouse are homeless. Um they in the lighthouse are homeless. Um they in the lighthouse are homeless. Um they do have addiction issues or they're do have addiction issues or they're do have addiction issues or they're recovering from addiction. Um, and when recovering from addiction. Um, and when recovering from addiction. Um, and when I've said they come in and they see me, I've said they come in and they see me, I've said they come in and they see me, but when they've heard my testimony, but when they've heard my testimony, but when they've heard my testimony, it's like, man, I didn't realize you'd it's like, man, I didn't realize you'd it's like, man, I didn't realize you'd gone through all that. It's like, well, gone through all that. It's like, well, gone through all that. It's like, well, is is is >> they're going to listen to you more, >> they're going to listen to you more, >> they're going to listen to you more, aren't they? Surely.

aren't they? Surely. aren't they? Surely. >> Yeah, they do. And some of them have >> Yeah, they do. And some of them have >> Yeah, they do. And some of them have really taken it on board. Um, a lot of really taken it on board. Um, a lot of really taken it on board. Um, a lot of the guys that I've supported personally, the guys that I've supported personally, the guys that I've supported personally, um, have gone on to do college courses, um, have gone on to do college courses, um, have gone on to do college courses, retraining themselves to do things that retraining themselves to do things that retraining themselves to do things that they enjoy, that they want to do. Um, they enjoy, that they want to do. Um, they enjoy, that they want to do. Um, which is which is brilliant to see.

which is which is brilliant to see. which is which is brilliant to see. >> Yeah, >> Yeah, >> Yeah, >> that is such a positive step out of any >> that is such a positive step out of any >> that is such a positive step out of any negative mindset, whether that be negative mindset, whether that be negative mindset, whether that be addiction or anything else, isn't it? If addiction or anything else, isn't it? If addiction or anything else, isn't it? If you can you can you can >> find something >> find something >> find something >> that you want to do and your support to >> that you want to do and your support to >> that you want to do and your support to get going in that until you're get going in that until you're get going in that until you're established.

established. established. >> Oh, what a heartwarming wonderful story. >> Oh, what a heartwarming wonderful story. >> Oh, what a heartwarming wonderful story. >> Is life. [laughter] >> Is life. [laughter] >> Is life. [laughter] Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Yeah. But not everybody Yeah. Yeah. But not everybody Yeah. Yeah. But not everybody has as many significant events in it has as many significant events in it has as many significant events in it >> as you've had. >> as you've had.

>> as you've had. I think from a young age um I think from a young age um I think from a young age um I was always determined to do better I was always determined to do better I was always determined to do better and or I was always did I think my I had and or I was always did I think my I had and or I was always did I think my I had a supervision um at the lighthouse with a supervision um at the lighthouse with a supervision um at the lighthouse with my boss and she said do you know what my boss and she said do you know what my boss and she said do you know what one of you one of your qualities it's one of you one of your qualities it's one of you one of your qualities it's annoying but not in a bad way is you annoying but not in a bad way is you annoying but not in a bad way is you always want to be the best at something always want to be the best at something always want to be the best at something >> and it and it's and it's that drive it's >> and it and it's and it's that drive it's >> and it and it's and it's that drive it's that drive there There is always that drive there There is always that drive there There is always something better and you don't have to something better and you don't have to something better and you don't have to go miles to find it because it's up here go miles to find it because it's up here go miles to find it because it's up here in your head.

in your head. in your head. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> The better place is up here. If you can >> The better place is up here. If you can >> The better place is up here. If you can get in yourself into a better mindset, get in yourself into a better mindset, get in yourself into a better mindset, everything else will fall into a place everything else will fall into a place everything else will fall into a place eventually. eventually. eventually. >> So, how can people reach out and help >> So, how can people reach out and help >> So, how can people reach out and help RDCS and your mission and Rosanna's RDCS and your mission and Rosanna's RDCS and your mission and Rosanna's mission?

mission? mission? >> I mean, we we have a website. Um uh it's >> I mean, we we have a website. Um uh it's >> I mean, we we have a website. Um uh it's rdcs theapy.org.uk. um they can email us. Um there there is um they can email us. Um there there is a WhatsApp number on the website as a WhatsApp number on the website as a WhatsApp number on the website as well. We do have a Facebook page. Um and well. We do have a Facebook page. Um and well. We do have a Facebook page. Um and if if they're wanting to become part of if if they're wanting to become part of if if they're wanting to become part of the the the trustees that we want to get up and trustees that we want to get up and trustees that we want to get up and running, uh they can email us at running, uh they can email us at running, uh they can email us at info@rdcsapy.org.uk info@rdcsapy.org.uk info@rdcsapy.org.uk UK and as I said any help, any advice, UK and as I said any help, any advice, UK and as I said any help, any advice, we will take it on board and we will we will take it on board and we will we will take it on board and we will bring it to fruition.

bring it to fruition. bring it to fruition. >> Wonderful. What does it take a lot to be >> Wonderful. What does it take a lot to be >> Wonderful. What does it take a lot to be a trustee? a trustee? a trustee? >> Um, no. No. The commitments uh a meeting >> Um, no. No. The commitments uh a meeting >> Um, no. No. The commitments uh a meeting once a month uh and an annual general once a month uh and an annual general once a month uh and an annual general meeting once a year and there's tea and meeting once a year and there's tea and meeting once a year and there's tea and coffee thrown in with biscuits.

coffee thrown in with biscuits. coffee thrown in with biscuits. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Sounds like a fair exchange to me. >> Sounds like a fair exchange to me. >> Sounds like a fair exchange to me. >> Yeah. Um, and as I said, any help we can >> Yeah. Um, and as I said, any help we can >> Yeah. Um, and as I said, any help we can get is really, really appreciated. get is really, really appreciated. get is really, really appreciated. >> Well, I can just feel this going from >> Well, I can just feel this going from >> Well, I can just feel this going from strength to strength. You know, your strength to strength. You know, your strength to strength. You know, your determination, the things you've determination, the things you've determination, the things you've overcome, your foresight, overcome, your foresight, overcome, your foresight, >> your relationship, brother and >> your relationship, brother and >> your relationship, brother and sisterhood with Rosanna, so there you're sisterhood with Rosanna, so there you're sisterhood with Rosanna, so there you're not on your own. You're driving forwards not on your own. You're driving forwards not on your own. You're driving forwards together.

together. together. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> They're all just such positive things, >> They're all just such positive things, >> They're all just such positive things, aren't they? and aren't they? and aren't they? and >> you know what you're doing absolutely >> you know what you're doing absolutely >> you know what you're doing absolutely deserves to be out there and supported. deserves to be out there and supported. deserves to be out there and supported. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> I wish you all the very best.

>> I wish you all the very best. >> I wish you all the very best. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> And thank you for coming today.